Goldfish White spots, red spots, veins, deteriorating fins

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mel_20_20

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Geekboy, you are doing a terrific job fighting this. Keep up the good work. I had an extremely sick Brochis that recovered from severe septicemia so I have high hopes for your beautiful fish. We're all pulling for you and your goldies.
 

geekboy

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The are both a great deal more active than they were when I first transferred them to the QT, but I'm afraid the infection is being stubborn. Another three or four days and I'll be forced to discontinue the meds (for lack of supply), focus on water changes to see if their own immunity can take hold, and consider whether further treatment is warranted.

 

geekboy

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I finished a bottle-recommended 6-day round of Kanaplex, and am in a "rest period" of clean water with more frequent water changes while running charcoal.

The fins on both fish quite honestly look awful, with no obvious improvement for the past several days. I suppose the good news is that the fins don't seem to be further deteriorating.

Behavior of both fish alternates between long periods of resting, and occasional rally periods where they appear almost normal. The larger and older comet has an odd habit of hovering in place just off the bottom, lightly swimming as if it needs to keep water moving over its gills. I've got a bubbler in the tank, so the O2 should be nominal.

More worrisome is that the same larger comet has had one eye go cloudy in the past couple of days, which doesn't bode well for the bacterial infection. I'm considering tracking down some Triple-Sulfa as a next line of treatment. Honestly, the lack of response to the meds so far is getting discouraging, and I'm not sure if trying different things is better than trying longer doses of the previous meds.
 
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Lupin

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Geekboy
18 days into treatment:
- Currently 3 days into Triple-Sulfa. This drug seems to be the most effective so far.

The smaller comet (orange head) seems to be on the mend, with almost no sign of the septicemia remaining. There are a handful of red "flare ups" that seem to be new or moving around, but the total amount is nearing zero. The torn fins will no doubt take a while to mend though.

The larger comet (dingy white) is having a hard time of it. The septicemia seems to be almost gone from its minor fins, and breaking up a bit in the still heavily-affected tail. Still a ways to go yet. To make things more difficult, it is also fighting an infection of the left eye, leaving it cloudy. The meds are starting to clear this though.

On a positive note, both fish have put a huge hunger on in the past couple of days, and are back to darting to catch food and foraging in the gravel.





Lupin
Glad to hear they're doing well! Geekboy, I bought a comet/shub yesterday that looks a lot like your all-white comet! She's full of eggs at the moment and they're having a honeymoon in the pond.:hearts:
 

THE V

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Glad to hear that they are doing well. Hopefully they continue to heal and do well. Just keep up on the water changes to keep the water pristine. The fish will be very weak for several months so even though they look back to normal they will be delicate.

18 months ago I got a larger tank and added in three new fish Apparently they were carrying some bacteria with them that they were immune to. After a month of QT I added the new babies into the tank. A week later all of my older fish had septicemia. My too smaller ones managed to fight it off quickly with some meds but my large white comet was hit hard. I nursed her through the septicemia but dropsy killed her six months later. The bacterial infection caused kidney damage and they slowly failed. It took her 5 months of slowly swelling before the kidneys shut down completely. I had had her for 8 years at that point.

Hopefully you don't run into the same thing that I did and they go on a live for many more years. But just in case you lose one later this year you'll understand why.
 

geekboy

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My too smaller ones managed to fight it off quickly with some meds but my large white comet was hit hard. I nursed her through the septicemia but dropsy killed her six months later. The bacterial infection caused kidney damage and they slowly failed. It took her 5 months of slowly swelling before the kidneys shut down completely. I had had her for 8 years at that point.

Hopefully you don't run into the same thing that I did and they go on a live for many more years. But just in case you lose one later this year you'll understand why.
My older comet has been somewhat sickly in the past year, with a rather marked color change (she had quite a bit of orange before), and floatation problems. I've wondered it the yellowish cast around the head and fins was healthy. It wouldn't surprise me if there are pre-existing kidney problems, and some of these antibiotics are bound to be difficult to process. Your warning is appreciated -- I guess I can only wait and see.

As for a minor update, there has been virtually no change (progress or otherwise) since the last photos.
 

geekboy

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I think I might be on a collision course to lose the older comet, if not both. After over three weeks of medication, most recently with triple sulfa, and with no real progress or regression for the past week, I thought it was about time to clean up and stand back for a little while. Consider the options, keep the water clean, and see whether the little guys can stand on their own.

Within two days of ceasing mediation, the old comet developed several new LARGE hemorrhagic blisters along the blood supply of the tail. Many are becoming swollen with fluid, and I can even see signs of fresh bleeding.

The younger comet has fared better all along, but still has several small red hemmorragic spots on its tail also, though the vessels have not become fully involved as in the other fish. Somewhat worrisome is that it has developed similar sores at the base of the pectoral fins where they meet the body.

Curiously, both fish have started acting completely healthy since the meds were stopped. Maybe despite the wounds, they just feel better without being heavily drugged.

As you might guess, I'm rather at the end of my checklist for these guys. Perhaps natural selection is close at hand. Would I be stupid to think that -- perhaps -- some bleeding out of the infection might actually be helpful? I've got some Kanaplex left, and perhaps a couple doses of the Maracyns. Short of that, I just don't know if I can bring myself to spend more on antibiotics that don't seem to be turning the tide, expecially with mail-order fees on top.
 

Lupin

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Josh, have you checked your water parameters yet? What are they? At some point, clean water is pretty much the option left if the fish still have the will to fight off the health issues. Do you have any photos of the fins? Are you sure the swollen areas are not just air bubbles? Coincidentally, my comet and shubunkin were hit hard by the same scenario you have right now when my pond temperature soared to 88 degrees since the clearing of plants that left my pond reeling with full direct sunlight. I had to move both goldies to a hospital tank and did three 70-90% water changes in one day. The fins were terribly bloodshot and also swollen with several bubbles. The fins recovered miraculously overnight as I frantically did plenty of water changes to keep the red streaks fading away along with swollen areas.
 

geekboy

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Water parameters for ammonia have been an issue, with levels creeping above 1ppm by the time I get around to my once-per-day 50-75% water change. I've been adding Ammo-lock with every change as a stop-gap. The only reason I can see for this is that I may be overfeeding them a bit.

I must have killed the cycle with the meds, since the nitrites have been zero, and nitrates hover at the 15-20ppm of my tap water. There was an unpleasant smell coming from the tank as of this afternoon, so I think I'll likely see a bacterial bloom since I've stopped medicating.

On the fin, the largest of the blisters have already popped. There are several other spots that look like new trouble spots. If you look closely, you can see a point of red at the bottom of the bubbles presumably from the hemorrhaging.





 

Lupin

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Oh darn. I really think clean water (with no ammonia and nitrite) is the last option. I'd stop on antibiotics. They seem doing fine but the red fins can still be exacerbated by the high ammonia unless you have a spare established filter media that will ensure ammonia and nitrite remain at zero. I'd move these ones to the hospital tank and keep the tank barebottom to clean out the poo much easily.
 
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