Can't seem to get nitrite any lower

I am not offended, like everyone seems to be debating here rather than arguing, so please dont think that I am 'saying' my posts in a mean 'tone of voice' either.

However, you can fishless cycle with a lot of methods, of which I really agree with rbishop's fishless cycling 'sticky' on this site. I also would disagree in that just because fish are in a different country, they still require the same needs. I also know that methods and product availability is different, but I felt that as it applies to MollyFan's questions here in this thread, there was a lot of advice that was just not the best and until now, no one has said anything about if she has access to ammonia or not. My point is not to debunk you or anyone, but try to help out MollyFan and in a lot of ways, I cannot believe that no one pointed out that her test results had something wrong with them.

I have traveled at least half way across the world so far, and live for almost three years in Germany, and so I know that keeping fish is pretty similar there as it is here. I also know that we all have access to nearly any product via the internet. I can buy a bottle of ammonia here in the US for less than an american dollar, so I am sure I could ship you some for less than 10 dollars, US, if you needed some. My point being, if you are not ready to sit by your tank quite a bit, or test daily mid-cycle, you shouldnt really be using fish to cycle a tank. I realize that in the past, people did this all the time, because they did not know better, but now days, it just seems contradictory to me for people to have the same huge problems over and over again and not want to accept the fact that it would be best to just take the fish back to a LFS and keep adding fish food to the tank until it is ready. I know we can get attached to fish, I certainly am to mine, but I would rather miss them but know they are still alive rather than risk their deaths. Know what I mean?
 
Our Australian Customs are extreamly stringent. I enquired to try to get Bio Spira here but was informed that wasn't worth the hassle. Any type of bacteria importation needs to apprently go through a regulating body. Not to sure about ammonia though.
 
BioSpira is not the end all, be all anyways and you do not truly need it. It is much more of a bacteria 'culture' than it is full blown bacteria. I cycled all my tanks without it and only use it when or more like IF I have a mini-cycle, which hasnt happened to me since I figured out what I was doing.

I really think the best thing to do, if you are going to cycle with fish, is to test your tank on a daily basis. You should almost always have ammonia, nitrite, and nitrates in a tank after the first couple of weeks. The bacteria in your tank comes naturally and you dont have to add it at all, although it helps to put in a bacteria culture or some filter media or substrate from another tank to get a 'jump start' on things. I find MollyFan's test results odd becuase she has had fish in the tank for a couple of weeks and so she should have some ammonia in there and much higher nitrates if there are nitrites in the tank. I am making this statement based upon the info that I know, so of course, there could be other reasons for tests like this, including it being a cycled tank and her water source has nitrites in it to begin with.

I certainly would not just 'let things go' because like I said, unhealthy water can cause problems to your fish that you cannot see. I feel that the goal should be to keep a fish in a situation in which it can live the longest, healthiest life possible. The secondary 'goal' is to have a tank that is fun to watch and look at. That is just me though and so I know some people may not really care about the fish themselves since they can always be replaced, but I cannot get myself to think that way.

Water changes are really the key here and so if there are high levels of any of the three parameters, that is what should be done. Like I said, it slows things down, but that is the price we pay. I would also put the tank at a temp of about 82 to 85 degrees F,very slowly, since the higher temp will help the bacteria grow and reproduce faster. Higher would be even better, but the fish need to be considered.
 
Is it known at what level NitrItes become dangerous? Because I know they say "any is dangerous" but clearly during a fishy cycle, there would be some...
 
Tommy Gun said:
Why would you want to defend cycling with fish when mother nature never intended things to be that way and you can drop some fish food into a tank or add ammonia and walk away and let everything take its course? That is just a really unintelligable answer for people who want to defend a mistake.
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Good point. :clap:
 
Shermanator said:
Doesn't mean they are not either unless humans can read the minds of a fish.
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as one of the other members posted if you just watch your fish its not too hard to figure out if they are happy or not.

i look at peoples post and see if they are worthy to lessen too or not.

"If you go to Asia they have zillions of fish vegetating in a bucket." Shermanator
just because other people are handling their fish wrong doesnt make it right for others to do so also. people keep oscars in 20-30 gal tanks does this make it right for everyone to do so no.

"you can't buy ammonia of the shelf" there are other things you can use other then ammonia to get a cycle going such as fish food.

"Interesting opinion on the book. Which proves the point that thier is no
wrong or right way of doing things. " there is good ways and bad ways to do things.

i think i can go on but most people should get the point. not everything you read is good info. there are a lot of people giving out bad advise. not everyone gets it right ever time but lessen to the people who get it right most of the time.
 
Omega said:
You can kind of tell if a fish is healthy (and therefore happy) without reading their minds.
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and also to mgamer200


You guys have hit the nail on the head. Thats exactly what I was trying to say. The comment was in relation to reddogs comment about my fish swimming around happily doesnt mean they are healthy view. Re-read his view.

When I mentioned in Asia the fish in the bucket comment- I am in no way condonning this type of treatment but merely stating a wide range of ways people are keeping aquarium fish. Their is obvioulsy a different technique involved in starting the tanks in the US than down here in OZ. On a personal view you guys are miles ahead of us in alternative ways to cycle your tanks. Like I said down here in Melbourne all the aqauriums that I have gone to do Fishy Cycles and none of them have heard of directly puting in Ammonia.

TG- Bio Spira was in relation to our customs control. Ammonia through the postal system would almost deffinetly be confiscated no doubt about it.
Also when I state mother nature - I am directly quoting from the book. I am getting the impression that most of you don't like the book. Despite Amazon.com's reviews stating very highly on it. By the way I had to import this book from the US. It is not even avaiable here. However using the techiniques in the book has proven in "MY" situation to have worked. Although it is hard for most of you to except it- My fish from "what I can tell" are coping fine depite my nitrite levels. When I was running off my head doing water changes everyday to drop ammonia levels I lost 3 fish in the process. Whether it was a direct cause is not fully understood and I have no proof that the water changes gave additional stress to them. I am only making an assumption.


With the nitrite levels I am doing a 25 percent water change in about 5 days and the fish appear to be coping fine. I am also using aquarium salt to nulify the effects of nitrite according to the book. Now this is working for me but may not work for others as you have to take into account that water parimeters can be totally different in each countries despite the bloke who wrote it living in the US. The book is in no way a be all and end all.

Finally I am in no way neglecting my fish- I love them dearly and hate to see anything happening to them. I frequently come to the forum to learn more from you all - not to state what is wrong and what is right.

I don't want to hijack this thread any longer but would like to know what is happening with Mollyfans tank in the hope I can further my knowledge on this very interesting and debatable hobby.
 
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your great book. i looked it up. the high ratings and the reviews seem to all come from people who dont know anything about fish keeping. so of course its going to sound great to them. they dont know better. i am not going to say a book is bad or good until i read it but the way you seem to present it doesnt seem very good. with out saying the book says or using quotes its hard to know what you are saying and what the book is. the book is also 8 years old. i am not sure when fishless cycling came around but it might have been before then. the info on there might just be outdated.

there are a lot of people that never heard of fishless cycle. i have had people yell at me and tell me i have to put fish in there to cycle. the internet connects everyone so there is no reason why other places shouldn't know also.
 
Well I consider myself a prime candidate for the book. I think we should get back to MollyFans intial problem solving. I think it is unfare on Mollyfan so if you want to continue debating feel free to post in my post.
 
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