Sprinkle
thanks for your response. For some reason I just thought the barbels were soggy and stuck to their bodies... but I think you're right, they must be gone. From my research damage to barbels is usually caused by a bacterial infection from dirty substrate. I haven't heard that they can't feed without barbels, but have heard that they don't re-grow.Could the water parameters be okay with something nasty going on in the substrate? Or should that affect the water quality as well?
I purchased the tank including sand substrate 2nd hand and it seems to have cycled well, although there is a slow-growing brown algae that I can see in the layers under the sand (against the glass), I remove a small amount of it from the glass every fews weeks - but as I said it's pretty slow growing. Could this be anything to do with it? I do a water change and vac the sand every couple of weeks.
The two cories I have left must be a couple of my biggeset and seem active, happy, healthy and eating. Although one doesn't seem to have barbels and I'm not sure if his mouth should always look like it's stuck in an 'O' shape....? The other seems normal and has barbels on one side, but looks like it might have lost the other side.
I've removed all of the guppies so the cories have plenty of time to eat their fill. I have no idea if that's made the difference or not. It's not ideal now though because it does mean I have too many male guppies in with my females...
Now there's only two of them they seem to have befriended my rejected krib... LOL!
Some more sterbai cory juveniles have come available in my area today and I'd love to get some, but I still feel the need to get to the bottom of my other cory deaths because I sure don't want it happening again!
It's easy to think, "Oh, my cories are losing their barbels so they have a bacterial infection," and that may not be wrong. We all want a straight up explanation and solution to a problem. It's human nature. But it may not be that simple.
The bacterial infection may only be a symptom of another problem, and that other problem is the actual cause. The bacteria are on the fish and may be treated with medication. But what caused the bacteria to increase, become more active and cause the infection in the fish to begin with? What changed in tank conditions? Is it a chemical change? A water quality issue? Maybe the fish are stressed. Many potential causes exist. If this underlying issue isn't addressed, then the infection will reappear again and again until this cause is corrected or the fish die. The bacterial infection is actually the symptom of this issue and not the cause at all.
Think of it like this. You live with your crazy rich old great aunt (or wife, roommate, girlfriend, mom, or whoever), who has twenty cats, fifteen dogs and lives in the country where there is a large amount of clover. You are continually getting sick with bacterial respiratory problems, and keep taking medication to treat the sinus infections or respiratory infections. You heal up for a while, but then get sick again and again and again. Something is causing the respiratory problems. Yes, killing the bacteria does eliminate the symptoms of your infection, but something is causing you to repeatedly get infected. In this case, the bacterial infections are a symptom not the cause. You go to a doctor and he asks what the issue is, and starts asking questions. The infections happen year round, so he rules out clover which is seasonal during the warm months. He runs tests and finds that you are allergic to dogs but not cats. So your crazy rich old great aunt (or whoever) kicks you out of the house cuz there's no way she's getting rid of the dogs. You go live somewhere else and stop getting respiratory infections. The respiratory infections are a symptom of being near the dogs. The dogs are the actual cause.
With this particular problem, I have long suspected that the bacterial infections observed are a symptom of a deeper cause, and maybe more than one. Actually, I tend to look at all bacterial and fungal infections in this manner, anymore. I've read articles linking melting barbels to high nitrates, high pH, sharp gravel, and low flow/low dissolved oxygen levels, right of the top of my head. I suspect that melting barbels may be the symptom of different causes that affect the cories immune system, rather than one particular issue.
WYite
The bacterial infection may only be a symptom of another problem, and that other problem is the actual cause. The bacteria are on the fish and may be treated with medication. But what caused the bacteria to increase, become more active and cause the infection in the fish to begin with? What changed in tank conditions? Is it a chemical change? A water quality issue? Maybe the fish are stressed. Many potential causes exist. If this underlying issue isn't addressed, then the infection will reappear again and again until this cause is corrected or the fish die. The bacterial infection is actually the symptom of this issue and not the cause at all.
Think of it like this. You live with your crazy rich old great aunt (or wife, roommate, girlfriend, mom, or whoever), who has twenty cats, fifteen dogs and lives in the country where there is a large amount of clover. You are continually getting sick with bacterial respiratory problems, and keep taking medication to treat the sinus infections or respiratory infections. You heal up for a while, but then get sick again and again and again. Something is causing the respiratory problems. Yes, killing the bacteria does eliminate the symptoms of your infection, but something is causing you to repeatedly get infected. In this case, the bacterial infections are a symptom not the cause. You go to a doctor and he asks what the issue is, and starts asking questions. The infections happen year round, so he rules out clover which is seasonal during the warm months. He runs tests and finds that you are allergic to dogs but not cats. So your crazy rich old great aunt (or whoever) kicks you out of the house cuz there's no way she's getting rid of the dogs. You go live somewhere else and stop getting respiratory infections. The respiratory infections are a symptom of being near the dogs. The dogs are the actual cause.
With this particular problem, I have long suspected that the bacterial infections observed are a symptom of a deeper cause, and maybe more than one. Actually, I tend to look at all bacterial and fungal infections in this manner, anymore. I've read articles linking melting barbels to high nitrates, high pH, sharp gravel, and low flow/low dissolved oxygen levels, right of the top of my head. I suspect that melting barbels may be the symptom of different causes that affect the cories immune system, rather than one particular issue.
WYite
Just one more quick note re nitrate testing. Not only do you need to shake the heck out of bottle #2, but you should also bang it on a flat surface. The reagent in that bottle has a tendency to settle on the bottom. Often shaking is not enough to insure it gets properly remixed.
Then there is the fact that the nitrate test is least accurate between 0 and 20 ppm.
It is difficult to measure nitrate levels. The way that kit works it that it converts nitrate to nitrite and measures that. During cycling this can throw off nitrate test results. The normal procedure is to test nitrite as well as nitrate and then to subtract the nitrite level from the nitrate level to get a more accurate number. Of course nitrite levels will never get anywhere near as high as those for nitrates. 5 ppm of nitrite is inconsequential when measuring high nitrate levels- such as 50 or 100 ppm.
Then there is the fact that the nitrate test is least accurate between 0 and 20 ppm.
It is difficult to measure nitrate levels. The way that kit works it that it converts nitrate to nitrite and measures that. During cycling this can throw off nitrate test results. The normal procedure is to test nitrite as well as nitrate and then to subtract the nitrite level from the nitrate level to get a more accurate number. Of course nitrite levels will never get anywhere near as high as those for nitrates. 5 ppm of nitrite is inconsequential when measuring high nitrate levels- such as 50 or 100 ppm.
Thanks for your replies and happy new year to all!
Wyomingite
thanks for your post it's helpful in understanding that there is likely another cause. Just getting to the bottom of the 'other cause'... I definitely don't have experience here!
T TwoTankAmin thanks for your reply. I'll take to banging my nitrate bottle #2 as well as shaking it! My test results always seem to show between 10 and 20 now so happy I've hopefully got that working. My latest nitrate test was 40... so I'll be doing a water change and hunting for my 4th cory that I haven't seen in a week or two...!
Wyomingite
thanks for your post it's helpful in understanding that there is likely another cause. Just getting to the bottom of the 'other cause'... I definitely don't have experience here!T TwoTankAmin thanks for your reply. I'll take to banging my nitrate bottle #2 as well as shaking it! My test results always seem to show between 10 and 20 now so happy I've hopefully got that working. My latest nitrate test was 40... so I'll be doing a water change and hunting for my 4th cory that I haven't seen in a week or two...!
