Mafia #12

Well since Z is around less this game (which I do find a tad worrisome) and no one else is doing this, I'm gonna post a vote count. If I missed something, please let me know, but I think my notes are pretty good so far.

Jpappy- 4 Charlie, DD, Me, Z
DD- 4 Ice, JL, Jmax, Jpappy
DP- 1 Ewurm
Ice- 1 Lady G
Sovran- 2 Swayde, Plantling

No votes- DP, mee-mee, Sovran

I find it interesting that after I intentionally voted to tie things up two more came in on opposite sides. I'm not sure what to make of it yet, but any late vote switches and votes by those who haven't yet may be telling. At this point, I see the votes on those obvious not to be at risk (DP, Ice, Sov) a bit suspicious in themselves. Not that I think anyone's innocent at this point, but a wasted vote is just another way to lay low.
 
Well since Z is around less this game (which I do find a tad worrisome) and no one else is doing this, I'm gonna post a vote count. If I missed something, please let me know, but I think my notes are pretty good so far.

Jpappy- 4 Charlie, DD, Me, Z
DD- 4 Ice, JL, Jmax, Jpappy
DP- 1 Ewurm
Ice- 1 Lady G
Sovran- 2 Swayde, Plantling

No votes- DP, mee-mee, Sovran

I find it interesting that after I intentionally voted to tie things up two more came in on opposite sides. I'm not sure what to make of it yet, but any late vote switches and votes by those who haven't yet may be telling. At this point, I see the votes on those obvious not to be at risk (DP, Ice, Sov) a bit suspicious in themselves. Not that I think anyone's innocent at this point, but a wasted vote is just another way to lay low.

I believe that Rb voted me HN.
Ok so are you saying that if someone is not voting on either DD or Jpap they are wasting their vote?? At this point I do not see any vote as wasted. There is still time to change. I am not voting DD or Jp right now because as I said Ice stands out as most suspecious to me at this time.
The way I see this post myself right now..is if you don't vote who I see mafia..your vote is worthless. I do not think you nessacarily mean it in that way, and I understand your concern about wasted votes...but that is the way it kinda reads.
Like I said though I do not see any "wasted" votes at this time. Also IF say someone voted Jp or DD wouldn't you come back and say they were train jumping if the person lynched ended up innocent?
 
Also unless he changed it I believe Ice is voting DD at this time.
 
Also unless he changed it I believe Ice is voting DD at this time.

Opps let me correct myself...I pulled a blonde moment there...you have ICE as voting DD;)
 
I believe that Rb voted me HN.
Ok so are you saying that if someone is not voting on either DD or Jpap they are wasting their vote?? At this point I do not see any vote as wasted. There is still time to change. I am not voting DD or Jp right now because as I said Ice stands out as most suspecious to me at this time.
The way I see this post myself right now..is if you don't vote who I see mafia..your vote is worthless. I do not think you nessacarily mean it in that way, and I understand your concern about wasted votes...but that is the way it kinda reads.
Like I said though I do not see any "wasted" votes at this time. Also IF say someone voted Jp or DD wouldn't you come back and say they were train jumping if the person lynched ended up innocent?

He is, I missed that. Thanks!

No, not necessarily bt a late vote onto someone that has no votes is probably a waste (clears throat).

Sorry if it reads badly, this isn't my "thing" really. I usually just fight with people until they do something that looks suspicious to me, but everyone I've tried to get going so far has just ignored me. And like I said, no one has been posting vote counts and the like so I thought I'd give it a shot.
 
My bad folks... I think this is right.

Jpappy- 4 Charlie, DD, Me, Z
DD- 4 Ice, JL, Jmax, Jpappy
DP- 1 Ewurm
Ice- 1 Lady G
Lady G- 1 Rb
Sovran- 2 Swayde, Plantling

No votes- DP, mee-mee, Sovran
 
This is NOT a full blown case, this is NOT a twist in words, this is NOT an accusation...what this IS, is a question.
Why do you say 4-5, is that what his normal number is? Really as far as Mafia I haven't played..it's been WW, Zombies, Vamps, and the mafia w/ 2 teams so I just want to know how you came up with this number so I have a round about of how many I should be looking into.

Normally Ogre has a 3-1 or 4-1 innocent to mafia spread.

17 players if its 3-1 would be 5 mafia 12 innocents if its 4-1 would be 4 mafia players 13 innocents.
 
I really hate bringing all this up again but I really think DD is mafia and went a little too far with her accusing:

ermmm..... Pappy, insight? Do you see anything insightful yet? I mean besides players trying to "appear" friendly?

Her first post after my list. Does anyone else think DD seems too defensive for a list that wasn't even meant to be anything more than a joke? I mean I based some stuff off of some early observations but a lot was completely made up.

Pappy, really the reason why I picked up on your accusation was because of the post alone. While you said it's not serious, you still went ahead and posted a long post to seemingly help the town of your so called picked up hints. That in of itself, has gotten my suspicious of you, my friend. Are you forgetting we were a team not so long ago, yes, just last game, dear? This was pretty smart actually, you pushed that list to look like the helper of the town but IMO, it was posted way too soon. Sure there should be suspicions, I am not disputing that, however I am disputing the fact that you even felt compelled to post the list so early in the game. I would totally be suggesting folks do that to make it look like they were most innocent if I was from the Mafia group.... that has me raising eyebrows on you, sugar.

Why would I post a list "trying to be helpful" when I said it wasn't even serious in the first place?

actually, I am quite surprised you are going this route, Ice. You are still accusing folks of "weak reasons", which puts me on a high alert at this time. I don't know what the reason for it is, maybe I am just tired of that being an excuse. I would have thought you would have been more wise than to claim "the ol' weak reason" bit again. I totally agree with Charlie and his vote though, and am glad I am not the only one who finds pappy's list a bit premature and too "trying to seem friendly" so early in the game. Weak reason, I don't think so, I just think because the post was suspected so early is what's got you a bit nervous. I don't think I have to say it but I will, you have made it to my SL (Suspect List).

I vote to lynch pappy

Mentions again that my list was too soon. Why? Again it didn't have any merit at all so I ask you...why bother bringing it up in the first place?

with all due respect, Ice.... what makes sense to me doesn't necessarily have to make sense to you. I posted why I thought that was a weird post in of itself, regardless if pappy posted it was "craptastic" or not. My point was simply "why even bother". This doesn't have to make sense to you or anyone else and I don't expect it to but I would hope that another fellow townie can see this and perhaps somewhere down the road, it may make sense if put together with anything else. I stated my reasons for being bothered by it to put the thought out there. Would you rather me keep my thoughts to myself? How would that help the town in any way? All thoughts are important IMO, none are less important than the other. All ideas are worth their weight in discussion.

Who's to say I am not going to change my vote anyhow in the next few hours until nite tomorrow, there is still time. If better evidence comes up that is more clear, of course my vote will change.

It would be silly to assume anyone other than myself is innocent especially this early in the game. Currently, I am more concerned in seeing if I can see a slip up/easy mistake from the Mafia in the early days so that we Townies can get a good start over proving myself to be innocent. Why are you so bothered by my vote?



I find this kind of a contradiction on your part. In one breath you state shouldnt we all be suspects, and then the next you are insinuating that rb, Charlie and I seem questionable or less innocent... however you want to twist it.

Case? I didn't know I was presenting myself at this time.

Again there was no point, other than to get some people talking, which it did, and to try to be funny. I admit that if anything it was a waste of forum space, but find me something BEFORE my list that was not joking and was at all helpful to finding mafia and I will gladly let you guys lynch me.


The list bothered me, ok, it didn't bother anyone else, fine. It doesn't have to. I just mentioned it and threw out a vote. I don't see what the big deal is. Seems more to me that you guys are trying to make a mountain out of something.... I dropped it posts ago.... however you are still trying to drag it on.

And G, the "weak" reference I made was to "repeat" what Ice was saying I was not saying, how he was using the "weak" reasoniong...... actually using what you call "the word of last game", I was mentioning that he was using the word as reference. Not me. I never said hide nor hair about Ice's suspicions in that regard.

Is that a funny twist on your part to make my post look bad? hmmm...

The big deal is that you are the one who took this list thing too far by using it to justify your vote.

I stopped going at it with you because it wasn't going anywhere. It's already been made clear that pointing my thoughts out was/is not a good thing... rather, the town has chosen not to take them into an account of which I find pappy, and maybe anyone else who has defended it to be suspicious. Yes, everyone should be suspicious by your opinion, but these folks, they seem more so. You included. Why I didn't defend myself when you changed votes and placed y ours on me? What could I possibly say to defend myself when I already know your position. I already know what your reason is... remember, that thing that you can't seem to let go? The list, and because I didn't include the whole "volunteer" thing with it. Do I think it is the right thing, of course not because I am merely a townie, and in no way Mafia. But why am I going to argue anymore with you. It's clear that everyone is taking your thoughts over mine. Haha the DD we all know and love, defensive as usual. Here we see that she turns the tide on herself claiming that she is the one being attacked and is not being listened to. And of course she has to add the "I'm innocent" thing...If the town decides to lynch me as a whole, I could only wish that they follow those who are joining you, and making note of the list early enough before you and your cronies begin "switching" again. Yes, I even thought of changing my vote to you but decided against it. I am glad I did because of pappy's post next, just below.


Pappy, you and your crew already made this clear by cutting me down throughout the day yesterday and last night. Didn't you read everything? Wait, I think YOU even mentioned this in one of your, oh let me see.... ah yes, one of your 8 posts through this thread. Here it is below:


Fine, your list wasn't serious and I even made a note of that and posted as such but you see papp, the avenue here that you chose to take is right with Ice. You do not note on how Ice keeps mentioning the list Honestly I do not know why Ice keeps bringing it up but at the same time you keep trying to drop it even though you defended you vote a lot...I don't find Ice really suspicious because he thinks you are mafia as well so for now I can at least trust him a little, I will not say "bringing it up" because that might be the wrong phrase to use. But Ice most certainly continues to mention it in almost all his posts until the big "vote switch". Even after I question it, he continues to "mention" it.

Gosh you guys are really making yourselves obvious. See the thing is, some things don't really have to be all that complicated, of which is just what I believe you guys are trying to do by coercing the connection of volunteering and "the list". Look below at another one of DD's posts where she says that she doesn't think my whole work schedule thing isn't important (which it isn't) now she brings it up saying their is a "connection"When there is a foolish post made, it just needs to be examined, perhaps twice. The list, I think was a foolish post. Uh duh! I said that myself when I made the post, well in different words but still the same idea, you examinied it fine but using that to justify a vote makes you highly suspicious imo
I will say it again, if I go tonight, please be wary of Ice, Pappy, JL, and I will say one in addition is Lady G. G because of the crafty twists she uses. She is not high on the list, just someone I think should be watched is all.

*game off*
King, all my best to you and your family. **Hugs**
*game on*

Thoughts on this post above in blue

oh brother please, Ice. I was and am not trying to start a train. Never did, not my kind of thing. The reason I never mentioned Pappy had volunteer stuff to do is because I don't see it as significant. Still don't.

I did not see a couple of names on Papyy and vote. I found something that stuck out to me, posted about it. Thought more and voted. Tell me, what is so odd about that.

Who said I was bothered about anyone jumping off a vote? I never said or thought before now, anything about it.

I find it peculiar that you are continuing to beat on this.... what is the big deal?

Ice, you're being a little ridiculous. I am not by far saying "the entire mafia group is on me". You know, you're usually better at this game, I'm really quite surprised. I am merely saying to watch the votes. You and Pappy in particular, that's a given. John Larson, absolutely no reason is given, or no good reason. Just seems to come out of no where and *poof* there's his vote. G, just one to watch is all I was saying as I thought I made myself clear. Part of "my" group? Well, I think it's already been established that we can't assume no one is part of my group being that I am a townie. Again the innocence? Mafia? Nah, that's your group. It's funny how you mention distancing though... especially when she is on my list, right along with you.

Ice I am curious as to why you keep ripping my posts apart. I'm sorry, not ripping them apart but analyzing may be a better word. Are you a bit intimidated because of me pointing out Pappy's list which makes no sense to you (so you say) but because it was posted so early in the game? Really, Ice, what is the big deal? It's doing nothing more but making you look like you are lynch collecting.... at least that's how it looks to me.

DD you seem out of character this game. You usually don't get so worked up over nothing. I will keep my vote on you...

Otherwise I find no one else as suspcious but Charlie, Mee-mee, and ewurm are on my radar.

I found this post by DD well odd. Has anyone ever seen DD this aggressive?

Sov, have you ever watched any of the mafia/werewolf/vampire games? The first post I noticed that was a little wrong and I let you slide for was one you admitted to being "confused". Now, you admit to skimming. Word of advice, Sov.... if you're confused, read up on the rules/confer with your team. However, I am leaning you toward innocent because I would think most of the players here are veterans and would warn you against such a blunder. But you do present an explanation of why you are not here.... hmmmm


Then you come out with this. Admitting you have "skimmed"? Another, no-no. I'm thinking maybe you should do some home work before posting anymore. Next thing you will try to do is scream out "I am innocent, I am innocent".

If you look at her (Sov's) post she does admit to skimming but says she doens't have anything to offer because she skimmed and that she will read up and come back later with her thoughts. Seems legit to me.

Why did you get so worked up over this DD?
 
Late votes can be read in a few ways.

1. Can be a safe vote to have a vote out there and not be killed for not voting.

2. Can be 1 with a chance to jump on to a player leading to save said player, be it a mafia saving mafia or an innocent saving someone they deem innocent.

3. Might be someone they feel strongly about and hope others think so also, usually a good case is made with the vote.

Theres still 5 hours left so I wouldn't really consider a vote right now late, in the last hour or 2 yes, but there is still time to rally support for someone you want others to vote for.
 
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