Mafia 54:Vampires Return (The Play)

Kashta said:
Unfortunately, some of what John has posted up there might be true. This is something I realized this morning.

What if Wycco is the Seer but was the first one turned?

He could still claim his role and pretend to be innocent. But if that were true, he would lie about the investigation results. We don't know who got those results (vampire vs. villager). If a person on the vamp team got that message already, no villager will dispute Wycco's investigation results. If Wycco as Seer were working for the DARK SIDE, he would... jeez.. he could say anything.

1. Wycco would name an innocent as vampire to fool everybody and another innocent as innocent who would speak up exactly the same way I've done.

2. In that scenario.. Wycco is vampire already, John is innocent and falsely accused, and I've been played as a stooge to validate both the false claim and the false accusation.

This is a tactic I would expect from someone like Johnlarson. I was gullible enough to fall for a trick he pulled on me before. And I've already tripped myself up in this game. But since John is the accused vampire, he's not behind this. That would mean someone else on the vampire team has to be devious enough as a strategist to come up with the idea.
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It actually gets worse than that. What if the scenario you describe is true and John IS a vamp. That would cement our impression of Wycco as the seer (regardless of affiliation) and we would believe everything he said and he would enjoy priestly protection (again, regardless of the priest's affiliation).

Geez, it's almost like we have to stake Wycco to protect ourselves. (Not that I'm advocating that plan. It's an expression of frustration!!!)
 
OgreMkV said:
What is WIFOM?
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Ah sorry I figured enough of us had played at mafiascum.net to know this one.

Wine In Front Of Me. I hope you have seen The Princess Bride. WIFOM is circular logic like when they are sitting at the table with the poisoned glass of wine and try to reason which glass has the poison.
 
Your own logic clears me Coler.

Since when were you a sheep?
 
Kashta said:
Unfortunately, some of what John has posted up there might be true. This is something I realized this morning.

What if Wycco is the Seer but was the first one turned?

He could still claim his role and pretend to be innocent. But if that were true, he would lie about the investigation results. We don't know who got those results (vampire vs. villager). If a person on the vamp team got that message already, no villager will dispute Wycco's investigation results. If Wycco as Seer were working for the DARK SIDE, he would... jeez.. he could say anything.

1. Wycco would name an innocent as vampire to fool everybody and another innocent as innocent who would speak up exactly the same way I've done.

2. In that scenario.. Wycco is vampire already, John is innocent and falsely accused, and I've been played as a stooge to validate both the false claim and the false accusation.

This is a tactic I would expect from someone like Johnlarson. I was gullible enough to fall for a trick he pulled on me before. And I've already tripped myself up in this game. But since John is the accused vampire, he's not behind this. That would mean someone else on the vampire team has to be devious enough as a strategist to come up with the idea.
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The problem is, if JL is innocent we'll all know in a couple of hours and then we'll Lynch Wycco. So all they've done is bought a day. I could see them doing this if they want to bring out who got the list. Who up to this point hasn't come forward. Staying hidden may be a wise move at this point.
 
ZSandmann said:
Well on that line of reasoning Wycco may be a Vamp and JL may be a Vamp. What better way to validate you are Innocent than to lynch a Vamp. Of course JL is a high priority target for them to lose so I don't know why they would try a strategy like that but it is another possible solution.

Regardless, I think we must lynch JL tonight, and if I was in JL's spot I wouldn't like it either, Vamp or Villager. But JL come on, you know it needs to be done. If you really are Innocent then we get Wycco tomorrow, who is most likely a Turn. Either way we get a Vamp.
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Its the absence of any serious campaign against Wycco that sways me (aside from that mounted by JL of course). If he's lying, two people know for an absolute fact that he is lying. Yet there has been no effort to contradict his claim. Its actually fairly basic that we have to go with him tonight in the absence of this.
 
OgreMkV said:
Paper... huh?

So are you one of John's teammates? I can understand being new and not wanting to vote your teammate, but at this point, do you think you'll change other's minds?



OK, annie only pops in occasionally, so I can see why she hasn't voted. What's Coler waiting for? Is there something we need to know Coler?

There is one possibility that makes me think this all may be OK. Ice said he delivered a list last night. What if Wycco isn't the seer, but the recipient of the list? That's why he wanted to come out... it wouldn't hurt us if he died getting the info to us.

That's really the only thing that makes sense to me at this point. If Wycco really was the seer, then he knew his investigation list was going out (or was already out). The reason that the seer hasn't come out is that he knows that Wyccos representation of the list is accurate so he feels safe.

The biggest potential problem I see is if Wycco is the seer and his report is accurate, then the vamps know it too. If they get a turn, then we're almost going to have to start taking out the innocents on his list because those are the most likely vamp choices.
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This is true. No matter what happens on which side anyone is one... me, JL, and Wycco are targets.
 
johnlarson66 said:
Your own logic clears me Coler.

Since when were you a sheep?
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Sorry John but if you are hinting at a town power role here you'd be best to come out properly. If you are the person who got the list you are in no real extra danger to any given townie (well, perhaps some). If you are the seer of course you would be exposed but it seems unavoidable that we are going to lynch you anyway.
 
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