HI, I have a 20 gallon tank that's been doing terribly. I started the tank off with clown loaches (4) on the advice of a store clerk (worse decision ever), they were doing fine for about 2 weeks, the water was great, PH, Ammonia, Nitrate etc were all good. I purchased 6 gold barbs, put them in the tank and my loaches instantly got ich, the worse case I've ever seen of ICH, they died in 3 DAYS!!! The barbs showed no signs of ICH at all... A few weeks and water changes later, I purchased 5 corys. 3 pandas were instantly chewed up by the barbs, they were all de-finned, the other two grey corys (can't remember their names, were fine. Now I have the 6 gold barbs and the 2 grey corys (one of which is showing signs of being nipped) and the ammonia levels (as indicated by Mardel test strips) are off the charts 10.0 (bright pink). I've done water changes with conditioning and vacuumed the gravel to remove any waste/food etc. I can't seem to get the ammonia levels down no matter what I do. Are these high ammonia levels caused by stress from the Barbs nipping the corys? HELP! I love my little corys and don't want them to get ammonia burn. Just today I removed the Gold Barbs for good. What should I do?
Aquarium Problems: HELP!!!
- Thread starter suzabbe
- Start date
I'm wondering if your tank was ever fully cycled....
What does it mean when you say your readings were good? Could you provide some numbers?
When you do the water changes, how much are you removing?
I am assuming you have a filter...
How many inches of gravel do you have in the tank?
What does it mean when you say your readings were good? Could you provide some numbers?
When you do the water changes, how much are you removing?
I am assuming you have a filter...
How many inches of gravel do you have in the tank?
Stress doesn't cause ammonia release. Most likely the exact opposite is happening.
Your Barbs are stressed by the high ammonia levels and may be trying to relieve some of that stress through aggression.
Massive frequent water changes.
Either that or take back the fish and do a fishless cycle.
Your Barbs are stressed by the high ammonia levels and may be trying to relieve some of that stress through aggression.
Massive frequent water changes.
Either that or take back the fish and do a fishless cycle.
I'm guessing you set the tank up for a few days checked the water looked good to you and you put in the clown loaches in for two weeks and then you decided to get more fish at about the time the tank started to spike. What you thought was ich possibly sores from the high anmonia? I think you need to remove the fish and make sure the tank is cycled.
It could have been Ich, since the fish would have been in a stressed and weakened state from the ammonia, they would have been more susceptible to infection. But I doubt that the Ich is what killed them, or that it was the Ich alone.
I too suspect an uncycled tank. Can you provide us with details of exactly what you did from the moment you set the tank up to the first fish? Did you do a fishless cycle? If not, then your tank is almost certainly not cycled.
Don't stress, no one here is going to chew you out for it, most (if not all) of us have gone through the same thing based on bad advice, or misinterpreted advice.
Daily or twice daily water changes will help to get the ammonia levels down. Don't add any new fish, take some back if you can, just ask for store credit, or tell them that you'll happily buy them again, after your tank is cycled.
Don't add more than 3 fish at a time to your tank, after the cycle is completed, and allow at least 1 week to elapse between additions. This will allow your tank's biofilter to adjust to the increase.
I too suspect an uncycled tank. Can you provide us with details of exactly what you did from the moment you set the tank up to the first fish? Did you do a fishless cycle? If not, then your tank is almost certainly not cycled.
Don't stress, no one here is going to chew you out for it, most (if not all) of us have gone through the same thing based on bad advice, or misinterpreted advice.
Daily or twice daily water changes will help to get the ammonia levels down. Don't add any new fish, take some back if you can, just ask for store credit, or tell them that you'll happily buy them again, after your tank is cycled.
Don't add more than 3 fish at a time to your tank, after the cycle is completed, and allow at least 1 week to elapse between additions. This will allow your tank's biofilter to adjust to the increase.
I agree with Happychem. Right now water changes are massively needed. And that means large water changes. Do a 50% change then test for ammonia and nitrites. If the ammonia is still above 1.0 ppm and the nitrite above 0.25 ppm then do another water change. Try to match the temps as close as you can (a few degrees off won't hurt). For the first day you may end up changing out 2 or 3 50% water changes, but eventually this will get the ammonia levels low enough to not harm the fish.
Also while the cories are a good choice for bottom feeder for the 20 gallon tank, stay clear of clown loaches as they really need a 55-75 gallon tank.
Also while the cories are a good choice for bottom feeder for the 20 gallon tank, stay clear of clown loaches as they really need a 55-75 gallon tank.
Great!
Well. To recap the steps I've taken:
After doing some research into aquarium cycles, of course after buying all the stuff (stupid), I read that clown loaches weren't the best choice as starter fish, I should have started with something like Danios or Minnows. After 3 days of cycling the tank (all set with filter, gravel, decor etc.) I put the loaches in.
This is what bothers me the most about the loaches, while I had them, AND after adding the barbs the ammonia levels were good. I use Mardel Test Strips, they read 'safe'. Is this a bad choice?
It was only after I added the corys that the ammonia levels were going nuts in the toxic range! YIKES! (Note: Corys were added after Loaches had been long gone)
I will start tonight and do daily water changes. I also have a few questions, what do you recommend as a water conditioner, AquaSafe, BioSafe, Jungle Ammonia Clear? When I do the these daily water changes should I change the filter bag as well? I have a Whisper Power Filter 20. Should I also vacuum the gravel everyday or leave it as is? Could overfeeding lead to high ammonia?
Thanks so much for your help everyone! A long time ago I had a 10 gallon tank and never had any problems, my fish had one turn of ICH but I managed to clear it. This one's got me concerned. And yes, I don't plan on buying any other fish for a while. I need to get this tank stable.
Well. To recap the steps I've taken:
After doing some research into aquarium cycles, of course after buying all the stuff (stupid), I read that clown loaches weren't the best choice as starter fish, I should have started with something like Danios or Minnows. After 3 days of cycling the tank (all set with filter, gravel, decor etc.) I put the loaches in.
This is what bothers me the most about the loaches, while I had them, AND after adding the barbs the ammonia levels were good. I use Mardel Test Strips, they read 'safe'. Is this a bad choice?
It was only after I added the corys that the ammonia levels were going nuts in the toxic range! YIKES! (Note: Corys were added after Loaches had been long gone)
I will start tonight and do daily water changes. I also have a few questions, what do you recommend as a water conditioner, AquaSafe, BioSafe, Jungle Ammonia Clear? When I do the these daily water changes should I change the filter bag as well? I have a Whisper Power Filter 20. Should I also vacuum the gravel everyday or leave it as is? Could overfeeding lead to high ammonia?
Thanks so much for your help everyone! A long time ago I had a 10 gallon tank and never had any problems, my fish had one turn of ICH but I managed to clear it. This one's got me concerned. And yes, I don't plan on buying any other fish for a while. I need to get this tank stable.
For the first couple of weeks feed only every other day. This will help keep ammonia levels down low and won't hurt the fish. Do daily water changes and use any water conditioner you wish. Just make sure it treats chlorine and or chloramine if you have that as well.
Do not change the filter media. That is where most of the good bacteria lives and changing it only restarts the cycle. Even when the tank is fully cycled and running smoothly you shouldn't change that out. With every water change take the filter cartridge out and rinse it in the old removed tank water to clean it up and reuse it. Only when it strats to fall apart should you change it.
You didn't notice ammonia build up but it was there and ready to spike. It just happened to coincide with the additon of the cories.
I use a drop method to test for ammonia but the strips should be fine for you for now.. Just make sure to keep every thing in the safe zone and do enough water changes to get it down there.
Do not change the filter media. That is where most of the good bacteria lives and changing it only restarts the cycle. Even when the tank is fully cycled and running smoothly you shouldn't change that out. With every water change take the filter cartridge out and rinse it in the old removed tank water to clean it up and reuse it. Only when it strats to fall apart should you change it.
You didn't notice ammonia build up but it was there and ready to spike. It just happened to coincide with the additon of the cories.
I use a drop method to test for ammonia but the strips should be fine for you for now.. Just make sure to keep every thing in the safe zone and do enough water changes to get it down there.
Large-scale and frequent water changes are the best defense against the spikes. The figures already mentioned - 1 ppm ammonia max and .5 (or less) nitrite max -- are good.
Note that some water conditioners, particularly Amquel, Ammo-Lock 2 and Prime will give you false results with most standard ammonia tests. A simple dechlorinator should not interfere with your testing.
Food reduction is also a good idea, as is regular gravel cleaning to remove food/poop that will break down and get converted into ammonia. Make sure you don't add any additional fish until your tank is cycled, and then add slowly, one or two at a time, several weeks apart.
I don't recall anything about filtration... what sort of filter are you using?
HTH,
Jim
Note that some water conditioners, particularly Amquel, Ammo-Lock 2 and Prime will give you false results with most standard ammonia tests. A simple dechlorinator should not interfere with your testing.
Food reduction is also a good idea, as is regular gravel cleaning to remove food/poop that will break down and get converted into ammonia. Make sure you don't add any additional fish until your tank is cycled, and then add slowly, one or two at a time, several weeks apart.
I don't recall anything about filtration... what sort of filter are you using?
HTH,
Jim
I have a few comments on your responses suzabbe,
Firstly, don't debase yourself for not having known something. Ignorance is not something to be ashamed of, admitting that you don't know something, or made a mistake through it, is not unique to you. By admitting it and seeking knowledge, you prevent future mistakes. The only shame is in continued ignorance because one is too proud or ashamed to ask, admitting their ignorance.
Okay, enough philosophising...
1 - When you say that you cycled your tank for 3 days before putting the loaches in, what do you mean. Simply filling the tank with water and running it is not cycling. In order to cycle a tank, there must be an ammonia source, this can be either fish or pure ammonia added in small, measured doses.
2 - What does "good" mean? For me, and probably everyone here, a "good" level of ammonia is 0ppm. Anything higher than, oh, 0.1ppm is too high.
3 - Call your local water company or go to their website. Get a printout (or download) a copy of the water report, this will tell you how much of what compounds are coming through your tap, on average. Also find out if they treat with chloramine or chlorine only. If they add chloramine as well, make sure that your water treatment of choice can neutralize it. If it's just chlorine, well, you're set.
Take your time, things are slow to sort themselves out. There are lots of people here who will be more than happy to help you work through the trials of the upcomming months, but before you know it, you'll have a beautiful tank looking just the way you like it.
Then a month later, you'll decide to change something.
Then a little later, you'll decide that you need another, bigger, tank...
Firstly, don't debase yourself for not having known something. Ignorance is not something to be ashamed of, admitting that you don't know something, or made a mistake through it, is not unique to you. By admitting it and seeking knowledge, you prevent future mistakes. The only shame is in continued ignorance because one is too proud or ashamed to ask, admitting their ignorance.
Okay, enough philosophising...
1 - When you say that you cycled your tank for 3 days before putting the loaches in, what do you mean. Simply filling the tank with water and running it is not cycling. In order to cycle a tank, there must be an ammonia source, this can be either fish or pure ammonia added in small, measured doses.
2 - What does "good" mean? For me, and probably everyone here, a "good" level of ammonia is 0ppm. Anything higher than, oh, 0.1ppm is too high.
3 - Call your local water company or go to their website. Get a printout (or download) a copy of the water report, this will tell you how much of what compounds are coming through your tap, on average. Also find out if they treat with chloramine or chlorine only. If they add chloramine as well, make sure that your water treatment of choice can neutralize it. If it's just chlorine, well, you're set.
Take your time, things are slow to sort themselves out. There are lots of people here who will be more than happy to help you work through the trials of the upcomming months, but before you know it, you'll have a beautiful tank looking just the way you like it.
Then a month later, you'll decide to change something.
Then a little later, you'll decide that you need another, bigger, tank...