New fish after columnaris?

[Autumn87]

Okay, so I recently learned my lesson big time that quarantine is always important because I added some panda cories and within 3 hours came home to all cories and 3 fish looking like they had columnaris for years (they were perfectly fine previously). Within 2 days my 20 gallon id wiped out. I euthanized the last few fish with clove oil because they were clearly suffering and not responsing to the bifuran 2. I'm so heartbroken.

Now, I am wanting to start over. I'm going to have to test to confirm but I'm sure the bifuran killed my beneficial bacteria so I'll have to cycle again but do I really need to nuke the entire tank? It's heavily planted and I spent a lot of money on the gravel and plants. I'm also pregnant and I don't even think I could physically empty and disinfect it.

From what I have read, columnaris is like ich in that it is always in the water and is opportunistic, striking when fish are stressed or otherwise weakened. If this is true, then would new fish catch it still?

Is the only option really to nuke the whole thing? Honestly makes me want to quit the hobby. This is my first time dealing with this horrible illness. :'(

 

[TwoTankAmin]

This is probably more information than you want. However, it will link you to the actual research that has been done.

Columnaris is one of the top diseases in aquaculture. This is mostly related to food fish but also to the farming of ornamental fish. So there has been a lot of research but most of it is related to the food fish. Unfortunately, this disease is not simple as it comes in many strains. Some are extremely virulent and others much less so. Reseach shows columnaris is able to survive for quite a while (months) even in distilled water. I have been pretty lucky in battling this disease having saved more fish than I lost. I was never hit with one of the more virulent strains however. All of this is rather complicated by the fact that some strains are able to acquire a resistance to specific antibiotics and there is no particular way to know which strains mighty be resistant to what meds.

I wish I could tell you that you can eliminate the columnaris from your tank for sure using antibiotics. The problem would be whether they have done the job 100% and your tank is now safe to restock. The most likely way to do this would be with an antibiotic cocktail. Normally this would not be recommended for treating fish, but it is the best way to try to get around the problem of drug resistant strains. This way immunity to one or two drugs is not enough to prevent a cure from working. But there is no guarantee this would work. This would required a decent lab and the money to pay for the tests.

There is one thing that has had great success battling columnaris.

Besides resorting to antimicrobial agents, chemicals have also been adopted in the curative treatment of columnaris disease. In a study by Thomas-Jinu and Goodwin, the herbicide Diquat® (Zeneca Agricultural Products, Wilmington, DE, USA) was shown to significantly reduce channel catfish mortalities to zero percent after challenge with F. columnare[111]. The herbicide has also proven to be effective in the treatment of columnaris disease in salmonids [6, 139].

from https://veterinaryresearch.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/1297-9716-44-27

I participated a few years back in a forum discussion of this treatment being used to treat wild altums when they arrived in our tanks. The conclusion is that is was effective but the problem the was it was a new idea and dosing etc. was uncertain. In your case I would assume that using an herbicide to kill the columnaris would also result in the loss of your plants. Here is a more recent paper I found,
Efficacy of Reward® (Diquat Dibromide) to Control Mortality Associated with Columnaris Disease in Walleye Sander vitreus"

There is one other treatment that might not kill your plants. There is research into using Chloramine to treat columnaris with decent success. I think, but am not at all certain, that this might spare your plants. have a quick read here Toxicity and therapeutic effects of chloramine-T for treating Flavobacterium columnare infection of goldfish
As for how it might affect plants:

However, monochloramine is used as a disinfectant because it will stay in water longer than "free chlorine" (chlorine from ionic compounds), and is less harmful to larger organisms (including plants).

see post 5 here https://gardening.stackexchange.com/questions/4427/chlorine-vs-chloramine-both-harmful

I wish I could tell you there is a guaranteed way to solve the problem that would make everything in your tank safe so you could repopulate it. But I cannot. Short of having a lab, the only way to know columnaris has been eliminated from a tank is to have battle it suceessfully such that infected fish get cured and more do not get sick. Obviously, this is not possible in a tank with no fish.

 

[fishorama]

I'm so sorry! I've only dealt with the "chronic" low level form of columnaris. Mostly due to high temps & sunlight I believe. Antibiotics would knock it down for a while but it eventually came back. Only a couple species of fish were effected by it, dwarf neon rainbows & a species of rasboras I don't remember ATM, maybe T. espei or R. boraspetensis. Loaches (striata & sids) & dennisonii barbs & BN plecos. were not.

I'm not sure what to advise in your particular situation. I think erythromycin helped for my fish, but as TTA said, there a several forms & strains.

I guess my best idea is to add a couple "test fish" & see what happens...or maybe research if cherry shrimp are effected by columnaris. That could be an attractive tank with just plants & shrimp & low maintenance...nice since you're expecting a new baby & will need to focus on her/him very soon. Even if you can't keep any animals, a plant tank can be very pretty too. Maybe time is a columnaris tx? I don't know...

 

[the loach]

Sorry but you can't diagnose Columnaris as much as anyone can do that online, or know which antibiotic is effective without making an antibiogram.
Were the new fish visibly affected when you bought them? What kind of species? Have you tested ammonia, nitrite, pH and such?

 

[fishorama]

You know, TL, that it is very expensive to test for any given disease. & the time it may take to find out what it is & what may be an effective treatment is also a possible death sentence...so I go with my experience in most fish disease matters. Columnaris actually presents itself in only a couple ways, the fast virulent form that probably can't be treated in time...& the slow "chronic" form that I've experienced.

I know you're a experienced aquarist. Have you, more than maybe once, successfully had a fish disease tested for it's exact disease & had time to treat it?

I go with a more triage method of diagnoses. What type is it likely to be & what can I reasonably do about it? ...before the fishes die...