Can I use my Aquarium Ferts on my Tomatoes?
- Thread starter naturegrl
- Start date
Most folks that have troubles with tomatoes they grow at home tend to have issues with watering (too much, or too little, regardless of genetic varieties, however some are far more tolerant than others). This, much more than the issue of what is in the aquarium water(fertilizers), is the point I was making.
No, the aquarium ferts are not the same.
They lack NH4 specifically. Folks would just use Miracle grow otherwise......... and you can be in tiny amounts and it's like playing with fire(NH4 is a good aquatic toxicant and at high enough levels, kills plants good also). NO3 is pretty much non toxic by comparison. So they use KNO3 as source if they use CO2 typically, not NH4 other than tiny trace amounts as fish waste.
They do not cost more than the terrestrial ferts, typically much less because they are bought in bulk, not name brands. KNO3 and KH2PO4 cost 3$ a lb, which in a lot less than little bottle of Miracle grow last time I was a store. If you bought Seachem, then yep, cost a lot less in that case, but I think anyone that wants to save $ on ferts uses the bulk DIY salts.
A few do not, but we try and educate them to use the bulk ferts.
The red splotches on the roads are "vegan road kill"
Hippies killing the veggies!
Regards,
Tom Barr
Tom,
Watering vegetables is a tricky business. There is a lot of studies that have been done to evaluate the optimal moisture conditions for maximum yields. Many of these are contradictory. It's a complex mixture of soil type, humidity, temperature, and light levels. Oh and don't forget the GENETIC component that is generally ignored in the literature. These all effect how much moisture the plant requires at any given time. Basically if you have a hard time growing tomatoes start out with Cherry tomatoes. They are very close to the wild type and have very broad adaptability and tolerances for black thumbs. Stay away from the big beefsteak varieties unless you can grow other tomatoes first.
I wasn't saying use Miracle Grow or Peters in aquariums. You are correct that they do have different formulations. The OP asked if they could use the aquarium mix as fertilizer for their tomatoes not using miracle grow for their aquatic plants. Obviously using a fertilizer with and N source of ammonium nitrate (NH4NO3) is a good way way to kill of all of your fish and inverts.
For use with the tomatoes NH4, NO2, and NO3 are all good. NO2 is actually the preferred formulation which has always surprised me. So basically be careful with your tanks but your tomatoes will take any food that you give them.
Mixing your own ferts from the salts is of course the cheapest way to get them. On the downside it is more complicated than using the premix's. Most of the people on this forum us the premix Flourish etc. I do as well mostly because I'm lazy about it, I'm also patient enough to wait for the plants to grow slower. Then again I only have one low light planted tank at this point. Not much need of ferts to start with.
Hippie road kill -- LOL. I've been just about hit a few times by those things flying off the truck driving up Mace Blvd from my job. The drivers get paid by the load. The more loads they do in a day the more money they make. I've seen them going 75mph in a 55 zone way too often.
Watering vegetables is a tricky business. There is a lot of studies that have been done to evaluate the optimal moisture conditions for maximum yields. Many of these are contradictory. It's a complex mixture of soil type, humidity, temperature, and light levels. Oh and don't forget the GENETIC component that is generally ignored in the literature. These all effect how much moisture the plant requires at any given time. Basically if you have a hard time growing tomatoes start out with Cherry tomatoes. They are very close to the wild type and have very broad adaptability and tolerances for black thumbs. Stay away from the big beefsteak varieties unless you can grow other tomatoes first.
I wasn't saying use Miracle Grow or Peters in aquariums. You are correct that they do have different formulations. The OP asked if they could use the aquarium mix as fertilizer for their tomatoes not using miracle grow for their aquatic plants. Obviously using a fertilizer with and N source of ammonium nitrate (NH4NO3) is a good way way to kill of all of your fish and inverts.
For use with the tomatoes NH4, NO2, and NO3 are all good. NO2 is actually the preferred formulation which has always surprised me. So basically be careful with your tanks but your tomatoes will take any food that you give them.
Mixing your own ferts from the salts is of course the cheapest way to get them. On the downside it is more complicated than using the premix's. Most of the people on this forum us the premix Flourish etc. I do as well mostly because I'm lazy about it, I'm also patient enough to wait for the plants to grow slower. Then again I only have one low light planted tank at this point. Not much need of ferts to start with.
Hippie road kill -- LOL. I've been just about hit a few times by those things flying off the truck driving up Mace Blvd from my job. The drivers get paid by the load. The more loads they do in a day the more money they make. I've seen them going 75mph in a 55 zone way too often.
Well that was all fantastic info. Still not sure what type of tomatoes I have, determinate or in... but I have noticed a bunch of the flowers seem to be turning brown and dying off. I think I've been watering too much. I have a bunch of fruit on all three plants but they haven't started ripening yet. I'll leave the aquarium ferts to the aquarium and cut back my watering a bit. Hopefully the soil will take care of any nutrients and the fish tank water will supliment. They really look great so far, so I'm afraid to start adding ferts and risk ruining them. The dying buds were a little concerning but there is a bunch of fruit so hopefully we're safe.
Really appreciate the info guys. I'll check in later with a progress report.
Tina
Really appreciate the info guys. I'll check in later with a progress report.
Tina
Amen!
Is it really more complex?
I add 3-4 things, same with brand name stuff.
I have to read instructions and ask questions for the brand name stuff right?
Same deal with KNO3, GH booster(mix of Ca/Mg/K), KH2PO4 and a trace mix. Folks still have to follow directions.
The chem names seem to "scare" folks, jargon etc. I was no different a 15 years ago myself. But it's no more complicated than making cookies or something, perhaps less so.
EI is a method I used to reduce the complexity and removed the requirements for test kits, add 1/4 teaspoon of KNO3 2-3 x a week etc, do a water change.
Easier than anything, cost nothing virtually and highly effective.
Once you do it 1-2x it becomes "old hat", boring really.
Folks with zero chemistry background, even my 7 year old nephew..... do it with ease.
Fish waste can do it just fine in that case, and/or sediment ferts.
Point is, you have a different goal than others may, and are wise enough to accept the factor of being lazy. I get that way and am less motivated, so I reduce the light and slow the growth rates and do not focus on aquatic gardening much. When I feel like gardening, I increase light and care.
People for the ethical treatment of plants(PETP) protest every year.
How'd you like to be chopped in 1/2 every week? Flung from a truck at 75 mph to splatter your innards upon the gravely road? If they did that with kittens or puppies...........good old warped selective logic.
I think we have had many of the same classes at UCD:clap:
I'm glad I'm done with that part.
Regards,
Tom Barr
Tina,
I'd focus more on a web site that addresses tomato horticulture for the home grower. The tank water is idea for the water source vs say tap.........no Chlorine or choramines, which are not good for organic production and bacterial communities in soil. Compared to the fert concentrations for terrestrial or hydroponics, the aquarium water is at the most 1/5 or less that of a typical fert solution used for terrestrial growth.
Over watering causes anaerobic conditions and this kills off many species of bacteria and fungi, aquatic plants are highly adapted, tomatoes, even the resistant types are nowhere near as good as say Rice or Taro, wild rice etc and much worse than the submersed species.
Aquatic plants have very good ways of pumping O2 into the root zones of even the most anaerobic soils. They have no choice living where they do.
If you use Aquatic plants, and focus on their growth/needs, then the amount of O2 they add to sediment is massive. This increases cycling in the aquarium, and the rates of growth increased, you can compost or better yet, sell the aquatic plants via mail/net. Then upgrade the tomato system you have for the funds or pay for the aquarium cost etc.
I use all my wastewater from aquariums on all my landscaping, not a drop heads down the drain.
Use and reuse, recycling, composting etc, you really can do a lot there.
For aquariums, water, trash, food, for horticulture, vermiculture etc.
My aquariums are self sustaining $ wise. The $ spent on electric and ferts/CO2 is less now than the $ is get from selling the plants.
Labor is much more reasonable with plants, but not factored in, breeding fish is far more labor intensive as hobby. I harvest every 1-2 weeks and get about 50$ worth each time.
Not bad I figure. I think it's more an issue of the fun of growing plants more than the $ issues whether it's for food, hobbies like aquatic plants etc. But if you can get some $ from it, super!
Agriculture extensions are excellent resources and better than other info on the web typically.
http://extension.missouri.edu/publications/DisplayPub.aspx?P=G6461
http://www.ctahr.hawaii.edu/oc/freepubs/pdf/HGV-5.pdf
http://ohioline.osu.edu/hyg-fact/1000/1624.html
http://ceplacer.ucdavis.edu/files/11086.pdf
These can be trusted more than most.
Tank water is 1/5 or less most hydroponic's solution and absent in NH4.
Otherwise ....it's exellent and better than tap.
Regards,
Tom Barr
I'd focus more on a web site that addresses tomato horticulture for the home grower. The tank water is idea for the water source vs say tap.........no Chlorine or choramines, which are not good for organic production and bacterial communities in soil. Compared to the fert concentrations for terrestrial or hydroponics, the aquarium water is at the most 1/5 or less that of a typical fert solution used for terrestrial growth.
Over watering causes anaerobic conditions and this kills off many species of bacteria and fungi, aquatic plants are highly adapted, tomatoes, even the resistant types are nowhere near as good as say Rice or Taro, wild rice etc and much worse than the submersed species.
Aquatic plants have very good ways of pumping O2 into the root zones of even the most anaerobic soils. They have no choice living where they do.
If you use Aquatic plants, and focus on their growth/needs, then the amount of O2 they add to sediment is massive. This increases cycling in the aquarium, and the rates of growth increased, you can compost or better yet, sell the aquatic plants via mail/net. Then upgrade the tomato system you have for the funds or pay for the aquarium cost etc.
I use all my wastewater from aquariums on all my landscaping, not a drop heads down the drain.
Use and reuse, recycling, composting etc, you really can do a lot there.
For aquariums, water, trash, food, for horticulture, vermiculture etc.
My aquariums are self sustaining $ wise. The $ spent on electric and ferts/CO2 is less now than the $ is get from selling the plants.
Labor is much more reasonable with plants, but not factored in, breeding fish is far more labor intensive as hobby. I harvest every 1-2 weeks and get about 50$ worth each time.
Not bad I figure. I think it's more an issue of the fun of growing plants more than the $ issues whether it's for food, hobbies like aquatic plants etc. But if you can get some $ from it, super!
Agriculture extensions are excellent resources and better than other info on the web typically.
http://extension.missouri.edu/publications/DisplayPub.aspx?P=G6461
http://www.ctahr.hawaii.edu/oc/freepubs/pdf/HGV-5.pdf
http://ohioline.osu.edu/hyg-fact/1000/1624.html
http://ceplacer.ucdavis.edu/files/11086.pdf
These can be trusted more than most.
Tank water is 1/5 or less most hydroponic's solution and absent in NH4.
Otherwise ....it's exellent and better than tap.
Regards,
Tom Barr
