Midas cichlid not eating!

[ciniron]

Midas not eating, ich, and ammonia/nitrite!

Earlier I posted a question about an unidentified cichlid. I have learned that it is a male barred midas (the bars were causing confusion, since the barred ones are not sold much around here). He is about 7" long, and I have him in a 75 gallon with a female midas that's about 4" long. They get along for the most part. I created several places that were too small for the male to get into so the female can hide. Usually what he does is chase her once or twice around the tank before leaving her alone. I'm not seeing any evidence of injury, so I'm not worried.

For the most part, the male isn't seeming to be doing too badly. He'll occasionally chase the female around, and he's swimming around pretty normally. However, he hasn't eaten since I got him 1.5 weeks ago. Also, since the 30% water change I did this past weekend, he's stopped hanging out at the bottom of the tank and instead floats a bit at the top most of the time. He's at a 45 degree angle, and looks kinda dead, but then he goes and swims around a few minutes before going back to float at the top again. He splashes around a bit sometimes, and also does the vibrating thing that I've read is courtship.

I'll post the tank perameters tomorrow, but everything seemed to be okay day before yesterday. There was a bit of nitrite, but I cycled the tank with Biospira and was told that it would be going through the nitrogen cycle for a week or two before everything evened out.

Should I get feeder fish or shrimp for him? Maybe sinking pellets first? I have Hikari Gold, and they don't seem to like it. The female will eat a few pellets every few days, but she seems to dislike eating off the surface, and only eats when I stick them under a ledge of a rock.

 

[ashdavid]

Did you add dechlorinator the the change water? How long after the water change did he start doing this? Once you tell us the water parameters, it will be a little easier to make a correct diagnosis.

 

[dlau21]

Dont worry. The male just has to get adjusted, he'll come around. The female is probably getting adjusted to the new male, proabbly scared to go to the surface due to fear of the male. Feed what u want to feed the fish, a varied diet will help. U can train them to eat what u want them to eat. What I do is throw in the hikari pellets, and i fish out anything that is not eaten in a few minutes. After repeating this for days, and mayeb a week, they start to adjust to your feeding schedule and routine and will gobble up anything u throw in tehre.

 

[ciniron]

Yes, I used dechlorinator. He hasn't eaten at all since I got him. He started staying at the top when I was changing the water... I think he was afraid of the siphon and when I stuck my hand in there to re-bury the silk plant they dug up.

I have been doing the feeding routine thing, but like I said, it's been a week and a half and he hasn't eaten.

I'm a little bit confused about the test readings, though. Ammonia was gone, but it seems to have come back.

Ammonia- 0.25 ppm
Nitrite- 0.25 ppm (down from 0.5 ppm three days ago)
Nitrate- 10 ppm

Is it strange for there still to be a little ammonia this late after adding Biospira, or is that normal? If it's normal, should I just wait it out a little while and see if he starts eating when it's completely gone?

 

[dlau21]

when u changed ur water , ddi u go through all the proper steps? Cuz sometimes adding chlorinated water can reset the water cycle. And the first weeks are always stressful on fish. Id say to give ur guys a lil time, they'll come around. My 5 star general didnt eat for 2 weeks when i first got him, but he came around. what is ur water temp and ph?

 

[ashdavid]

Ok for starters ,assuming that the fish is not eating b/c it is new to the tank is a mistake, sure it is a possibility but in this case not likely. It is my understanding that you have just bought the tank, correct? If this is so your tank is still cycling even if you have put bio-spira in it. How long have you had it up and running? How many fish are in there now, just the two?

If you don't do some water changes that level of ammonia will begin to affect the fish over the next few days and if it continues for an extended period of time will eventualy be the catalist for their deaths.Doing nothing and "waiting for them to come around" could be a fatal mistake IMO. My suggestion would be to do every other day 40-50% water changes, use dechlorinated water until your ammonia and nitrite levels come back to zero. Reduce feeding and if they are not eating take out all of the uneaten food so it dose not fowl up the water. Also if you can find out what the lfs was feeding him and get that,b/c at the moment he needs something that he is familiar with.

Just as a note, the longest that a newly added fish that I have purchased has not eaten is three days, and I have had hundreds of new fish. There is something stressing him out and it is more than likely bad water quality combined with the stress of his new enviroment.

 

[ciniron]

I've had it for coming up on two weeks now, and it's just the two fish that I bought together. The temperature is 80, and I'm unsure of the pH. My lfs told me that it was "neutral" and I didn't need to test it regularly because it's unlikey that it would change.

The lfs was feeding him Hikari gold pellets and dried tubifex worms but they were also feeding him feeder fish. They "didn't know" if he personally was eating anything but feeders or not. I tried feeding them tubifex worm cubes and neither ate any. I've been taking out the uneaten food a few minutes after it sinks, because the females waits until it does to eat it. I don't know if I want to give them feeders or not, because I've read that they're not very nutritious, even if you feed them the cichlid food, and that they have a high risk of carrying disease.

But would ich cause him to not eat? The day before yesterday, I noticed a few white spots. Yesterday I thought it might be ich, but they wern't on the big guy at all. Today I was sure they had it, because the smaller one had a bunch of them and the larger one had a decent number around his gills. I got some Quick Cure from the store and added it today. I also removed the carbon from my filter because I read it makes the medicine useless.

I'll do a water change tonight after dinner and re-test after that.

 

[PumaWard]

Is he still floating? Is there a chance he's constipated? If you think it's at all possible, I would add 1tbsp of epsoms salt per 10g. If you don't see any change for the better, redose 4 hrs later. Constipation can cause both problems you're experiencing (not eating and floating).

I agree with ashdavid as well, try to get your ammonia and nitrite levels down. Do you have access to an established tank? If so, see if you can get some filter material or substrate from it to help your cycle along.

Also, I much prefer the heat/salt method for treating ich on fish. Raise your tank temperature up to 85-86F and add 2tbsp of regular salt per 10g and keep up this treatment for 2 weeks.

 

[ciniron]

I kicked the heater up a few degrees, but should I add salt in with the Quick Cure? Will that be okay? I'm pretty sure he's not constipated, because now he seems to be staying on the bottom just as much as he's on the top. Both of them seem to be a little happier today. The male's fins are more spread out, and he's been chasing the female around more, and the female is spending more time swimming around and watching us and much less time in her little cave. One thing I noticed, though, is that they did not start moving the gravel around after I vacuumed it. They havn't messed with it at all yet, which is a little strange.

Should I just keep doing water changes? Is it possible that my tap water has ammonia? Should I test that? Is using water from the hose possibly bad for the fish (as long as I heat it to the right temperature and use dechlorinator)?

Also, I did a 50% water change, but today my levels are still at .25 for ammonia and nitrite and now 5.0 for nitrate. Will the ammonia go down if I keep doing water changes, or is there something else I should do? I really don't have much time to spare during the week to do water changes that large, because I work full time and go to school full time, and during the week I don't have anyone to help me carry the water, so it takes forever (I can only discard 5 gallons at a time, and I can only refill 2.5 gallons at a time, so it takes me 8 trips dumping and 15 filling!). Would 20% daily work out? That seems much more managable for my schedule, if it would be okay for the fish. Any idea how long it will take before ammonia goes down?

I was stupid and cracked my 25 watt heater today when I transfered it from warmed water to really cold water. :duh: Is a 25 watt heater a good way to heat the water for changes, since I'm only heating 2.5 gallons of water? When the heater is cool enough to touch, will it be safe to transfer it into cold water? Is there any easier way to do this? I don't like leaving my fish without a filter for a few hours.

I've had some feeders in quarentine for a few days, feeding them cichlid food. I know that it's bad to feed them to a fish, but should I go ahead and give him one since he's been refusing to eat, and then try to wean him off them slowly? I've read that you should just feed them only the food you want them to eat and they'll eventually eat it when they get hungry enough, but I'm concerned that he doesn't recognise it as food.

Edit: My water is still a little bit cloudy. I've heard that large cichlids are too messy to have crystal-clear water. Is this true? If not, is it something I'm doing/not doing? I'm not allowing uneaten food to sit.

 

[cyberbeer65]

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