Mega-Powerful Nitrate and Phosphate Remover Replaces Skimmer, Refugium, part 1-4

[snailrider]

He SM :help: Do refresh me on the surge and its function purpose.

I have mine up and running now, I used a cotton mesh, I thought the hook weave was just a tad coarse for they type of water flow I am using. (see pic)

I am totally impressed with the growout on the screens. This just seems like such a better alternative than mechanical removal. Now to go one step further, I have an LED panel on mine, and can see what will happen.

This is a fresh setup, and haven't measured trates or phos. I'm curious as to what effect the different spots of red and blue led will have on growth.

 

[Sploke]

That looks like a very blue light to be growing algae...

 

[snailrider]

That looks like a very blue light to be growing algae...

It does doesn't it. I had it on my 55 for a couple days and the caulerpa took off like crazy. It is mostly red LED

 

[Sploke]

Maybe its just the way the picture was exposed then

 

[SantaMonica]

Snail that's very cool... the first LED build on any thread!

A surge (i.e. "pulsed" flow) is designed to simulate waves at the beach, so that the algae will get a dry-time (say, 15, 30 or 60 seconds). Dry time helps kill the green and slime algae (which can't live out of the water), and helps promote the real red/brown turf algae, which spends half it's time out of the water. The less hair and slime that collects on the real turf, the more the real turf can get light and flow and thus do its massive filtering. Dry time also helps remove the boundary layer of water on the algae, which otherwise tends to reduce the transfer of nutrients back and forth from the algae to the water. To further simulate the beach, a fan can be added that will help dry off the algae when the flow is off. The more air, the better. Note that for a fan to work, however, the water must be pulsed; a continuous water flow will not let the air get to the algae. Also note that the fan will do a lot of cooling too.

Original versions of scrubbers in the '70s, '80s and '90s used a tilting water dump-device (which was patented for many years) which filled up and dumped periodically. It worked but had many drawbacks, which fortunately are all solved by the current waterall design. The two current methods of pulsing the flow (i.e., surging) are by putting a timer on the pump (if you are using a pump), or by building a siphon surge device out of pvc, which works with or without a pump. The siphon surge method is not the easiest thing to build, so if you have a choice, try a timer on the pump first.

Note that a pulsed flow is not required for a scrubber to work, and it's not even proven that it works better. However it does seem to be required to get real red/brown turf to grow, and it is this type of turf that pulls the most nutrients per unit size.

 

[snailrider]

On the surge, does the flow equal the quiet time? Or could lets say 5 minutes of run, then 30 seconds off work?

For my setup, a pump with hose to transfer to the primary pump section, instead of hitting the waterfall, would work. I guess all I need is the proper type timer for that.

I have been wondering on cooling my tanks anyway, and when the t-5's get turned on, with the eclipse hood, temps will be getting mid 80's or more. My other tanks, I leave the lids open, and minimal lighting to keep them at 82 or so.

I'll be looking into computer case fans for the job. I don't know where to really get into an in depth technical discussion about LED, but eventually I will have to learn alot more, as I want my whole system LED if possible.

One problem with the display is that the colors are just not as vibrant as with the t-5's using LED (so far anyway).

As sploke mentioned, the LED I am using looks really blue. On the screen, I can see concentrated areas of blue and red, so I will see where things grow best and make a note of it.

With lighting, I guess, the nano meter (whatever that is) and the lumens are what matter most. When I did stage lighting, we had meters to measure the color temp, and filters to adjust the temp. I suppose it can't be a whole lot different other than what a camera likes vs what plants, coral, inverts like.

OH and I seeded my screen with some brown green slime from my 55's overflow box. Not sure if it is turf, but not knowing any better I'll say it is.

So on another notable area of this scrubber, all my rock is relatively new manufacture. It has been in saltwater about 2 months, and has had fish with it for about a month. So I would say, the rock is not really live yet, but getting there.

Most times in past, when adding my rock to the tank, I get tons of diatom growth, (my 55 is experiencing this again) and of course with new setups the diatom bloom is inevitable. So now seeing this in action on a new setup may bring other things to light.

I put a small piece of caulerpa and chaeto in the sump just for giggles. The caulerpa is in direct light of the LED and the chaeto just floats around.

 

[SantaMonica]

On the surge, does the flow equal the quiet time? Or could lets say 5 minutes of run, then 30 seconds off work

Quiet = Off = No Flow. With wave timers and pumps it's easy to adjust. With mechanical siphons, you have to change the parts layouts. I'm currently running 60 seconds ON, and 60 seconds OFF, but I've previosly tried 15 and 30 seconds. I think 60 seconds gives the screen time to really drain off the water and let the fan penetrate the fibers.

For my setup, a pump with hose to transfer to the primary pump section, instead of hitting the waterfall, would work.

Not sure what you mean here.

when the t-5's get turned on, with the eclipse hood, temps will be getting mid 80's or more.

If you just leave your scrubber open at the top, the net effect should be cooling. If you also put a fan on it, you will definitely get cooling (a lot).

I'll be looking into computer case fans

Try sticking to regular clip-on fans to start. More air, easier to attached, easier to move/adjust, cheaper, and easier for others to copy. Later you can try the computer fan, and see how much cooling you lose.

One problem with the [LED] display is that the colors are just not as vibrant as with the t-5's using LED (so far anyway).

That's one thing I was concerned about. However if they are strong enough to grow plants and corals, they should work.

I seeded my screen with some brown green slime from my 55's overflow box. Not sure if it is turf, but not knowing any better I'll say it is.

Well slime is not turf, but it's fine to seed with.

BTW, the usable area of your screen is only down to the waterline; any screen submerged will not grow. Any way you can lift up the screen to get it all above the waterline?

 

[SantaMonica]

Well this one takes the cake. Not only is it the biggest, but it's also the first one to use halides for lighting. "Reefski" on the MD site has a 700g tank and 800g sump, and had the entire garage to use for fish stuff, so he spared nothing in building his scrubber:

By the way, if this weren't enough, his entire back yard is a koi pond
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[GregAW]

:roflANG!!! That is BIG!!! The guy must work for Marine World. :rofl:

 

[snailrider]

The screen was built big to fit the chamber, made it big just for starters. Should have plenty of area for a 37 gal tank. If I let the tank evap without topoff, the screen will get more exposed. erv:

I call that the primary pump chamber, wasn't going to get anything but a pump and eventually a shutoff. The refugium part is the larger to the left chamber. I would stick a pump in that section with a hose to the main pump section, that way I do not have to interrupt the overflow settings. When the small pump in the fuge section kicks on, the water would just dump into the pump section bypassing the waterfall. All levels would stay the same, it just diverts the flow.

For the airflow I am considering using some sort of ductwork to move the air around underneath and vent it out the back.

The lighting, I'm thinking could be banks of LED with a flourescent backup for color enhancing. But that is down the road, I already have the t-5 ballasts.

Yep, I will research the lighting end and come up with some experiment