Help - major Fish Kill

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superstein61

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Ok, I am looking for any advice. I have a 29 gallan freshwater tank.

I have had 5 fish (1 Black Phantom Tetra, 2 rummynose's and 1 cherry barb) die the last 2 days and all of the others (3 larger clown loaches, 2 yo-yo loaches, 2 rummynose, 1 clown pleco, 1 cherry barb, 2 scissortail rasbora, 2 honey gourmais) look ill.

Symptoms have included erratic behavior, lethargy, scratching against rocks, nestling up to the heater, and today I noticed some loss of skin on the back tail/ fin of my big clown loach plus also on my honey gourmais. I have NOT seen any white spots (so I am unsure if it is ich or some other parasite / bacteria)

The only changes in the last week were 3 plants (java ferns added on Saturday) and a pretty substantional (75% water change) last Thursday (I know that is too much but we had to to move the tank for carpet cleaners because of a water spill (another story)).

I started treatment with Nox-Ich (Malachite Green) at half dosage Sunday evening when I saw the first dead fish. I also started a treatment of Kanacyn at the same time and raised the temperature from 78 to 80

Monday evening I repeated half dosage of Nox-ich and raised the temp from 80 to 82.

This morning not seeing signs of improvement and the detiorating tail/fin of my clown loach (which are my favorite and my biggest concern) has me worried. I am due to do another dosage of Kanacyn and Nox-Ich tonight. But I am wondering if there is some other medication or treatment I should consider. Maybe formalin and some copper based cure? Or ???

Advise please - thanks much !!!
 
Mixing meds is never a good idea...I would run some fresh carbon for a day to remove the meds. Meds can kill your bacteria, causing a cycle, and exposing sick fish to ammonia just won't help. IME, meds are the LAST thing to try.

It looks as though you have a parasite of some kind--the glancing is usually seen with parasites more so than with bacteria, IME. I would raise the temp up to about 84 (SLOWLY--most people just crank their heater, and have problems. Push it up one degree every other hour, and you won't have issues). You could add salt to help comfort the fish and ease thier stress. This will increase their ability to fight the parasite on their own. Do water changes every other day, cleaning the substrate completely each time. Replace water with water that's at the right temp. Keep this up for about 14 days--the life cycle of most parasites will be complete by the 10th day, so the last 4 are for peace of mind.
 
Thanks Orion Girl. I'll add more salt and heat and do some frequent water changes. However I am curious abour your no meds except as a last resort recommendation. 5 dead fish in 2 days and the others showing signs of distress I guess to me calls for a last resort (unless I am overreacting because I really don't want to lose my clown loaches which I have had since they were quite small). Do you really think I can clear this up with just the heat, salt and water changes ? Thanks

Keely - the tank has been up and running for 2 plus years - no real problems til now
 
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Yep--heat and salt are better, in my opinion. I know what effects the temp and salt will have on the parasite, and my fish. With meds, it's a hit or miss. I don't put much faith in the claims made by the manufacturers of most meds, and have crashed tanks bacteria (completely--killed the entire tank) by following the directions exactly on an antibiotic that claimed it wouldn't hurt the good bacteria. I've never had that happen with using salt and temp.

Clowns are very sensitive to meds--so, you must treat with a modified dosage. This means the med really won't perform as expected, and increases the odds for a re-infection. Prolonging the illness seems like a bigger risk to me, not to mention more costly.

For me, last resort means I have tried all other options with no success.

FWIW, plants can carry parasite spores into your tank. It's always best to buy plants from tanks that don't have any fish in them--no vector for the parasite.
 
That carpet-cleaner smell? That was in the water too recently. And you've recently changed water-- raising the pH? Is there just a trace of ammonia perhaps?

Another few big water changes, some AmQuel --and I'd be using a PolyFilter pad.

(we do answer posts in the Freshwater Newbie Forum too...)
 
Heya yikes sounds exactly septicemia a very nasty bacterial infection which can cause many different symptoms. It also could be flexbacter either way it dosen't sound like parasites. Gram neg and gram pos meds would cover bother bases. Ie maracyn 1 and 2.
Turn your heater back down to normal. Treat with maracyn two immmediatedly. Also melafix can help with fin healing.
Good Luck I have went through that last year. Unforunately I didn't figure it out until it was almost too late.I only saved 2 out of 12 fish.
Check all your water params just to be sure they are ok too. Also be sure to remove your carbon as will suck up all your meds in no time and waste your money.
Good Luck kuhli







Originally posted by superstein61
Ok, I am looking for any advice. I have a 29 gallan freshwater tank.

I have had 5 fish (1 Black Phantom Tetra, 2 rummynose's and 1 cherry barb) die the last 2 days and all of the others (3 larger clown loaches, 2 yo-yo loaches, 2 rummynose, 1 clown pleco, 1 cherry barb, 2 scissortail rasbora, 2 honey gourmais) look ill.

Symptoms have included erratic behavior, lethargy, scratching against rocks, nestling up to the heater, and today I noticed some loss of skin on the back tail/ fin of my big clown loach plus also on my honey gourmais. I have NOT seen any white spots (so I am unsure if it is ich or some other parasite / bacteria)

The only changes in the last week were 3 plants (java ferns added on Saturday) and a pretty substantional (75% water change) last Thursday (I know that is too much but we had to to move the tank for carpet cleaners because of a water spill (another story)).

I started treatment with Nox-Ich (Malachite Green) at half dosage Sunday evening when I saw the first dead fish. I also started a treatment of Kanacyn at the same time and raised the temperature from 78 to 80

Monday evening I repeated half dosage of Nox-ich and raised the temp from 80 to 82.

This morning not seeing signs of improvement and the detiorating tail/fin of my clown loach (which are my favorite and my biggest concern) has me worried. I am due to do another dosage of Kanacyn and Nox-Ich tonight. But I am wondering if there is some other medication or treatment I should consider. Maybe formalin and some copper based cure? Or ???

Advise please - thanks much !!!
Click to expand...
 
Septicemia comes in two versions--viral, and bacterial. Bacterial is treatable and is usually the result of poor water conditions. It is NOT a quick killer--those 5 fish would have been noticably ill for several days.

Viral septicemia doesn't respond to any treatments, spreads quickly, and isn't usually found in the home aquarium.

Neither of these bugs will just pop up in a tank, they are introduced by a contaminated fish. Parasite spores can be spread via plants from an infected tank.
 
Thanks for the various replies

Oriongirl - I don't believe it was the plants - but who knows. My LFS is usually very good with disease control, etc and the plants are kept separate from the fish. I will give them a call though and see if anyone else has had problems after recent plant purchases - Thanks. I hear what you are saying on the meds - and advertising claims. One of the reasons I am here seeking some advice.

WetmanNY - actually the carpet cleaning I refered to is not a smell - it was I had to do a water change so I could slide the tank / stand down a few feet in order for the carpet cleaners to clean our carpet (which had a stain from a spill). there was no problem with the water before / after moving / changing it. The PH did not change. I did an ammonia test yesterday and there is a trace amount. I did pick up some Ammolock at lunchtime today to take care of that. As far as the freshwater newbie forum - well, didn't post there I guess because I don't consider myself a newbie:)

Kuhli - Thanks. I am curious why you believe it is bacterial when others believe it is parasites (actually my reason for starting with Nox-Ich (parasites) and Kanacyn (Bacterial) meds was because I didn't know what it was. Also, I have seen Melafix before at the store - its some all natural product that promotes healing, correct. Does it really work (I am always skeptical - LOL )- what has your experience been with it.

Thanks again everyone for the advice - you gave me lots of things to consider and try
 
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What was used to clean the carpet? Maybe the fumes from whatever chemicals they used would have had some effect on the tank.
 
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