Mystery Diesease Returns, Help NEEDED!!!

the recommended treatments are salt baths (concentrated) for mild cases (and dilution of tank water). The additional treatments are acriflavin (5ml/L), OR malachite green (6ml/100L), OR methylene blue (1ml/1L)

That info from Handbook of Fish Diseases by Dieter Untergasser

Okay. You have discovered my greatest weakness (other than my sense of direction), which is math.
Lets see. I want to use malachite green.
100 l is 26 gal. 40 l is about 10 gal. So I want to use 40% of the dose of 6ml. That would be 2.4 ml. Am I correct?

Also, anyone know if this will nuke my biofilter? Can it be removed by carbon?
 
Okay. You have discovered my greatest weakness (other than my sense of direction), which is math.
Lets see. I want to use malachite green.
100 l is 26 gal. 40 l is about 10 gal. So I want to use 40% of the dose of 6ml. That would be 2.4 ml. Am I correct?

Also, anyone know if this will nuke my biofilter? Can it be removed by carbon?


As with some of other med, depends on [conc].

If decided to use MG, ( i dont see why), do so in q/t.
MG will stain just about everything including silicone!
I would not use Methylene Blue in your case, IMHO.
 
Prevention next time will work, not in this case as its existing and recurring.

The case still seems mild so salt should work. That being said, the protozoa doubles every time it splits so dilution helps to reduce the amount of protoza in the tank available to infect the fish.

Salt is the recommend treatment for mild cases at a dosage of 15-20g for each liter for 10 minutes or until the fish roll over...

Jinks recommendation is right on the money. I think the salt dip in the first incidence helped tremendously.

Salt dips are pretty scary, though, and you must not leave the fish unattended. The fish recovers very quickly when put back in fresh water.

Fishkeepers that are experienced in salt dips will leave the fish in after it rolls for a period of time that varies, but that's pretty scary.

A 3% dip is common, but you can do a 2% dip which is less dramatic and would be effective and I think Jinks' formula would be 2%..

I think I remember that you have aquarium salt, or rock salt. It comes out different than fine grain table salt, which is OK to use to, but here's the figures using rock salt.

Approximates because it's hard to get a level teaspoon with aquarium or rock salt.

Here are some percentages of salt solution:
How much (how little) is 1 level teaspoon per gallon?

1 teaspoon = .13% of a gallon
2 teaspoons = .26% of a gallon
3 teaspoons = .39% of a gallon - also = 1 tablespoon
4 teaspoons = .52% of a gallon
8 teaspoons = 1.04% of a gallon
So it takes 24 teaspoons of salt per gallon to make a 3% medicinal saltwater dip solution.

There are approximately 770 teaspoons of water in a gallon.
Or 3 US gallons of water in a 5 gallon bucket would take 14 tablespoons of salt to get an approximate 2% solution.

Make sure the salt is fully dissolved and the temp is matched with the tank, of course.


Here's a treatment protocol from the site: Seymour Aquariums:


If the fish are fairly strong, a good treatment is to try a 3% salt dip. Keep the fish in the salt solution until they roll over, then put them back in the tank. For alternative treatment, and less stress for your fish, try a salt solution of 1% and let the fish swim in it for 10-15 minutes, then place the fish back into the tank.
The parasites will also die off in the tank (with no fish) if they are left that way for 5 days. You must still treat your fish! Quick Cure works well for this issue. Quick Cure Directions: 3% salt dip, then administer Quick Cure for 3 days, doing 30% water changes each day before adding more medication.




That was a ton of information on the use of salt.

Another option would be to consider the following product by Kordon, if you want to forgo salt dips as a treatment.




QUICK CURE
*Quick Cure (4 oz. Treats 2,000 gallons)- $3.99

*Quick Cure (.75 oz Treats 360 gallons) - $1.99

*Quick Cure 32 oz. has been discontinued by the manufacturer

Effectively treats:
• Ich
• Velvet
• Gasping for Air
• Flicking against Rocks
• Protozoan Parasites
• Mild Fluke outbreaks
• Costia
• Chilodonella
• Trichodina

INGREDIENTS:
Malachite Green, Formalin

More Information for Quick Cure:

Directions;
Shake well before using. Remove and discard all carbon from filter, but DO NOT discontinue filtration. Typically cures ich in 24 hours, treatment can be repeated in 24-48 hours, if necessary. If fish experience stress, change 50% of the water. Sometimes treatment will take 10 days to fully irradiate infestations. Replace carbon 2 hours after treatment. Quick Cure will temporarily change water color to blue.

Dosing Chart:
1 ml treats 18 gallons (68 liters)
I teaspoon treats 90 gallons (340 liters)

1 capful treats 250 gallons (950 liters)
1 fluid oz. Treats 500 gallons (1900 liters)
For Tetras or other delicate fish such as loaches, treat half dose.


I hope this helps, though I kind of bombarded ya with info.
 
Now, having posted all that.... I think I would just go with Quick Cure. It's safe and easy and no calculations involved, at least not much, lol.
 
If I can find the QuIck cure today, I'll use that.
My only issue with salt baths, is that even if I salt bath every fish, won't the parasite still be in the tank? Won't they just get reinfected in a few days or weeks?
 
If I can find the QuIck cure today, I'll use that.
My only issue with salt baths, is that even if I salt bath every fish, won't the parasite still be in the tank? Won't they just get reinfected in a few days or weeks?

Exactly! Might as well do the salt treatment in their tank, but not med.

Quick Cure by Kordon. I do not recall this med, not from all the trade conventions/shows I went to, but it seems it is very close to that of product called Formalite I by Aquatronics (all aquatronics products are discontinued, very unfortunate for hobby, imo).

There used to be product called Quick cure by Aq Products, Inc which I found to be less effective than Formalite I, which had 15% Formaldehyde compared to Old Quick Cure which had 37% Formaldehyde. And it seems this new Quick Cure is no different than old Quick Cure.

I personally experienced higher success rate and less death from med with Formalite than Quick Cure.
Formalite I also contained CuSO4 which btw is another type of salt.
For those who forgot definition of salt in chemistry term, go back to Chem 101.

Since no other choices are avail, Quick Cure it is but do so in Q/T.
Have well aged water standby before starting treatment in case fish does show "allergic reaction to med". A Standard procedure when administering certain med for first time on specific species.

1. Do 1/3 recommeded dosage first. Keep an eye on fish for possible
stress. Stop and change water if you noticed discomfort/behavior
changes.
2. If all is well, Do another 1/3, and repeat above.
3. Repeat #2
*** No cuts on the fish when using Formaldehyde.
BMS, I hope you are documenting all the actions/reactions/diagnosis/prognosis, etc, etc.
 
I managed to find Malachite Green today.
Hopefully I'm not too late, as the tank has taken a turn for the worse again.
One gudgeon is dead, two are in really really bad shape, and the other two are only doing okay.
I added the malachite green, and gave the four remaining fish a 3% salt dip.

I have photos of the decease fish, as well as the 2 fish that are in the worst shape.

Here is the decease fish.

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P1090635.jpg


And here are the two that are currently alive. I'm not holding out much hope...

P1090638.jpg


P1090640.jpg


P1090641.jpg


P1090642.jpg


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P1090647.jpg


Any additional thoughts or help is welcome. I think, at this point, I've done all I can.
 
wowm those shots are outstanding. i am so sorry. Hopefully the salt dip will help until the meds can work. Pm me if you want my cell number in case you need additional support.
 
Wow BMS. Sorry for this. Your photos are excellent documentation. I have never heard of this parasite before and, unfortunately, this is an very good learning thread for all. I hope they pull out of this and recover. Possible sticky?
 
Still alive for now. I just keep checking. One is still on his side, but breathing.
 
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