Wow, so many suggestions, and I appreciate them all. First off, it has been around 2 months since my last water change due to my extended absence from the house. Second of all, the kit that I'm using is called "Freshwater Master Test Kit" by Aquarium Pharmaceuticals, INC, and I've just bought it a couple of days ago (it looks quite new). Thirdly, I HAVE lost tetras, three to be exact, all cardinal tetras. And yes, I will take the water change slowly, although I did do a major one when I found out about the high nitrate levels and freaked. Anyway, thanks for all your help and I'll just stick with the minor water changes every couple of days.
High nitrate (NO3-) levels
- Thread starter meng-chieh
- Start date
Good thoughts and info so far, Some things to add that might help.
One indicator of OTS is the ph level. although not surefire 100%, one of the classic problems with OTS tanks is the PH drop that results from bio-acidification. The rapid water changes so commonly warned against will replace KH at too fast of a rate and harm the fish. If your tank Ph is noticeably different than your tap water PH (after setting out overnight in a bowl) then proceede very carefully as mentioned. my suggestion is 5-10 percent water change once or twice daily until the ph raises and stabilizes in a similar to tap range. The fact is if your tank water is different than your tap then you need to do frequent but very small water changes to slowly acclimate your fish to the changing levels. the blanket warning that you should not do major water changes is only half correct and is far too often thrown around without any explanation. the faster you can correct the situation the better off you are, but you need to protect your fish while working on the problem.
If every parrameter of your tap and tank are similar except of course the nitrate level then large volume frequent water changes are your best defense. There is no danger to the fish because the water you put in is not a lot different than what you take out. Some simple testing will help you to know what is the best course of action. reduction in nitrates won't shock your fish. rapid changes in ph and TDS (total dissolved solids) levels will shock your fish.
We can all guess from a distance that you do or don't have OTS, but you can do some testing and know for sure.
Nitrate on it's own is not highly toxic ( but is toxic to some extent) however a tank with high nitrates indicates a tank with high pollutants and usually high TDS. many of which we cannot test for. The nitrate is our indicator, not the only concern. Most of the recent studies I've seen on nitrate toxitity simply don't account for other pollutant build-up in the tank. This is also why simply adding a bunch of plants will not prevent water changing needs forever in a typically stocked and fed tank.
AP test kits are decent( not the best in the world, but generally good enough for the hobbyist), I use them as well. the Nitrate test kit in particular is a little difficult to use, but it always reads low when it is wrong IME. with this in mind, I would guess you have a problem to deal with even if the kit is off. the easy test is to take a sample to the LFS and see if they get the same numbers your test gives you. better safe than sorry especially when the LFS's will verify it for free.
Lastly, 2 months seems like a short time to develope OTS, or even nitrates as high as you report. the most common cause of nitrate buildup is overfeeding. after you get through all of this, you may want to re-evaluate feeding levels for your fish. Very few hobbyists are good about not overfeeding. I know I feed way too much, and I feed far less than most people.
dave
One indicator of OTS is the ph level. although not surefire 100%, one of the classic problems with OTS tanks is the PH drop that results from bio-acidification. The rapid water changes so commonly warned against will replace KH at too fast of a rate and harm the fish. If your tank Ph is noticeably different than your tap water PH (after setting out overnight in a bowl) then proceede very carefully as mentioned. my suggestion is 5-10 percent water change once or twice daily until the ph raises and stabilizes in a similar to tap range. The fact is if your tank water is different than your tap then you need to do frequent but very small water changes to slowly acclimate your fish to the changing levels. the blanket warning that you should not do major water changes is only half correct and is far too often thrown around without any explanation. the faster you can correct the situation the better off you are, but you need to protect your fish while working on the problem.
If every parrameter of your tap and tank are similar except of course the nitrate level then large volume frequent water changes are your best defense. There is no danger to the fish because the water you put in is not a lot different than what you take out. Some simple testing will help you to know what is the best course of action. reduction in nitrates won't shock your fish. rapid changes in ph and TDS (total dissolved solids) levels will shock your fish.
We can all guess from a distance that you do or don't have OTS, but you can do some testing and know for sure.
Nitrate on it's own is not highly toxic ( but is toxic to some extent) however a tank with high nitrates indicates a tank with high pollutants and usually high TDS. many of which we cannot test for. The nitrate is our indicator, not the only concern. Most of the recent studies I've seen on nitrate toxitity simply don't account for other pollutant build-up in the tank. This is also why simply adding a bunch of plants will not prevent water changing needs forever in a typically stocked and fed tank.
AP test kits are decent( not the best in the world, but generally good enough for the hobbyist), I use them as well. the Nitrate test kit in particular is a little difficult to use, but it always reads low when it is wrong IME. with this in mind, I would guess you have a problem to deal with even if the kit is off. the easy test is to take a sample to the LFS and see if they get the same numbers your test gives you. better safe than sorry especially when the LFS's will verify it for free.
Lastly, 2 months seems like a short time to develope OTS, or even nitrates as high as you report. the most common cause of nitrate buildup is overfeeding. after you get through all of this, you may want to re-evaluate feeding levels for your fish. Very few hobbyists are good about not overfeeding. I know I feed way too much, and I feed far less than most people.
dave
Another Ho3 Concern
I've been bad with the water changes.
I've allowed my knucklehead X girlfriend to care for my precious "childre" in my absence.
5-1 test reports all is well. Exception, HO3 which is a color off the map.
Duplicate test provide same result of sickenly high NO3.
Examination of hte tank shows moderate anmount of "debris" collected from bottom side of taknk under the "under gravel filtration.
I have Malawi;s in there and they dont eat my plants, but devour seaweed product I hang in there.
Last note, If this HO3 level is highly toxic, why did my yellows just spawn and stick me with about 24 little poop machines?
Jason :hang:
I've been bad with the water changes.
I've allowed my knucklehead X girlfriend to care for my precious "childre" in my absence.
5-1 test reports all is well. Exception, HO3 which is a color off the map.
Duplicate test provide same result of sickenly high NO3.
Examination of hte tank shows moderate anmount of "debris" collected from bottom side of taknk under the "under gravel filtration.
I have Malawi;s in there and they dont eat my plants, but devour seaweed product I hang in there.
Last note, If this HO3 level is highly toxic, why did my yellows just spawn and stick me with about 24 little poop machines?
Jason :hang:
If you want to figure out what your real Nitrates are (seeing that your test kit maxes out at 160ppm), simply dilute your testing sample with fresh water, till you get a reading lower than 160ppm. Once you know that, you can roughly estimate how long it will take you to bring down your Nitrates to reasonable levels via partial water changes.
guys, Im all for caution, but the test is still redlined ABOVE 160ppm.
At 10% water changes once a week, it will take 17 water changes to get it to 30ppm IF YOU DOESNT feed your fish at all in the mean time. 10% waterchanges are practically worthless. A maintenance schedule for a perfect tank and a lot more work than is necessary.
Besides, its moot. A massive water change was already done.
The nitrates only be reduced by direct result of a waterchange- continue with waterchanges, 30% minimum, and increase from there at each future water change until you get to 60%.
If you are at 160 now, a 30% will get you to 112, another 30 will get you to 80, then 55- but remember you're increasing nitrates every time you feed- and if you're feeding babies, that's a lot of nitrate, it will take you the rest of your life.
If you go 30-40-50-60% You wont stress your fish and you will get down to 20 in 4 water changes without stressing your fish.
At 10% water changes once a week, it will take 17 water changes to get it to 30ppm IF YOU DOESNT feed your fish at all in the mean time. 10% waterchanges are practically worthless. A maintenance schedule for a perfect tank and a lot more work than is necessary.
Besides, its moot. A massive water change was already done.
The nitrates only be reduced by direct result of a waterchange- continue with waterchanges, 30% minimum, and increase from there at each future water change until you get to 60%.
If you are at 160 now, a 30% will get you to 112, another 30 will get you to 80, then 55- but remember you're increasing nitrates every time you feed- and if you're feeding babies, that's a lot of nitrate, it will take you the rest of your life.
If you go 30-40-50-60% You wont stress your fish and you will get down to 20 in 4 water changes without stressing your fish.
