best fluke treatment? :help:

I used Prazi For Gill Flukes specifically.

As far as salt and heat, I've never found any evidence that it works on Flukes, Likewise Salt Dips may work on the actual living flukes on the fish, but do nothing for the well protected eggs.

Clout has never done anything for me but kill my fish which I guess would take care of the flukes but I don't think that would be the best option. Clout contains Trichlorfon which would be it's effective med against Flukes, and you already know how well that is working.

Dave
 
daveedka said:
I used Prazi For Gill Flukes specifically.

As far as salt and heat, I've never found any evidence that it works on Flukes, Likewise Salt Dips may work on the actual living flukes on the fish, but do nothing for the well protected eggs.

Clout has never done anything for me but kill my fish which I guess would take care of the flukes but I don't think that would be the best option. Clout contains Trichlorfon which would be it's effective med against Flukes, and you already know how well that is working.

Dave
Click to expand...
I've haven't experienced any death attributable to dosing with clout, perhaps your deaths were due to another factor other than the med.
Clout is effective against flukes at all stages except in the egg, the eggs are resistant to most meds.
Newly hatched larvae are very suseptible to heat/salt as are adults.
Elevated salinity and heat is a very effective tool in combating flukes and other parasites.

The problem experienced with the repeat infection was due to the eggs not being killed, a lack of continued treatment with Trifon led to the situation.
The cycle must be broken, simple salt/heat will kill newly hatched fluke larvae.

As for how well the Trifon worked (apparently very well on the adults the first round) or is working (not so well, second round)...
According to JJohns the Prazi did nothing for him in the first place...
Go figure.

JJohns if the Prazi didn't work in the first place and the Trifon isn't working now then I think that perhaps it is time to try Formalin/Malachite Green and if successful against the adults follow up with salt/heat for three weeks.
Your between a rock and a hard place, the flukes 'will' kill your fish and the continued medication 'may' kill your fish.
You've nothing to lose but flukes at this point.
 
I did use Prazi last night and so far, this morning they do not look any worse (which was not the case with trichlorfon). I think it is too early to know if they will get better or not with this treatment. I will watch them closely going into the weekend and see if I can note any improvement on them. I could tell that they like the Prazi in the water better than the formalin/malachite green. They seem less stressed, which is good and I know that Prazi is suppose to be really gentle on the fish. So, I will wait and see what happens over the next couple of days. I should see gradual improvement and if not after 3 days, or if I see worsening symptoms again, then I will move on to the formalin treatment and give it a try. When flukes can acquire a resistance to meds, it makes it hard to get rid of them for good. I may increase the salt and heat slightly and see if that helps also. I did try increased salt by itself really early on, and the fish didn't like it and it didn't seem to do anything for the flukes. I also found info on the web supporting that. I did salt water dips with some of them and it knocked off some flukes & stripped the fish's slime coat so the meds could get at the flukes better. But, it didn't actually kill the flukes that were still in the water. Here are links to two articles that mention treating for many parasites with salt (which works very effectively in most cases), but that it doesn't kill flukes and meds have to be in that case: http://www.geocities.com/koifla/try_salt_first.htm

http://www.ponddoc.com/WhatsUpDoc/FishHealth/FlashDance.htm

But, I do use salt for ich and chilodonella and have had great success.
 
The Fluke Case that I used Prazi On Was with fish Who HAd gone through a 2+ week treatment of Salt and heat for ich. The salt cleared theich easily, But did nothing for the Flukes (Evidently) Salt is pretty limited in it's actusl uses against parasites despite the claims by Doc Wellfish and half of the LFS employees out there. I ahve been searching all morning and have found nothing that shows how Salt kills flukes, and have yet to find any studies or factual documentation to support the idea. This does not mean that salt does nothing against Flukes, It only means I haven't been able to find any real documentation aside from folks saying it works. Likewise My experience was that the salt did not kill Flukes.

When I researched and Discovered prazi Way back when, I never once saw anyone claim Salt would work, I posted on 3 different Websites, And googled for well over a week of evenings. Not once was salt mentioned as an effective Cure. At that time Fluke Tabs were the predominant Known Cure and prazi was billed as being the new method which was less harsh but hadn't been tested well yet.



As far as Clout Killing Fish, It's pretty harsh. It Contains Trichlorfon, as well as a few other ingredients that will stress fish pretty seriously. I have not used Clout for years since those experiences, And I did have some sensative fish that I was dealing with (Mostly Cats, and some Juvie Cichlids) but to my knowledge the make-up has not changed. To me there is no sense in using a combo med when you have an identified ailment. Either way there is no doubt that the Clout will be Just as effective as the Trichlorfon since it's the same things as far as flukes go.

Dave
 
JJohn, I've been searching for alternative treatments for knocking down severe infestations on the fish.
One states that one hour baths/dips in either Prazi at its highest dosage or Trichlorphon dosed at up to 10x's will kill any adults on the fish, then to continue with in-tank treatments in order to stop newly hatched eggs.

Worth a try perhaps.
 
The fish don't seem to be responding as quickly to the Prazi as I had hoped. I lost another one this morning and I still have some scratching. I think I will do another good cleaning tonight and water change and start with the formalin treatment. I think the couple days of formalin/malachite green treatment that I did seems to have made quite a bit of the slime on the fish disappear and I think did the most to get rid of the adults on their bodies. I will look at them again tonight and think about continuing with the Prazi, but I just don't think that it is strong enough, and I did more than the recommended dosage as well.
 
I have been doing a lot of reading about curing parasites as I believe my gouramis are infected and there is a lot of anecdotal evidence that feeding garlic may help the fish fight off parasites. If anything it does no harm and helps boost the immune system. I am going to be trying it with my fish as I want to try and avoid bombarding them with further medication if possible. Might be soemthing to consider in your case, if nothing else, it is cheap and won't do any harm.
 
I was doing some research on the internet about flukes, and Prazi and best treatment options, etc. What I read on at least 2 different pond websites, was that Prazi in combination with malachite green/formalin is a so called "Silver Bullet" and will kill just about any parasite that the fish has. One website talked about mixing prazi powder with Pro-form C (malachite green/formalin) just to get the powder to dissolve--the directions with the prazi actually recommended it. And, Hakari, the makers of Prazi-Pro, have a link on their website that says "Excellent When Used With Ich-X" which is formalin/safer salt of malachite green combo. Here is the link to the ad: http://www.uskoi.com/prazipro.htm

I think it is funny, because on the back of the prazi-pro bottle, it says do not combine with any other drugs or meds. But, Hikari's website recommends otherwise. Also, like I said, several pond websites recommend the combo since when in powder form, prazi is really hard to dissolve. So, I am thinking of getting myself some more Prazi-pro to continue treatment, and maybe use in combo with formalin/malachite green at the recommended dose and see if that will knock the flukes out. I wonder if I would get better results with that? I tried them in combo in one of my tanks last night (not the main one I was trying to treat but another one that I am worried about contaminating from the first one). I noticed one or two fish in that tank that were questionable and when I saw one flash quickly, I knew I had to act fast so I don't end up with a catastrophe like in my big tank that I am dealing with. I treated last night with Prazi in combo with quick cure (malachite green/formalin) and they seemed fine last night and no flashing after adding it. The two fish that were breathing heavy seemed more responsive this morning, but didn't see them eat yet. So, I will watch that tank very closely over the next few days, and if all looks well, I will stick with the combo treatment.

I have to go on a trip and will be gone for a week (leaving in about 1 1/2 to 2 weeks). So, I am thinking of doing the combo treatment up till that point. And, during the week that I am gone, just leaving the prazi in there. Either Prazi or trichlorfon (which was not working for me as of late) are the 2 that are passive treatments that you can dose and leave for a few days without being there to add meds or do water changes every day. That is what I need while I am gone, so if the prazi is working by then, that is what I will do.

The fish in my main tank that I am having problems with, responded good to the prazi after I cranked up the heat yesterday. The heavy slime disappeared off them (still a couple noticeable spots though) but some were still flashing which bothers me. That tells me that there are adult flukes still attached to the fish. Prazi is suppose to be fast working and sometimes only 2 days is needed to kill flukes from the fish (longer of course for emerging larvae from the eggs). So, maybe I should dose higher than the recommended? I am trying to give it time, but have been treating with Prazi since Thursday. I know it is hard to overdose that stuff because it is gentle. I have left in the sponge filters in the tank, but there is no carbon present, and I scrubbed the glass and vacuumed the gravel very well. I emptied the tank except for a couple decorations for the fish to hide in if need be. So, I don't know what else to do? I hope the combo treatment works. Some have suggested a synergistic effect with the combo of Prazi, malachite green and formalin.
 
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