Fishless cycle - problem or just impatient?

[cedwards]

I've recently setup my 55 gallon again after half a year or so in storage. I did a lot of reading here before I started, and I decided to do a fishless cycle. I used Wal-Mart's clear ammonia to get my tank up to about 5ppm. I started this just over 2 weeks ago. I have a Magnum 350 Pro with the bio-wheel 60. We also have an established tank with a Whisper filter. When I started the cycle on the new tank, I changed the filter bag on the Whisper and put the old bag in my Magnum.

After about a week I realized I wasn't getting enough output from the filter to the bio-wheels, so I changed the plumbing a bit and the wheels started spinning much better, with a greater water flow. I also started reading more about Kh and realized I needed to do something about my low values here. I bought some aragonite and put a bag of this in my filter. My Kh seems to be at least 6 now, but this was just tested with a strip, I'm waiting for a liquid Kh test. Ph is somewhere around 7.6. Ultimately I'll probably take a little of the aragonite out. I intend for this to be a planted tank.

Throughout the process I've tried to borrow bacteria from our established tank. I took a handful of 1" rocks from the old tank. I've also tried taking the bio-bag from the Whisper and securing it over my Magnum's intake for an hour a day or so. I've taken the sponge from the Whisper as well and secured that to the Magnum intake. It seems like I've done a lot to get bacteria started. I looked for bio-spira at my LFS but they don't have it, just Biozyme which I bought but then after reading more here decided not to use.

So far nothing seems to be happening. Ammonia has been fairly steady. I'll swear it drops a little some days but I think varying light levels are tricking me (this with a liquid test). I don't have any Nitrite and Nitrate (this with a dip-strip, waiting for liquid tests).

Just wondering if I am simply being impatient, or if there are any other factors that I'm missing. I'm surprised that my attempts to borrow bacteria from my established tank haven't been working.

Any thoughts would be appreciated!

 

[TetraFreak]

you must be a little but more patient.

when cycling my 55, there were no nitrites for like 3 weeks and then WHAM! they spiked and the ammonia dropped daily. just keep testing it and be patient!

 

[anonapersona]

ammonia at what level?

I think what matters is that the level of ammonia was not so high that it damaged the bacteria that you added.

What ppm of ammonia did you have at the start?

 

[rrkss]

5 ppm Ammonia is fine. Since you probably did not innoculate the tank with bacteria, it is just going to take some time to get populated with bacteria. Give it a couple more weeks and your ammonia will crash. The reason why fishy cycles sometimes go faster when you don't have the bacteria on hand (old filter media, bio-spira) is because the fish bring in some of the bacteria in their guts. Don't worry the bacteria will find a way into your tank and are probably dividing at this very moment.

 

[cedwards]

I think I'm OK there - it is somewhere in the 4-6 ppm range. Definitely less than 8 which is the darkest color on the chart. I suppose I could do a water change and re-dose the ammonia as needed just to be safe.

 

[rrkss]

Just wondering do you have any ideas what the phosphates level in your tank is? Many fishless cycles get stalled by a lack of phosphates. This happened to me since my water has low phosphates. I remedied this by dumping some flake food into my filter (Just a small pinch). As it rotted inside the filter it released phosphates into the water allowing the bacteria to grow. Phosphates are required in order for any bacteria to divide. If you live in an agricultural area then I doubt lack of phosphates will be a problem for you. A less messy approach would be to use a drop of phosphoric acid (in some pH lowering products: read the label) per 5 gallons if I remember correctly.

Edit: I will go through my files a little bit later and pull out my fishless cycle chart for one of my tanks. Give you the timeframes for each crash to occur.

 

[rrkss]

Fishless Cycle Chart

Here is the fishless cycle test chart for my most recent tank.

Tank Specs:

29 Gallon
Filter: Penguin Biowheel 200
Substrate: Plain River Gravel

11/13/05: Started the fishless cycle, ph 7.6, NH3 4.0, NO2 < 0.5 (tapwater has nitrites in it), NO3 < 10
11/17/05: NH3=4.0, NO2 < 2.0, NO3 = Not Tested (Nitrites starting to increase but ammonia still constant)
11/20/05: NH3=4.0, NO2 < 5.0, NO3 = Not Tested
11/22/05: NH3=2.0, NO2 > 10.0, NO3 < 40
11/24/05: NH3=0.0, NO2 > 10.0, NO3 < 80
11/29/05: NH3=2.0, NO2 = 5.0, NO3 = 160 (I tested after I dosed my ammonia that is why you see ammonia showing up on the test)
12/2/05: NH3=0, NO2=0, NO3 > 200, pH 6.8 (did a 100% waterchange and prepared the tank for fish)

This tank was innoculated with bacteria from one of my other tanks so the fishless cycle could have been sped up as a result of this.

 

[cedwards]

No idea on the phosphates, but that's probably another test I'll want eventually. I'm an hour west of Atlanta, in a semi-rural area. Without testing for phosphates, would it do any harm for me to try to add them using one of the techniques you mentioned?

Thanks!

 

[cedwards]

Found my city's water quality report online, and phosphates weren't mentioned. Don't know if that means they aren't present, or they didn't test for them.

 

[rrkss]

Just add a pinch of food to the filter. Not too much just a small pinch. You don't want to turn your water cloudy just want to provide them with some nutrients.

Edit: if you are going to add phosphates make sure you keep the tank's lights off. You want the phosphates to go to the bacteria not algae.