Fishless cycle problems
- Thread starter jbobb1
- Start date
That is exactly why. In the Case of Chlorine you might get away with cycling a tank sans conditioner, simply because Chlorine gasses off quickly and comes from the tap in varying levels. It would still be very risky at best. Chloramines are used because they are more stable than Chlorine, and therefore the risk would be much mich greater with Chloramines.
Additionally the information that large water changes are not a good idea and that new tanks are stable shows that you have had some sort of problem with methods. This would make perfect sense if adding untreated water. The disinfectants would cause the cycle to appear fragile, and higher vlume changes without treatment would cause mini-cycles. In those cases, the real issue is the Disinfectant, not the water change.
Our bacteria are resilient and if exposure to chlorine is limited, many of them may survive, but it makes no sense to kill of bacteria while simultaneously trying to grow them. Additionally the advice that treatment isn't needed may cause other folks far more problems than you have seen. Chlorine levels vary greatly in municiple water supply. Mine comes from tap well below 1 ppm, My brother is miles closer to the treatment plant and his comes from tap much higher. I could possibly use my tap water without treatment (I wouldn't do that to my filters or fish) but I certainly cvould not use his water without very ill effects.
dave
TDWagner said:
No. Chloramines are put into the water supply for the purpose of breaking down pathogenic bacteria. I'm saying that chloramines don't seem to kill off the beneficial nitrifying bacteria. At least, not in numbers so great that it will effect your cycling. I haven't even observed prolonged cycling times but honestly I haven't set up a control to compare.
It might be that the nitrifying bacteria are so abundant that the chloramines don't stand a chance or you could go with the other theory (getting some attention in the water treatment circles) that nitrifying bacteria can utilize the ammonia in chloramines causing the them to break down. I'm not certain about it but it sure is interesting.
Anyway, this is all hearsay. All I can say for certain is that I have cycled many tanks with chloramines present. That's all I'm sure of.
Maybe I can email my water treatment facility to find out more. I'm not an expert in these matters... There are probably a ton of factors to consider that go way beyond my knowledge.
Christie
daveedka said:
I won't argue that this could certainly be a factor in my personal experiences. I have those water reports somewhere...
I bought a conditioner called Start Right by Jungle Labs. It only removes chlorine & chloramine. Christie, my nitrate levels were 80-100 ppm,that's why I did such a large water change.At this point,I'm game to try anything to get my tank populated.
OK,I had 0 ammonia and 0 nitrite for 2 days while still feeding the tank with ammonia.I've done 2 50-60% water changes successfully.Thanks to everyone.My tank would be in my basement right now collecting dust if it were'nt for the help.I still have a few more questions.The nitrate level is still maybe 80 ppm,so I know I have to change more water.Do I continue to add ammonia after each after each water change to keep from starving the bacteria? When should I quit adding ammonia so I can start adding fish.
55 gal.
-just
-water
55 gal.
-just
-water
Nippyfish,
It would be a good experiment to run, with a control tank for comparison. I think I know what Your results will be, But that does not mean They'll be what I expect. Experimentation with good numbers and Controls is one of the best Ways to Reinfirce or refute a Hypothesis/ Theory IMVHO it is never a bad thing to Question Mainstream "knowledge" and experiment with ideas. If you do run some tests please post them here or Somewhere for everyone to see.
Dave
It would be a good experiment to run, with a control tank for comparison. I think I know what Your results will be, But that does not mean They'll be what I expect. Experimentation with good numbers and Controls is one of the best Ways to Reinfirce or refute a Hypothesis/ Theory IMVHO it is never a bad thing to Question Mainstream "knowledge" and experiment with ideas. If you do run some tests please post them here or Somewhere for everyone to see.
Dave
We should have a new forum of Aquarium Mythbusters...people test certain aquatic myths and post the results
