Cycling with fish!

[Blown 346]

I keep seeing these threads and people saying to cycle with fish.
I dont understand why you would want to cycle with fish? I understand that it will help start the cycle. But am I the only one who thinks this is cruel?
Once Ammonia and Nitrite rise, it is not only unsafe for fish but does alot of damage. Not only does damage occur, but high levels of Ammonia and Nitirte are deadly. Im sure the fishes life is shortened. It wont only damage there gills but can kill the fish. Only leaving you with wasted money.

Its basically the same as sticking you in a room filled with Ammonia or another type of gas, Imagine having trouble breathing, labored breathing, lungs burning etc. The fish go thru the same thing. I dont understand why people think this is ok...

This hobby is supposed to be a learning experience and fun. Not only that but a slow process. So why does everyone want to rush into this hobby??
You can just as easliy cycle a tank using pure flake food, or a raw cocktail shrimp to start the cycling process.

 

[Linda S]

almost everyone here recommends the fishless cycle, and you will find int the threads where people want to cycle with fish, it is highly adviced against doing so

 

[Rbishop]

It can be done....the problem arises over being able to define what species of fish is going to have problems at what levels of ammonia and nitrite. It is different for all of them and no sure way to tell if damage has occurred and if it really shortened their life.

Most folks do not have the time to do the daily or more frequent, water changes to minimize the issues. Thus, fishless cycling is often recommended as well as media transfer from an established tank to speed the process along.

 

[nc0gnet0]

Then there are some that would argue that the keeping of our fine tropical pets in a small indoor aquarium is cruel in itself, so where do you draw the line.


Tanks can be cycled just fine with fish in them under the right circumstances and a very watchfull eye. To paint such a broad picture is wrong. I have cycled three tanks without ever having my ammonia levels get higher then the first reading using my api master test kit.

As Rbishop suggested, the right combination of media from another tank (or pond in my case), mulm from some gravel of a cycled tank, frequent water changes, and some zeolite in a hot mag or two on the ready and you will be fine. Frequent testing is the key (2x a day min)

 

[Taysius]

I cycled with fish because that's what the Pet Store told me to do. They never even mentioned fishless cycling. I'm sure that's surprising to hear...

Now that I know there are other ways, I will be fishless cycling any additional tanks I set up.

 

[nc0gnet0]

Fishless cycling is the way to go if you dont have any other pre-established tanks. Feeder fish is another.

 

[Eupterus]

I agree and would never cycle a tank with fish.
And even if one wants to cycle a tank with fish. Most people would tend to use cheaper fish for this purpose. So what if you don't want the cheaper fish permanently?. The idea of getting fish to cycle a tank and then "discarding" them I really do not like.

I think you should setup a new tank with established gravel or filter media or not put fish into a tank until it's cycled if you are starting out with a first tank.

 

[CWO4GUNNER]

Trying to replicate fish waste for the bacteria that have had a symbiotic relationship with them for ever in not effective, so why put people through the agony of 2 months roller coaster chemistry class with the wrong tools anyway.

What a new hobbyist needs is help from an established hobbyist to get a new tank seeded with some established media, sand, water and maybe an ornament or two. Then the responsibility of cycling in a couple days giving the new hobbyiest the challenge of bringing a feeder fish through it that would have been Oscars dinner anyway.

The hobbyist gets some real world experience and the fish gets a reprieve. I always seed cycles with $0.012 feeder fish, in fact I still have a couple that I diden't return fattened up.

And yes nc0gnet0 is right, from the worlds point of view we are killing way more fish removing many species not bread in captivity from their environment and even breeding is a form of exploitation, but this is man's double reasoning. The truth the whole reason that it all was created was for man to enjoy with reasonable stewardship. There is nothing inherently bad with the managed loss of animals for a good purpose, that's just the way it is.

Anything less and one should not even be in this hobby becasue a fish keeper with the best experience and intentions will by the very way we keep fish for our entertainment contribute to many unnecessary and premature fish deaths, fact.

So its OK to cycle with or without fish no problem either way. But it is wrong to make judgments either way becasue as a hobbyist unnecessary fish death is a part of very act of keeping fish in a tank of water to just look at. I for one can accept that without guilt or remorse, my goodness why cant we all.

 

[onebyone]

I did a fishless cycle and it took a LONG time, over 7 weeks. With no friends nearby with aquariums, I had nothing to seed my tank with. Instead, I used the raw shrimp method because I didn't want to deal with maintaining a specific ppm of ammonia each day. I have a small apartment and it smelled a bit. I could understand people wanting to speed up the process with a fish-in cycle, especially with feeder fish. But in retrospect it was great to have forced time to plan out exactly what I wanted in my tank and find the best deals on equipment, driftwood, plants, fish, everything! I would definitely do fishless cycling for future tanks too.

 

[nc0gnet0]

Amen CWO........

It never ceases to amaze me the lectures some of us get on using disposable feeder fish for cycling. They generally come from an unfiltered, grossly overpopulted tank in the first place, there whole purpose is to be another fish's food. While they might sustain some less then ideal conditions when used to cycle a new tank, at least they have a chance at survival.

What do these people that say how cruel it is think that their precious fish food is made out of anyways? Err, that would be fish! Or are we to adhere to a vegan diet for all of our finned freinds now as well? Good luck with that!