How would you treat this ill clown loach ?

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fishorama

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The longer you wait to do something, anything!, the more fish you'll lose. There are no 100% accurate diagnoses with fish diseases. It (whatever it is) will continue to kill...all I'll say is I've offered 2 treatment choices but you choose neither. Crossed fingers & wait & see is not a treatment.

Iodized or not, any table salt can be used. It's an old disproved myth that iodized salt can't be used.

I'm done trying to help you since you are unable or unwilling to go to a pet store or grocery to buy either inexpensive treatment.
 

jake72

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Unfortunately you have not been much help. You keep saying vague things like optimal dosage of m. green and similar without specifics. Furthermore if I make a post that im doing a water change in 7 hours your reaction is that i'm not doing anything by waiting 7 hours till after the water change is not only an over-reaction it is less than useful. I would never treat the fishes with something ptotentially lethal while the lights are off because i would want to spend the day observing them to ensure the treatment is not more deadly than the disease but of course that would fall into your bucket of doing nothing.
 
Apr 2, 2002
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Consider these points and then I have nothing more to offer.

1. I believe your fish have ich, not epystalis. If you researched both of these things you would have learned yjsy they present in different places on the fish. Your fish pic did not indicate epystalis.

2. These are not my fish, but I spent some time reading a few research papers on epystalis, one of which I quoted in this thread and to which I provided a link.

3. To treat with salt will cost you about $1.49 at your local supermarkeyt for 16 ounces of Mortan Salt w/o any additives or $1.49 or their Kosher rock salt may be a tad more. Either is safe to use. What doesn't go into the tank you can use on your food.

4. If you do nothing, the odds are very high that will also be the number of fish left in your tank.

5. There are a variety of strains of Ich, there is even a heat resistant one. The only big difference between the strains is in how fast they can kill.
 

jake72

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Consider these points and then I have nothing more to offer.

1. I believe your fish have ich, not epystalis. If you researched both of these things you would have learned yjsy they present in different places on the fish. Your fish pic did not indicate epystalis.

2. These are not my fish, but I spent some time reading a few research papers on epystalis, one of which I quoted in this thread and to which I provided a link.

3. To treat with salt will cost you about $1.49 at your local supermarkeyt for 16 ounces of Mortan Salt w/o any additives or $1.49 or their Kosher rock salt may be a tad more. Either is safe to use. What doesn't go into the tank you can use on your food.

4. If you do nothing, the odds are very high that will also be the number of fish left in your tank.

5. There are a variety of strains of Ich, there is even a heat resistant one. The only big difference between the strains is in how fast they can kill.
The question is how much salt. Also i have to get the ick medicine out of the tank before i try something else. I did try raising the temp to 90 for a few days but since it was not clear it was ick i reduced it. One of the loaches appear to be almost healed and 2 seem nearly dead and i will try to catch them after the water change and put them in a pail for (I thinkt the article recommended 20 minutes) with salt. But it is not clear how much salt - i'm thinking 1 teaspoon per gallon for a 20 minute dip.
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The problem i'm having with these comments is generality and not specifics. How much salt how long is it a dip or is it tank wide.
 

jake72

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What i am doing:

I gave three of hte loaches a 30 minute salt bath at 1 teaspoon per gallon in a pail (I have 6 - one seems recovered; one i never see and one i can't catch). Later today i will treat the tank with a m. green based ick med (hikari ick); i had already treated the tank for 4 days with kordon rid ick - i've added uv thingy that might kill some of the protozon. I do not want to harm the plecos in the tank as they are rather expensive and seem to be unaffected.
 

FreshyFresh

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If it's ich, you have to treat the whole tank, not spot treat the fish and then put the fish back in the same environment that's loaded with the parasites that are causing the issue.. If that's what this is.

Dosing recommendations were given in post #9 of this thread.

You've been given excellent recommendations in this thread.
 

jake72

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If it's ich, you have to treat the whole tank, not spot treat the fish and then put the fish back in the same environment that's loaded with the parasites that are causing the issue.. If that's what this is.

Dosing recommendations were given in post #9 of this thread.

You've been given excellent recommendations in this thread.
I'm using hik. ick-X are you suggesting i stop that and use salt ?
 

jake72

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I went ahead nad added 50 teaspoon of salt; will watch the fishes until lights off and add another 50 tomorrow if they show no distress. I'll discontinue the ick-x. Next water change will be saturday.
 
Apr 2, 2002
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Here is what they used in the article I quoted:


The treatments consisted of three therapeutic baths performed every 48 hours for 20 minutes with different concentrations of common salt: 0.0%, 1.0%, 1.5% and 2.0%. The experiment lasted six days. Twenty-four hours after the last bath, the fish were sampled to check for the presence of the parasite and blood collection. Salt treatments of 1.5% and 2.0% were effective in eliminating parasites in 82% and 78% of treated fish, respectively.
concentration.jpg



Here is one site I found. I would be inclined not to bother with level 1 and level 3 is likely too much for clowns. But i would watch them closely at level 2. You remove salt by removing water and replacing it with salt-free water.

Level 1 Treatment

1 Tbsp Salt per 3 Gallons of Water

Add 1 tablespoon (Tbsp) of salt per 3 gallons of water. You can pour the salt directly into the aquarium or hospital tank, but some people like to dissolve the salt in a small cup of water first. This level of salt is like using Neosporin topical ointment for a small cut (in other words, it’s not very strong). It’s used to fight mild cases of bacterial and fungal infection. Plus, it gently irritates the fish’s slime coat, causing the fish to make more beneficial mucus that can block some parasites and microorganisms from reaching its body.

We’ve kept and sold thousands of fish at our fish store, and this level of salt is safe for virtually all fish – except anchor catfish. Keep the fish in the salt solution for 4 to 5 days, and then increase the concentration if there’s no improvement.


Level 2 Treatment

1 Tbsp Salt per 2 Gallons of Water

Use a concentration of 1 Tbsp of salt per 2 gallons of water for the next level of treatment. Level 2 treatment is capable of combating a wider range of illnesses. For example, you can use this recipe to treat ich (a common ailment also known as white spot disease) for a period of 10 days. However, if the symptoms are only getting worse after 5 days, try increasing the concentration again.


Level 3 Treatment

1 Tbsp Salt per 1 Gallon of Water

When medications and the lower salt levels have no effect, it’s time to bring out the big guns. Raise the concentration to 1 Tbsp of salt per gallon of water, and this potent solution will knock out nearly everything. Level 3 treatment is very hard on scaleless fish and other sensitive species, so please do some research beforehand. We personally have found rasboras, danios, tetras, silver dollars, livebearers, and most cichlids (as well as their fry) to be fairly salt tolerant. Even Neocaridina cherry shrimp are quite hardy in salt, but we haven’t done much testing on Caridina crystal shrimp yet.

Note: aquarium salt does not evaporate or get filtered out. As water evaporates, the salt is left behind. Therefore, only add salt (in the proportionate amount) when doing water changes. For instance, if you’re treating 100 gallons of water at level 2 for ich, you need 50 Tbsp of salt initially. Then, if you have to do a 20% water change (or change out 20 gallons of water), add back in 20% of the salt (or 10 Tbsp of salt) to the new water to maintain the same concentration. Be careful when measuring the salt because it’s easy to overdose the amount, and unlike most medications, salt does not breakdown over time.
from https://www.aquariumcoop.com/blogs/aquarium/aquarium-salt-for-sick-fish
 
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jake72

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So level 2 is 3 teaspoon per 2 gallons of water. I'll start with 1 and wait a few days to see how the kids react and then increase - i'm pretty sure the smallest clown loach is 95% healed - just one of the larger ones is really awful condition. I put in 50 per the earlier above recommendation of starting iwth a 50% dosage and will add 50 more tomorrow if everynoe is behaving well - i'm sure this is not healthy - the remaining stock is:
7 plecos (mostly L204)
8 sterbai cory
2 angelfishes
1 krib female (left over)
1 glowlight
1 cardinal
8 cherry barbs (caused this mess)
10 zebra loaches
4 yoyo loaches
--
6 clown loaches

(everything above the line appears healthy the stuff below the line - i.e, 6 clown loaches) are ill).
 
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