Clown Loach laying down...swimming irradically

T

Tay690

Addicted to Loaches
Feb 5, 2009
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Hello,

I need some quick help on this one...if anything can even be done at all

This morning I woke up (literally 10 minutes ago) and one of the smaller original clown loaches I have is laying on the substrate breathing very fast and not moving whatsoever

One of my other clowns did this 2 months ago before it died

I put my hand in the tank to just wake him up and put my hand close to him and he swam upright for about 10 seconds...then swam upside down ... then sideways...now he's laying down again breathing extremely fast

Is there anything I can do quickly to help him out?

He looks like he's suffering...and I really don't want him to die...and I don't know what the hell is causing this

The tank has been the cleanest it's been for a while...I've had the nitrates under 20 for a month now with no mini cycle...the loaches were always swimming around like crazy

then yesterday they didn't come out and swim around like usual

today the loach is sick and just listlessly lying on the substrate gasping for its life

i don't get this

Help please
 
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I dont know if this a disease but rather stress related caused by you.

As long as water is ok as you said and no visible symptoms, I think all is normal.

I do not know if you let room light illuminate tank before turning on tank light.

I know CL to sleep on their side and even seen some sleep upside down against caves. If it is labored breathing, this could ve been caused by sudden light changes.

They need to have some time to wake up also. By disturbing them at this stage by tapping or touching, you may have cause panic at this morning stage.
I ve seen it happen many many times, especially in CL kept in Unideal Conditions. where fish suffered what seemed like a heatrattack when disturbed.
Why dont you just shut the light off and see how they behave and if their larored breathing subside!!!
 
naw it's not that...the light comes into the room at around 7am and the light goes on at 9am...

it's not even like able to swim i dunno what is wrong with it...this is so frustrating

i netted it to see if i could see any physical symptoms on the fish and there's no red markings...no scratches...it looks a little fat but i didn't feed them this morning yet...and when i let him out of the net to come and reply...he like didn't even attempt to swim whatsoever...just kind of let the current take him back to the bottom and again started breathing heavily on the substrate

turning the light off just upset the other 3...no change in the sick one

i called LFS and they told me throw it in the freezer and put it out of its misery...GRRRRRRR~

and I know about clowns sensitivity to light...I have witnessed this before when turning on a light late at night etc

I don't do this to my clowns at all...in fact my wife knows she has to open the curtains no later than 8am to be able to turn the light on at 9am

and she would probably laugh if you mentioned that to her because of how strict I am about their lighting schedule
 
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God this is so frustrating...i take the extra measure to clean the tank a couple of days earlier this week

and change the carbon filter and this happens

i'm so angry i'm shaking right now

and params are all normal before anyone asks

Nitrate 10-20
Ammo 0
Nitrite 0
Ph 7.2
 
OK.

Rather than uthanize it, I would prepare gallon of water and add 1 level tea/gal and whatever recommended dosage for Quick Cure for Gallon.

I do not know if you have plastic hanging box (A Temporaty Q/T or H/T: Lee's Products make them in few sizes) which can be hung inside the tank with some of (pint , quart, etc) medicated water. At least, no need for heater since box is inside the tank.
You can even diy your own contraption inside the tank.
Such contraptions can save lot of fish in case of emergency and it will save money on med.

You can even punch lots of holes on plastic container to use as isolation tank inside the tank to isolate aggresive fish (JAIL) or injured fish to recover (ICU), LOL.

Try if this is possible. What have you got to loose?

I would also set up bucket of s/w, higher concentration than natural sea water , to disinfect all tools b/n use.
 
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I do have one of those guppy breeding traps...it's not much bigger than the CL but at this point

I think it's better that the fish stays at the top of the water column where the oxygen is purest

good thinking man

I'm gonna clean it up and do that right now

and I'm going to continue to keep the lights off today

the other loaches don't seem to pleased but in this case having the CL in the breeding trap at the top of the tank...i don't want to stress him anymore than is necessary

Thanks again

Hopefully I can reply with good news

Edit: Alright it's in the tank and the CL is in there...I'm going to get some internal parasite later on because this is the 3rd fish that has had these symptoms since I got the original 6 1 year ago

I wonder if walmart sells quickcure...cuz that's literally right across the street
 
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Quick Cure will work but is probably more than you need. The symptoms described could be either nitrite toxicity or an infection by gill flukes. Since nitrites are 0 I'd treat with praziquantel for flukes. It's very safe even for med-sensitive fish like CLs and is very specific in its activity.
 
god why does big als have to be so far from me...why isn't there an etobicoke location grrrrrr

that is the only thing I can attribute it to is either gill flukes or some internal parasite

how would I be able to tell if it was gill flukes? is there something specific you can see in the gill tissue? or just the rapid breathing?

I checked walmart and petvalu and both didn't have any internal parasite treatment

Petvalu had this stuff called "Clout" that said it would cure anchor worms and gill flukes...but it said not to use with scaleless fish so I didn't get it and came home to research before I subjected my fish to something that wasn't safe

And sure enough the first one that pops up on google says in big bold letters "NEVER USE CLOUT WITH CLOWN LOACHES!"

Yay for playing on the side of caution

he's still breathing quite rapidly in the breeding trap

the alpha is doing his usual loachy dance and the other 2 loaches haven't even come out at all

thank you both for your quick responses

Even though the fish might not make it....it's good to know someone else feels my situation and can put themselves in the same mindset of losing something you've spent a year pulling through random illnesses

this one I can't attribute to anything at all

They've been through Ich, what we believed to be Fish TB also...and a multitude of dirty water up until about 6 months ago

The tank has been flawlessly clean for the past 2 months and the loaches were so active that I actually made a thread about how active they were...

I guess that's kind of why I can't put my finger on this fishes symptoms...usually it's caused by something

Other than the fact I changed my water 2 days early and changed the carbon (without siphoning the gravel at all...to save the nitrates)

And like I said all params are nil or within' acceptable ranges

So i really don't get this
 
Tay690 said:
I do have one of those guppy breeding traps...it's not much bigger than the CL but at this point

I think it's better that the fish stays at the top of the water column where the oxygen is purest

good thinking man

I'm gonna clean it up and do that right now

and I'm going to continue to keep the lights off today

the other loaches don't seem to pleased but in this case having the CL in the breeding trap at the top of the tank...i don't want to stress him anymore than is necessary

Thanks again

Hopefully I can reply with good news

Edit: Alright it's in the tank and the CL is in there...I'm going to get some internal parasite later on because this is the 3rd fish that has had these symptoms since I got the original 6 1 year ago

I wonder if walmart sells quickcure...cuz that's literally right across the street
Click to expand...

Guppy trap will not work as hospital if it has any holes. Use any plastic box or jar (DIY).
Petco or Walmart should have these plastic container which can be hung on the rim. These are the container which they themselve use when catching fish for you when you are buying fish. These box are usually hung on the rim of tank while netting. All you do is hang it inside the tank

Make sure not to overdose the medicated water and change water in the box twice or even three times a day. If feeding (not recommended) in the box, replace medicated water even more often.
For couple of days of small isolation box, I would not feed since it can suffer or even die from exposure to increase of NH3 in the box.
Keep the light off during this procedure in order to decrease its metabolic rate thus less waste is produced.

As far as parasites (my initial assumption) which affect gills could be one on many possible parasite but I doubt if it is gill fluke since you had them for long time.

Usually gill flukes are more evident in newly arrived batches which wholesaler and retailer should have taken care of. But again, not too many lfs are capable of doing such.

Anyway, hope to hear good news soon!
 
What about fish constipation?

Recently I have been feeding them a high protein diet to try and bulk up the female with the sunken side

Nothing really makes sense here and the only thing that comes to mind based on the symptoms is constipation

If he had an internal parasite he would be very skinny no? and he's one of my very full very healthy clowns (that weren't affected by the fish TB...both of which are fully recovering btw)

The only thing that i can think of is maybe she ate too many pellets yesterday...because she was eating and acting normally up until this morning when i woke up and she was lying on the substrate

I didn't even feed them this morning when I saw this

Is there anything I can quickly to help ... unblock this little guy?

Some people were recommending to boil some peas and peel off the skin and feed him directly...but he really doesn't look like he's in any mood to eat let alone swim around to get food period

Any ideas? I don't think it can be parasitic judging by what Cer said...and the fact I've had them more than a year and I clean the water 2 days ago and change the carbon (with no mini cycle) doesn't make any sense whatsoever

Again thank you for your quick response and I greatly appreciate the help you are trying to give me
 
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