Betta Setup

[Rbishop]

Any fish will "adapt" to poor water conditions. The down side is poor physical developement, weakened immune system, stress, and a premature death.

 

[Kyohti]

Do you mean one cubic foot vice one square foot? Which would seem reasonable.

One cubic foot of protected territory equates to 7.48 gallons, FYI.

I couldn't tell you how deep they take their territories to... all I know is that the very largest turf they will profect is about a square foot of surface water, usually half that... especially in the dry season!!

I know I've seen footage of people in some asian country (wasn't mentioned) who were keeping and breeding bettas in a backyard pond and you could see them down in the water between the reeds and lily pads darting about, warding others away from their space. Some had larger circles, some smaller. And it seemed like there was this 'unspoken for' area between each spot that wasn't as heavily guarded... like "you can pass through the edge of my kingdom--as long as you didn't stop to admire the scenery!"

I never figured out how they managed to catch the fish from the pond, either, as it was in another language.

I saw it online forever ago. It was really kind of neat and informative. I wish I still had the link for it.

 

[mee-mee]

very well info that everyone could use

Kyoti, I agree with you 100% on everything you said. When i was in my younger or mid 20's I had a 20 extra high (not sure of why they called it that), but I had a male ruby fan tail that lasted almost 3 years ( named him ruby) ,he has succumbed to too much torture from the black molly:mad2: I had had. Came home one day and there he was, I was very sad. And then I got another betta which was torqouise (named him turkey). Had him for almost 3 years also. I would keep up on the water changes, every other week so as my other fish would be healthy also. I always took him out and put him in a bowl (at that time i had an underground water filtration system:huh: ),just to make sure he was safe. When the time came for feeding he would be the first one to the top. Turkey would nibble at my fingers and swim around and through them. And I would even let him nibble off of a preztel stick once a month. He really seems to enjoy the treat of that. Then one day he got a hold of a neon tetra and I didn't notice. Was busy watching t.v. and then i looked becuz he was splashing at the top of the tank. Pale blue and there was the neon in his mouth, i pulled him out and took the neon out, he seemed saved but not enought oxygen and i lost him the same night. So i was heart broken. and that was the last time i had a fish tank. was to disturbed to get any for along time now. and now we have a 80 gallon bowfront (weeser's sig) and i watch my babies very carefully. some time soon we are going to get a 20 gallon so i can have another betta. Really miss having one. Will do lots of research as to what can go with them. Thank you soo much . P.S. female bettas will only attack a male if the female is ready to mate and he isnt learned that from straight hand experience have your females done that at all....:dance2:

 

[Rbishop]

Well I would hazard that most large profitable breeders are commercial, in tanks 3-5 ft wide. 2 ft deep, and several feet long, like 80-100. Very similar to angel tanks.

Keeping wild caught/bred bettas out of the discussion, the mass marketing of bettas would erode the theory of how they are in a natural environment.

3x3x8...inches...about 1/3 of a gallon...40+ ounces of water...with out the one square foot (12") of space to swim in the purported natural habitat.

and then add on no filtration based on stagnant dry water season that they were never in.

Amazing.

 

[Kyohti]

Any fish will "adapt" to poor water conditions. The down side is poor physical developement, weakened immune system, stress, and a premature death.

*chuckles* Oh poo... people here act like all fish in existence live by one golden rule!! you can't tell me that a betta is as delicate to keep as a killifish... or a tetra or a gourami or a discus or goldfish or whatever!! Some are more adaptable than others.

Otherwise fishkeeping would've been near impossible before we created a means of measuring and monitoring water perimeters!!! We are growing and adapting in our knowledge about the hobby every day... but people were keeping and breeding and developing fish for this hobby LONG before we had the luxury of being so picky about the water or had the opportunity to do for fish what we can today.

And it can generally be said that fish, like most animals, prefer the best possible conditions before spawning... so since most common community fish kept in the last 20 years or so aren't wild caught, that means someone is doing something right on a regular basis. ^_^;;

You people can be so serious... it's not life or death for fish to live in a slightly higher pH or water with a hardness that isn't akin to their natural habitat. Again... its not bad, it's just different. And bettas are hardy enough that from what I've seen, they don't mind all that much.

 

[Kyohti]

P.S. female bettas will only attack a male if the female is ready to mate and he isnt learned that from straight hand experience have your females done that at all....:dance2:

Malarky. Females can be every bit as aggressive as males UNLESS they are willing to breed. They demonstrate this by tilting their heads down in a submissive pose and doing a color change that shows vertical (not horizontal) stripes on their body. Horizontal stripes are a sign of stress, aggitation, and extreme submission. My aunt had a beautiful male betta in a long 55 gallon tank. She bought a female and dropped it into the tank without knowing any better. Her male had several huge chunks taken out of his fins before the female showed any sign of submission.

He barely survived the secondary infection and fin rot that ensued this and his fins never grew back correctly. The female had damage to her body and fins, too. They stayed together in the tank for a few weeks, the female finally showing horizontal stripes in defeat. Then it got to the point that everytime she came up to feed or get air, he'd chase her. I had a talk with my aunt when she explained what was happening one week over the phone. I gave her a 2.5 gallon hex I had spare at the time for the female. She colored back up and both were fine after that in their own separate tanks.

From my time breeding them and keeping them, I can assure you that females can be every bit as nasty and really shouldn't be kept with males. That's like putting a small goldfish in a tank with a known bully... you'd make either one miserable by trying.

 

[Rbishop]

They don't mind....unbelievable.

I never said they were delicate.
I did not say they were not adaptable, actually stated most fish were adaptable.

So now that we have the capability to understand and provide better conditions, we don't need to because ones in the wild don't have the same access?

they don't mind all that much. I'll wait to hear one of them tell me that vice them being subjected to some one else's forced conditions due to their situation being forced on them.

 

[mee-mee]

i stand corrected

Females can be every bit as aggressive as males UNLESS they are willing to breed. quote"" i stand corrected of course that is what the lfs said at the time. so he or she had it backwards. thanks for the correction

 

[Kyohti]

They don't mind....unbelievable.

I never said they were delicate.
I did not say they were not adaptable, actually stated most fish were adaptable.

So now that we have the capability to understand and provide better conditions, we don't need to because ones in the wild don't have the same access?

they don't mind all that much. I'll wait to hear one of them tell me that vice them being subjected to some one else's forced conditions due to their situation being forced on them.

You're just being so very negative and condescending about every opinion you've posted... that's all. Like it's life or death for any fish to be in water that wasn't siphoned directly from it's native habitat or something. You even speak of their adaptability as if it's them 'suffering' and 'enduring' these conditions. You say you'll reserve your opinion until you hear them say they don't mind... and I say I'll do the same until one tells me otherwise.

I'm just saying that most animals, especially fish, don't like breeding in unfavorable conditions. They show poor color quality and tend to show behavioral signs of aggitation, distress, and general ill health. Not always, true... but if you know how a species usually acts and you're an observant individual, you can generally tell if something is ailing a fish.

And from my countless hours of observation and care of mine, I rarely saw signs of them being discontent... and if I did, I worked to correct the problem. I think asking anything more of a person is silly. We can't read their minds... we can never know for sure... so we can only do what seems right to them and trust our own good judgement and the helpful advice of others.

But this is neither here nor there. This particular conversation is being disruptive of this thread. If you'd like to continue the discussion further, just PM me. I hate filling someone else's topic with debate.

 

[Rbishop]

We are not filling someone elses thread with debate.

We are providing opposing points of view for someone to draw a conclusion on.

You state...they don't mind all that much. but... We can't read their minds...