new discus tank setup

[lethalcustoms00]

alright people, lets have your opinions. Im setting up a new(to me) discus tank, a 55 gallon. Im trying to decide how to set it up. Do i keep my planted set up with kinda a natural look, or should i go bare bottom. Fake plants, sand, gravel, what have you found works and what doesnt. I need to keep the water soft, so Im leaning towards live plants. Here are a few things to keep in mind. I am on a budget, so be realistic. And there ill be other fish in here too. Some viel angels, a small group of corys, and a couple plecos.

 

[Reframer]

It is hard to do discus on a budget. It will be tight in a 55 with those other fish, since discus need at least 4 or 5 to feel comfortable. discus need higher temps, which some plecos and cory can't take.
Most people go bare bottom for juvies and maybe add some potted plants.

 

[Turbosaurus]

Discus are so rewarding... so expensive... and so demanding. I don't want to discourage you, but I want to be realistic.

You must buy full size adults. You will not be able to raise juvies in a tank with other species or that is planted. Juvies are TONS of work, and in practical terms require a bare bottom tank with daily water changes and feedings 3-4 times a day.

My second concern is how many angels are we talking about? a 55 isn't that big, I am not sure you have room for discus, or that they will be able to sucessfully compete for food with the angels. If your angels pair up it will be even worse- then your discus are in big trouble and will be tourtured incessantly by the pair in a tank that small. I tried keeping the two species together in a 125 and it was impossible. The discus ended up getting their own 90 within a week of bring them home and the difference was night and day- Discus that had been shy and had muted colors, never seemed to have full bellies became bright eyed, showed amazing colors and would eat out of my hand. I really don't think you can do both in a tank less than 1/2 the size of the one I tried.

What's your tap water like? If its not really soft, can you afford a RO system that will produce enough water to do the necessary water changes and have someplace to store that water?

Finally, plants are a great idea for a tank with ADULT discus, but you mentioned you wanted to do plants becasue discus need soft water, and I just want to explore that comment a little. Plants will not soften water. Okay, that's not exactly tru. They will take up some Mg and Ca (which is part of the general hardness measurement) but not in any real quantities. If you have high light Co2 enrighed high tech planted- then it will be measureable, but likely still insufficent. They will have no effect on Kh.

They are messy eaters, so if you do end up getting rid of the angels and purchasing full size adult discus, a sand or other very fine substrate (like ecco complete for example) is helpful since uneated food will sit on top. Otherwise half of what you feed them will end up down in the gravel, only making it necessary to gravel vac it out on a daily basis.

They are the most spectaular fish in the world when done right, but there is nothing more sorry looking than a stunted unhappy discus- to say nothing of the time and money wasted. And that is what you will end up with if you don't give them 100%. There can be no cutting corners. I hope you do get them someday when you are ready to give it your all. Maybe that day is now, but think about it long and hard. You'll see threads here about a lot of people who tried and failed, even the ones who thought they could do it- I saw one just the other day titled something like discus waterchange burn out.... after 6 months of having to do it EVERY DAY who could blame them?

 

[rich_one]

I mostly agree mostly with what turbosaurus says here, except for the soft water thing, as discus do not need soft water... well, not all of them. your water being soft is really only an issue if dealing with wild caughts, and maybe if you are planning on breeding (I am aware of those who breed successfully in water that is not soft, however). that said, if you buy tank bred specimens, like Stendkhers, for instance, your water does not have to be soft, and you do not need RO. of course, knowing what the params of the water the specific fish you acquire are coming from can be of relevance.

stable pH and water hardness is more important than trying to mimic the wild, when dealing with tank bred strains. it is most important you acquire fish of good stock, as well.

that said, turbosaurus is pretty much spot on with what she says here.

-Rich

 

[pkumar]

:iagree: with all of the above. I just got the tank deliverd that I was planning for my office. I am still having second thoughts of keeping my fish, and decided last night that I do not have the time to continue to care for these guys. I've learned quite a bit over the past year, many ups and downs, my discus are eating great and are healthy....now. But with busy work schedule, new kids, and a large tank at home. I would be spreading myself too thin. I'm not trying to discourage, they are truly a fantastic and rewarding species to keep, and like others have said, read a lot, and dive in. If you were local, I would have given them to you and all my equipment, rather than to LFS and who knows who will purchase them. Best of luck to you. Ask lots of questions. There are a couple of really nice threads here from last spring/summer that have great info.

 

[elpulgarverde]

I have a couple of suggestions and caveats that go with what has already been said. A 55 gal, while technically large enough for Discus is not really high enough for adults. When happy they like to hold mid ground (or at least rise off the bottom) as if they were guarding their wild territory. There's no up for a 9" round fish in a 55.
Angelfish are too aggressive IF SPAWNING, but the main problem is that they can harbor parasites that will wipe out the Discus. I would think this would be more likely with wild caught angels, but while this problem has faded from most memories- It wiped out a lot of fish in the late seventies and early 80's.
I have not seen a problem with Cory cats and high temps. I've kept them with Asian discus close to 90 degrees. They are very helpful with picking up scraps before they accumulate and foul the tank. As are whiptails.
One thing I wanted to mention is if you are worried about hardness (and as they said earlier it might not be a GREAT problem) Seachem makes this stuff called: "Discus Buffer" it will lower PH AND cause calcium and Mg to precipitate out of the water- lowering hardness.
I've used it- but hardness isn't a problem now. I DO use "Discus Trace" which contains trace elements that are beneficial. I've seen Discus in stores suffering from indistinct maladies (and even warped and bent spines that are not congenital) most probably caused by missing vitamins/minerals. They are big fast growing fish and they'd rather eat hamburgers than salads (metaphorically speaking) and they need their vitamins and minerals. This really seems to help.
I like to encourage people to get Discus, but maybe the best advice I have is- get Discus, keep a species tank- minimal tankmates. Work up to more complicated stuff- planted tanks, gravel, etc- once you get the hang of it. And LOVE your water changes. It's a chance to PLAY with your tank. They need what they need- but reward you with awesomeness everyday. Good Luck

 

[TammypoBM]

Well after reading all that everyone has said, I'm scared to even try now. I was thinking of getting a corner tank and doing discus. Might not even be a posibility. I just dont have the time for daily water changes. I have a 75g now that i have a hard time makeing time for water changes, let alone daily ones.:thumbsdown:

 

[Blues14]

Dont let the "discus Freaks" change your mind. I do a 50% water change once a week and my water quality is great. You dont need an unnattractive barebottom tank either.
After owning mine for a year, I see most of the stuff you will find online to be over excessive. Give em a good, natural waterscape with good filtration and good food with consistant water perameters and temp above 82......... you are good to go. As far as temperment, they are cichlids...and they do act like one...fun, playful personalities, but can be downright mean to eachother when they want to be.

 

[Arkangel77]

He is considering getting some of MY fish. I can tell you guys that I don’t agree with everything you are saying. While it may be Optimal to have a Huge tank, do daily water changes, and spend Hrs a day maintaining them its not necessary to raise happy and healthy fish.

Let me say this. I do have a large tank - a 180.
However I have many more fish than most of you would recommend for that size tank.
I do water changes about 1.5 to 2 times a week (50% each time).
I use tap water and Prime. It’s not "SOFT" but the conditions are consistent. CONSISTENCY is the most important thing - IMO.
I have Cory's - I have Pleco's - I have Tetras - I have Plaints and they are al thriving. I also have a sand bottom and it is a little more work but manageable.

I have made these recommendations in the past and I will make them again.

I say go with a bare bottom tank – It’s just easier. My Opinion.
Some plants in pots or a piece of wood for decor would be fine.
I agree that you should not have a heard of angels but as long as they aren’t aggressive and they aren’t 10 of them (like a few is OK) I guess you could try it. I however would recommend No angels but I see others with angels so???????
I keep my temps at 86 to 88 just keep it consistent!
My PH is 7.5is again keep it consistent!
My hardness is what it is – I think it’s rated as Med/soft. I never adjust it and I have stopped testing is as it’s very consistent.

So in summary – IMO you can do it. Just take care and don’t get lazy! Lots of folks keep angels in 55’s.

Hope this is helpful but then again – It’s all just my opinion!

Arkangel77

 

[wesleydnunder]

He is considering getting some of MY fish. I can tell you guys that I don’t agree with everything you are saying. While it may be Optimal to have a Huge tank, do daily water changes, and spend Hrs a day maintaining them its not necessary to raise happy and healthy fish.

Let me say this. I do have a large tank - a 180.
However I have many more fish than most of you would recommend for that size tank.
I do water changes about 1.5 to 2 times a week (50% each time).
I use tap water and Prime. It’s not "SOFT" but the conditions are consistent. CONSISTENCY is the most important thing - IMO.
I have Cory's - I have Pleco's - I have Tetras - I have Plaints and they are al thriving. I also have a sand bottom and it is a little more work but manageable.

I have made these recommendations in the past and I will make them again.

I say go with a bare bottom tank – It’s just easier. My Opinion.
Some plants in pots or a piece of wood for decor would be fine.
I agree that you should not have a heard of angels but as long as they aren’t aggressive and they aren’t 10 of them (like a few is OK) I guess you could try it. I however would recommend No angels but I see others with angels so???????
I keep my temps at 86 to 88 just keep it consistent!
My PH is 7.5is again keep it consistent!
My hardness is what it is – I think it’s rated as Med/soft. I never adjust it and I have stopped testing is as it’s very consistent.

So in summary – IMO you can do it. Just take care and don’t get lazy! Lots of folks keep angels in 55’s.

Hope this is helpful but then again – It’s all just my opinion!

Arkangel77

+1 on Archangel's post.

Don't get caught up in the hard vs soft water thing. As explained, consistency is much more important than monkeying with water chemistry all the time. Besides, juvies actually grow better in harder water.

I would NOT keep juvie discus with angels. The main reason is that the angels are much more aggressive at feeding time and can easily bully the discus away from food at a point in their growth when they need every bit for optimum growth. Discus are "grazers" in their feeding habits. They mostly let the food fall to the bottom and peck at it there, though I have a couple who are not shy at all about devouring their food before it even gets close to the bottom. lol

For your first time I'd definitely go bare bottom; much easier to keep clean.

To reiterate more of Archangel77's post, don't be lazy with their care. Get a routine going and stick with it. When I raise juvies I do a 50% water change 2 to 3 times a week, feed several small feedings a day, and keep the water at around 85F. The adults are kept at 84F.

Make sure you have adequate filtration on your 55, good reliable heater and a good test kit so you can get quick answers on your water quality if things start to go south.

Keep 'em warm, keep 'em clean, keep 'em fed.

Welcome to the greatest fish out there.

Mark