Mega-Powerful Nitrate and Phosphate Remover Replaces Skimmer, Refugium, part 1-4
- Thread starter SantaMonica
- Start date
Aw, all my good ideas have already been patented! Yeah, I've investigated and that's exactly what I meant (though still, a passively spinning "wheel" might be too fast?) Anyway, since the hardware has already been invented, maybe an existing model could be adapted?
You described something like the Eco Wheel turf scrubber. It's currently the only turf scrubber you can buy in the world, and it's $3,000.
Yes the screen can be any shape, including a cylinder, but there are problems...
Other issues:
How to take the giant wheel to the sink to clean it.
How to get a razor blade into the different parts of the screen.
How to keep the wheel from getting stuck.
Those points aside, I did at one point consider a cylindrical waterfall design using a 5 gal bucket, whereby the "screen" was just the inside wall of the bucket, maybe with actual screen material attached to it. A light could be hung in the middle, and a circular waterfall tube could be placed around the top. It would give about 460 square inches of "screen", which (because it's only one sided) would be large enough for a 230g tank. Problems would be cleaning/scraping (see my cleaning video for the pressure needed to scrape real turf), and just getting the bucket into your sink. But worth some thought. And good thinking on your part
Yes the screen can be any shape, including a cylinder, but there are problems...
Problem is the low amount of light; only a small portion of the cylinder is lit up at any given second... the rest are dark.
Yes, but even-coverage of water is a lesser-important criteria, behind light. So you are hurting your most important critera more than you are helping the lesser.
It does very much, but a "dry time" (like 60 seconds), similar to how waves work, seems to be just as important. Now, our little waterfall versions can operate without turbulence or dry time. However, dry time can easily be added with a timer; turbulence requires large mechanical setups, like your wheel design, or a dumping bucket design. They are very hard to build... much more so than a waterfall (which is the exact reason I created a waterfall... I did not want to buy that huge Eco Wheel, or a big dumping bucket, which aren't available anymore anyways.)
If rotated that slow (say, 60 seconds), then you lose all your turbulence, which is the biggest advantage to the wheel design.
I don't think it would be. You actually need more square inches that you would with a waterfall screen, because the lighting is so much weaker. Look at the size of the Eco Wheel and you will see... it's as big as a 100g tank.
Other issues:
How to take the giant wheel to the sink to clean it.
How to get a razor blade into the different parts of the screen.
How to keep the wheel from getting stuck.
Those points aside, I did at one point consider a cylindrical waterfall design using a 5 gal bucket, whereby the "screen" was just the inside wall of the bucket, maybe with actual screen material attached to it. A light could be hung in the middle, and a circular waterfall tube could be placed around the top. It would give about 460 square inches of "screen", which (because it's only one sided) would be large enough for a 230g tank. Problems would be cleaning/scraping (see my cleaning video for the pressure needed to scrape real turf), and just getting the bucket into your sink. But worth some thought. And good thinking on your part
Reminder Of The Day:
Why Larger Is Not Better: A larger screen, by itself (without larger lights), is not better than a smaller screen. This means that if you want more nitrate and phosphate removal from your water, the best way to do it is by getting stronger lights, or by moving the lights closer to the screen. If all you do is get a larger screen, the new larger edges of the screen will be too far from the light to have any effect. Of course, the most effective way to increase nitrate and phosphate removal is to do all three: Increase screen size; add more lights to cover the new screen parts; and position all the lights closer to the screen.
Why Larger Is Not Better: A larger screen, by itself (without larger lights), is not better than a smaller screen. This means that if you want more nitrate and phosphate removal from your water, the best way to do it is by getting stronger lights, or by moving the lights closer to the screen. If all you do is get a larger screen, the new larger edges of the screen will be too far from the light to have any effect. Of course, the most effective way to increase nitrate and phosphate removal is to do all three: Increase screen size; add more lights to cover the new screen parts; and position all the lights closer to the screen.
Text Version:
Food --> fish,corals --> Organic Nitrate, Organic Phosphate.
Organic Nitrate, Organic Phosphate --> Bacteria --> Inorganic Nitrate, Inorganic Phosphate.
Inorganic Nitrate, Inorganic Phosphate --> Algae --> Oxygen
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Reminder Of The Day:
Feeding: Here are the two building block articles by Eric Borneman that cover what happens when you feed your tank. This information is what you need to know to understand what scrubbers do:
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-01/eb/index.php
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-03/eb/index.php
Here is an excerpt from the second one:
"Detritus [waste] ... is the principal food source for the many bacterial species that work in various nitrification and denitrification activities. Before reaching the microbial community, however, [waste] acts as a food source for the smaller consumers such as amphipods, copepods, errant polychaetes, protozoans, flagellates, ciliates and other animals whose activities contribute to the stability and productivity of a coral reef and a coral reef aquarium."
and
"Of the many food sources available to corals and already discussed in this series of articles, particulate organic material [waste], dissolved organic material [DOC/DOM], and bacteria are the most universally accepted food sources"
and
"The use of detrital material, or particulate organic material, as food source is a cornerstone of coral reef ecology and forms what is well accepted to be the base of the entire food chain"
.
.
Reminder Of The Day:
Feeding: Here are the two building block articles by Eric Borneman that cover what happens when you feed your tank. This information is what you need to know to understand what scrubbers do:
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-01/eb/index.php
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-03/eb/index.php
Here is an excerpt from the second one:
"Detritus [waste] ... is the principal food source for the many bacterial species that work in various nitrification and denitrification activities. Before reaching the microbial community, however, [waste] acts as a food source for the smaller consumers such as amphipods, copepods, errant polychaetes, protozoans, flagellates, ciliates and other animals whose activities contribute to the stability and productivity of a coral reef and a coral reef aquarium."
and
"Of the many food sources available to corals and already discussed in this series of articles, particulate organic material [waste], dissolved organic material [DOC/DOM], and bacteria are the most universally accepted food sources"
and
"The use of detrital material, or particulate organic material, as food source is a cornerstone of coral reef ecology and forms what is well accepted to be the base of the entire food chain"
.
.
.
Here's one reason I really like using scrubber without a skimmer. My purple gorg and red feather star stay open and extended all day and night, even though they naturally do so only during the night. But since there is no skimmer removing organics (food), and since the scrubber adds pods to the water all day, not only do they eat well, but they do so 24/7. Note: You cannot keep filter feeders likes these if you have a skimmer...
Hi-Res: http://www.radio-media.com/fish/My90starAndGorg.jpg
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Here's one reason I really like using scrubber without a skimmer. My purple gorg and red feather star stay open and extended all day and night, even though they naturally do so only during the night. But since there is no skimmer removing organics (food), and since the scrubber adds pods to the water all day, not only do they eat well, but they do so 24/7. Note: You cannot keep filter feeders likes these if you have a skimmer...
Hi-Res: http://www.radio-media.com/fish/My90starAndGorg.jpg
.
.
Stages of an aquarist's happiness with a scrubber:
1. The day you see the first very light-brown color on the screen.
2. The day you see the screen covered left to right, top to bottom.
3. The day AFTER you think you saw your N or P test go down. Because that day after, you tested again to be sure.
4. The day you realized, for sure, that the the piece of filtration equipment you removed last week was really and truely not needed.
5. The day you finally realize that the N and P problems you've been fighting for (weeks, months, years) are finally gone.
5. The day another aquarist asks you, "How did you do it?"
1. The day you see the first very light-brown color on the screen.
2. The day you see the screen covered left to right, top to bottom.
3. The day AFTER you think you saw your N or P test go down. Because that day after, you tested again to be sure.
4. The day you realized, for sure, that the the piece of filtration equipment you removed last week was really and truely not needed.
5. The day you finally realize that the N and P problems you've been fighting for (weeks, months, years) are finally gone.
5. The day another aquarist asks you, "How did you do it?"
Catpicklesdog
Hindsight is a wonderful thing!
I've got to admit I'm impressed with the fact you are keeping a feather star alive, and the fact it looks so healthy. Any chance of a full tank shot to totally convince me to build one of these??
Yes I'm getting ready to do a series of tank pics and vids, using another member who has a real camera.
