Another question about Ich

Cribbinator

Cribbinator

Fish are Friends, Not Food
May 26, 2004
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Alpharetta, GA
www.thecribbs.com
Hello,

I had another quick question about Ich. I started doing the salt water treatment for Ich and it looks like it is going pretty good so far. Only three days into it but the 2 Loaches that had the bad case of Ich seem less stressed and show fewer spots. The only problem is that I had 2 other fish that died yesterday. These 2 fish looked perfectly healthy and showed no signs of Ich. What happened ? They died a day after my water change (30%) but I don't know if that could have anything to do with it. Any ideas ? This happened to me a year ago when I had my 2 clown loaches that were sick with Ich, the loaches looked sick with spots and all but 2 other healthy looking fishes just died out of nowhere ?

Also, what causes Ich ? Is it something that forms in the tank or is it something that is brought in with the introduction of new fish ?

Thanks again for all your previous replies, it has been extremely helpful.

Regards,

James
 
Ich is a parasite. It burrows into a fish and lives off the fish for a while, then forms a spore (that white spot), which drops off, incubates on the substrate, and eventually hatches into hundreds of free swimming tomites searching for a host. It is introduced into your tank by a fish that is infected. This is why you should quarantine all fish for at least 4 weeks before introducing them to your main tank. If there's any illness, you should keep them in quarantine for a full 4 weeks after treatment has been completed.

Treatment should include raising the temperature to at least 86 degrees. Water changes should include cleaning the substrate, and you should replace the removed salt. If your tankis prone to evaporation losses, make sure you top off with freshwater to prevent spikes in specific gravity.

The other fish could have had serious infections that were confined to the gill areas. Ich infestations are only visible during one stage, and sometimes not then if the parasites are just in the gills.
 
I'm sorry you lost 2 fish, that's a real bummer. You are treating the ich correctly though, with the addition of salt. Do you have enough salt in the tank? Have you turned up the temperature a bit too, like to 85ish? The heat helps kill ich quicker than salt alone.

The few times I've had ich I did a water change (like 25%) every other day. Perhaps those 2 fish had the ich affecting their gills, rather than showing the typical white spots.

Here's a pretty informative article explaining the life cycle of ich:

http://www.algone.com/ich.htm

Good luck
~Tara
 
Thanks for the replies. That could be the problem. One of the 2 dead fish had about 5 tiny white spots which means she could have easily had it under the gills like you said. Yes the tank is 26 gallons and my salt to water ratio is 2.5tsp to 1 gallon of water. The temp was slowly moved up to 86 degrees (about 2 degress a day). I just don't want my 3 red tails to get infected, they are my favorite fish in the tank, I would be really upset if I lost them.

Orion Girl - Now a question about quarantine. When I introduce new fish what type of quaratine tank could I set up ? I don't have much equipment but if I could do it with a cheap tank for a couples of weeks I wouldn't mind and sounds like a good idea. What are the basics (smallest tank size, filters etc ..) I could get by for a quarantine tank ?

Thanks again for the replies.

James
 
I disagree with the algone article in that it states that Ich has dormant stage or phase, which is not true. There has never been any dormant phase/stage of Ich found. Ich in a tank can be sub-clinical, as a chronic but not visible iinfection/nfestation of the gills (also not mentioned in the article is the fact that the gills are the preferred attachment sites for the parasite). That subclinical infection can erupt into a clinical infection following stress. A subclincal infection is not at all the same as dormant parasite.
 
Here's how I setup a q-tank:

10 gallon tank (have bigger if needed for larger fish).
Small powerhead
Fake plants/easily cleaned and removed decoration/PVC pipe pieces
50 W heater

I run AC filters on most of my tanks, so whenever I need to quarantine something, I pull out one of these sponges, slice an X into one end, and fit it over the intake of the powerhead. The source tank gets a clean, new sponge, and the quarantine gets plenty of bacteria. I use all new fresh water (not water I've removed from an existing tank), bring it to temp, add the sponge, and then add my new animals.

You can substitute a glass tank with any clean tub that will hold water--rubbermaid tubs work well, though get much bigger than about 20 gallons and they won't hold water well. I also have a cover for my tank, to prevent jumpers.

If your filter doesn't allow you to replace just part of the media, you can stash a small sponge over a powerhead, or just in the corner of the tank--it will be colonized by enough bacteria to support a small q-tank.
 
My q-tank is setup in a well lit area so I can observe the fish, but I don't worry about lighting it. Gravel just makes it harder to clean, since detritus can get trapped in between. The only time I've put in substrate is for critters that need to bury themselves to be comfortable, those that will stress and attack their reflection on the bottom or 'walk' along the bottom of the tank, where bare glass offers no traction. For these cases, I put about 1/4 inch of silica sand that I dispose of when I'm done.

The biological filtration is provided with the sponge, and I clean out solid wastes daily instead of worrying about mechanical filtration.
 
I defer to the experts ;)

For a quarantine/hospital tank, I have very little gravel on the bottom... just enough so the fish don't get stressed. Maybe 1/4" or so. It makes it easier to vacuum. The light is just a regular light (20 watt or so?)...

~Tara
 
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