From a land far away with no resources and thinking dirty

[fattboa]

Hello everyone, this site is such a wonderful resource of information and about a subject which I dearly love - life.
I live in Kuwait (think desolate desert) and have an extremely limited resources - agricultural wise. I probably should add that I have a bachelors in biochemistry so I do have an idea regarding life and ecosystems. One such essential item is substrates - I found floramax and ecocomplete but they were quite expensive and dirt tanks seemed better so I thought of dirt. I've been researching for the last two-three days regarding the subject but still did not find a satisfying answer. I've bought some "agricultural soil" that I suspect is just dirt or topsoil as it is called. I thought about mineralizing but I do not have the space nor the necessary ingredients - I only found perlite and osmocote an none of those are useful as far as I found. All other ingredients such as humus - which I did not find and you should have seen the look that the worker gave me when I asked about humus. He said go to a restaurant! (humus is a homonym of a dip made of chickpeas!!) Later I did find a myriad of colorful substances in unlabeled plastic bags - substances that the employee only knows the names of in arabic. Some of them looked like clay and potash I suspect - the others I have no idea what they are. At times like these I regret not majoring in botany but alas time has passed. If anyone has pictures I would be thankful.
I searched for regular organic soil and found none - only potting soil which was almost entirely peat with fertilizers, clay and more phosphate/potassium oxides than nitrogen (0.15-0.185-0.25) and this seemed like the complete opposite of an aquatic soil.
So in the end I am left with normal "agricultural soil" or topsoil I suspect. I once planted using it and the terrestrial plants grew fine (although it was Conocarpus sp. - very very hardy species). I should probably add that this soil/dirt has been sitting for a while and shipped from a land far away so I suspect any decomposition has already taken place - if there is anything to decompose.
Attached is a picture of the dirt and the results when added to water and shaken - the picture was taken after 50ish minutes Also pictures of the ingredients of the potting soils just for fun.
http://i.imgur.com/YpeBL.jpg?1
http://i.imgur.com/mrdh5.jpg?1
http://i.imgur.com/jBnHM.jpg?1
http://i.imgur.com/8BOMU.jpg?1
I know that just by looking at it you cannot tell anything but would the soil by itself as a substrate be of any use? Any additions in the way of NPK? Or just use the soil with sand as a cap and dose fertilizers as a liquid would be enough?
I should probably buy a test kit and test the soil first I imagine.
I know it depends on the species of plants Im thinking of planting but no one knows the species name and I'm not that great at taxonomy - especially plants but they looked like the most common plants I saw on the forums. No mosses though which is a disappointment.

Regarding light which is another huge issue - my aquarium is 48 gallons (38 inches wide, 18 inches tall - light source is around 4-6 inches above it and 17 inches long) .I am replacing the two T8 bulbs with 4 13W T5 bulbs but is it enough for the lesser demanding plants? i've read about T5 bulbs being more efficient and such and I am not sure if it is enough. I may find higher wattage T5 bulbs but they would not be designed for aquariums - are normal hardware fluorescent bulbs full spectrum? What color temperature is best? 6700K or it is a matter of choice? I tried searching a lot but most of what returned was aquarium plant specific bulbs.

This is all of what I can think of right now. Thank you very much for your time.

 

[jasonG75]

WELCOME.

I am not sure about the organics in the soil you picked up, I do know that there is a reason Organic potting soil is used and I think its because of the K. Maybe Tom Barr will step in to answer that portion.

I dont think you can replace T8 with t5, totally different ballast. If there is a hardware store that sells 36" shop lights, that might do you. If you go the T5 route MAKE SURE you get (NO) Normal Output not the HO, unless you want an algae farm without co2 in place.

 

[fattboa]

WELCOME.

I am not sure about the organics in the soil you picked up, I do know that there is a reason Organic potting soil is used and I think its because of the K. Maybe Tom Barr will step in to answer that portion.

I dont think you can replace T8 with t5, totally different ballast. If there is a hardware store that sells 36" shop lights, that might do you. If you go the T5 route MAKE SURE you get (NO) Normal Output not the HO, unless you want an algae farm without co2 in place.

Thank you for the warm welcome and prompt reply. The soil I picked is in a white unlabeled bag. Apologies for the pictures not showing. It is what they call "agricultural soil" or just dirt - I think it may contain some minute amounts of clay but I am not sure.

Yes I'm replacing the ballasts. I do not think I'll find the HO even if I searched! Would the normal output (13W each) be enough?.
I will be adding a DIY yeast CO2 generator.

 

[jasonG75]

Here's this

 

[jasonG75]

I think your "DIRT" will be just fine, I would test the water multiple times before adding fauna. LOAD that mother up with plants though to ensure excess nutrients are being removed. Later, you will probably have to start using root tabs.

FYI, we love pics

 

[fattboa]

I think your "DIRT" will be just fine, I would test the water multiple times before adding fauna. LOAD that mother up with plants though to ensure excess nutrients are being removed. Later, you will probably have to start using root tabs.

FYI, we love pics

Thank you sir. I'd probably need to test it anyway. I'll probably add some lucky bamboo at first to soak up any excess nutrients although I very much doubt there is any to begin with.
Btw do you have a source for that pic? I need to know what is a normal output T5 in terms of wattage/lumens and compare it to the 4 13W T5 bulbs Im going to use - I suspect they're in the 700-800 lumen range each and would know how it compares to the chart. Admittedly I did not research lightning much and probably should. I also need to find reflectors although I'd very much doubt I will find any.
I'll add pictures once I get it setup and running.
Thanks once again

 

[fattboa]

I have just checked the soil using the water jar test.
It seems that it is mostly sand 95ish percent sand, 5ish silt and very little clay. Any ideas?
I was thinking of capping it with sand since I like how it looks but it seems I will not be able to do it unless I find sand that is coarser than the substrate, correct? Anyone has any ideas regarding substrate and cap thickness? I would imagine shallower than other topsoil substrates since this is mostly sand and to prevent it from becoming anaerobic - although I suspect it would not be able to support a colony of nitrifying bacteria since it is sand. 1.5inch for substrate and 1 inch for cap? or a little thicker for both?
Thank you for time to reply. Life was much easier when doing tissue cultures

 

[THE V]

LOL that looks more like builders sand that soil. It really is not a potting mix or even topsoil.

For sand or any other soil mixture try not to get it more than 2" deep with a planted tank. This is enough to get a good root system going on the plants but still prevent any nastiness from building up.

Since the mix you got is mostly sand anyways there is no real reason to use it. It's not going to provide much nutrients for your plants or cation exchange capacity. Instead of trying to mix it you can just use the pool sand for the look you want.

I used a 1.5" layer of builders sand capped by 1/2" of pea gravel on my tank. It's worked like a charm but then again I like the look of the pea gravel.

If you want to use a dirt tank you might be able to find better dirt outside.

Little known fact: aridisol's can actually be quite complex. That desert is not all sand. They are generally just very thin on the organic matter and higher than average in salts. Nothing a little rinsing can't get rid of though.

Nitrifying bacteria just need a hard non-toxic surface to grow on. Sand actually is a superb medium for them to grow.

 

[fattboa]

LOL that looks more like builders sand that soil. It really is not a potting mix or even topsoil.

For sand or any other soil mixture try not to get it more than 2" deep with a planted tank. This is enough to get a good root system going on the plants but still prevent any nastiness from building up.

Since the mix you got is mostly sand anyways there is no real reason to use it. It's not going to provide much nutrients for your plants or cation exchange capacity. Instead of trying to mix it you can just use the pool sand for the look you want.

I used a 1.5" layer of builders sand capped by 1/2" of pea gravel on my tank. It's worked like a charm but then again I like the look of the pea gravel.

If you want to use a dirt tank you might be able to find better dirt outside.

Little known fact: aridisol's can actually be quite complex. That desert is not all sand. They are generally just very thin on the organic matter and higher than average in salts. Nothing a little rinsing can't get rid of though.

Nitrifying bacteria just need a hard non-toxic surface to grow on. Sand actually is a superb medium for them to grow.

Well I guess that's what I get for living in a giant sand playbox
Thank you for the advice regarding layer thickness, I just searched for pea gravel and it looks quite charming.
Unfortunately you have overestimated my area which is urban, the dirt outside is just very fine sand that quite likely has a bunch of oil-related hydrocarbons in it since everyone washes their cars/driveways including the motor oil/coolants into the dirt. The desert is quite likely the same, either from oil pollution/depleted uranium or just waste from the winter trip to the desert.
I guess i'll try the "agricultural sand" or pool sand if I find any. Probably need to look for a fertilizer mix quite quickly as well. Should probably get a petri dish full of Nitrobacters ready as well
Thank you sir, inert substrate it is.
P.S. Since you seem to have a scientific background of planted aquariums - did anyone try using auxins/cytokinins to convince the plants to grow? I have not researched their effects outside of tissue culture, especially not in a planted aquarium or a similar ecosystem. I understand it may be difficult to find some (IAA/BAP) but coconut milk has some. Just a thought

 

[THE V]

I haven't heard of anyone using them but then again you never really know what tricks the commercial raisers have up their sleeves. I do know that the use of BA and GA are very common in the agricultural and horticultural worlds.

You sound like a guy I worked with doing double haploid culture, embryo rescue, and ploidy conversion. (I was doing to plant breeding). Always tinkering with the mix to get it to work out right. Crazy labrat. Just an FYI: some of the more common species in the aquarium really don't like culture. Especially those in the Nitrospira genus. It's best to do a fishless cycle once you get your tank set up. Adding in plants during this time is of course highly benificial.

You'll definitely want to look into getting some fertilizer. The biggest issue is of course getting some nitrogen source that doesn't contain ammonia. The plants love the stuff but the fish complain and die from it. KNO3 is very commonly used in aquariums but it has a reputation of being a little explosive when mixed with an accelerant, so it can be difficult to find. Most fertilizers stores may be able to supply it. I don't know what your import regulations are but you could purchase it from online and have it shipped. It will probably cost a fortune however.

I have heard reports of some greenhouse growing in Kuwait (cucumbers & tomatoes). You may be able to find most of the fertilizers at a local agricultural shop. I believe that AMC (aka AMMC) has some stores there. I was just at the owner of the company's home in Jordan 2 weeks ago. I seem to recall meeting the manager for Kuwait while I was there. I was jetlagged and suffering from severe lack of sleep so don't hold me to it.

It might seem like a giant sandbox but if you look carefully at the soil there are always collections of silt and clay in some area's. You've just got to get out of the lab/city and kick some dirt.