New Setup - Advice and Questions

kveeti said:
And a word of caution. Make sure it's Bio Spira (would be in a refrigerated section, not on the shelf). Don't let the fish store talk you into buying a product named "Cycle" or other similar product. They don't work.

Re pH: The adjusters won’t keep your tank pH constant, you’ll still have to monitor and adjust frequently, and the swings will affect your fish. Add to that the problem of adjusting pH of new water to match while doing many large scale water changes – as is necessary when cycling with fish – makes it all that much more difficult.

The booklet I have with my ammonia test kit says ammonia “should not exceed 1.2 mg/L”. Even at a low pH, where their handy little chart is 'in the green', I personally would not let it get this high. I would do a water change as soon as it registered the lowest couple readings (0.1 and 0.3 on my chart) and therefore the higher pH reading is a moot point. If there is ANY detectable ammonia there is more than the bacteria can currently process, the cycle will continue, water changes will not slow it down.
Click to expand...

Excellent. I did some quick research and at least one LFS sells BioSpira. I am going to give some calls when they open to be sure they have it in stock, and if not, I'll place an order online (is the link bubbles provided a reputable online dealer?) with next day delivery.

Thanks for all the PH advice. Makes perfect sense that if your levels are where they should be, the state of the ammonia will not matter since it will (ideally) be converted as it's produced.

Just a couple more questions, I guess, before I make my calls and get out of work (in 8 hours, whee).

When I do the water changes during the cycling process, do I want to syphon the gravel as well, or just the water so I don't remove growing bacteria?

Since I am obviously now in a fishy cycle, once my ammonia ratings and nitrite ratings are at zero for a length of time (a week? 10 days?), how many fish can I add at a time, and does this induce a new cycle?

I was told that with fish the size of the ones I have (tiger barbs, cory cats, and gourami), my tank (38gal, 36x12x18) can ultimately hold 20-25 fish. Was this accurate?
 
Not to take away from your thread but I saw you have a 38 gallon tank like me and I looked at your pics at the link and I love how your tank is set up! Your plants are set up so NICE!

Can you tell me what kind of plants are those in the front ground cover? The really short ones about an inch or so tall? I can NEVER find short plants like those anywhere other then in "plant mat" form at petsmart. Yours look so good as accent plants in front. Where did you buy your short plants from?
 
Hijack away. ^^

I don't remember the brand offhand, but they came in 3-packs (I have 3 total packages, 9 plants) and were "Chain Amazons." I got them at my LFS. They are linkable to each other as well, and in fact come that way, but are easily separated. I preferred to spread them out more, rather than have 3 larger mats.
 
Bio Spira

Check with your LFS. When I bought the bio spira i put half in and the other half was refrigerated and put in a week later. I have a 55g tank and had no ammonia/nitrite probless. I do not remember the size of the bio spira pouch.
 
Clurin said:
I have been thinking of getting the Python system for doing my water changes. Is this a worthwhile product? How do you handle the dechlorinator (they gave me AmQuel, btw) while using the Python? Put in the AmQuel as I am refilling the tank?
Click to expand...

The pythons are awsome in my opinion. I'd recommend Prime over AmQuel and normally, I add the recommended amout right to the tank as I'm filling it. It would probably be better to mix it before it hits the tank, but I've never had any problem. Most people haven't.
 
Clurin said:
When I do the water changes during the cycling process, do I want to syphon the gravel as well, or just the water so I don't remove growing bacteria?

Since I am obviously now in a fishy cycle, once my ammonia ratings and nitrite ratings are at zero for a length of time (a week? 10 days?), how many fish can I add at a time, and does this induce a new cycle?

I was told that with fish the size of the ones I have (tiger barbs, cory cats, and gourami), my tank (38gal, 36x12x18) can ultimately hold 20-25 fish. Was this accurate?
Click to expand...

I hope somebody else will chime in, but this is what I would do (it’s been decades since I’ve had to cycle a tank)… I would siphon just over the top of gravel to get loose bits; you’ll still have plenty of ammonia without the breakdown of fish poop adding to it. Note, I have read, though, that bacteria are very firmly attached and normal cleaning won’t dislodge them.

Once your ammonia and nitrite are 0 for a few days (2? 3?) it would be safe to add fish. Add 1 to 2 at a time. You will have a mini-cycle. Test. Sometimes something will show up, other times it will be a little blip that won’t. Once you have a good bio filter going, it doesn’t take much time to catch up. You might have to do 1 or 2 extra water changes.

There are lots of stocking experts here; again I hope somebody else will give their views. But I think even 20 fish of that size would be pushing it, especially since the tiger barbs in particular are fast moving fish.
 
About adding fish ... it's all about about bio-load. If you have an established tank with one fish in it, adding one more fish doubles the bio-load on the tank. If you have an established tank that has 20 fish in it and you add one little tetra, the difference in the bio-load isn't all that much.

So when it comes to knowing how many fish to add at a time, it's more a question of how much extra maintenance do you want to do while the biofilter catches up to accomodate the load?

My rule of thumb is 25%. Usually you can increase the load by 25% and not notice a spike, but any more than that and you'll probably see a bit of a spike unless you've got a very well established tank. And fish numbers is not the only thing that increases the bioload. Some fish are just dirty fish. Oscars and goldfish come to mind. So adding one oscar can increase the bioload more than adding a few little danios or something like that.

I really think knowing how your bioload is going to change comes through trial and error. If you add fish and get ammonia, oops, you added more than the biofilter could handle and you'll have deal with the ammonia until the bacteria catch up.
 
Okay, update on the tank.

I purchased the following:

Ammonia Test Kit
Nitrite Test Kit
Nitrate Test Kit
25ft Python
3oz Bio-Spira

Tested the water:
PH 6.2-6.4
Ammonia 0.5ppm
Nitrite 0ppm
Nitrate 0ppm
Temp 84F

Changed out 25% of the water (WOW! The Python is AMAZING!)

Retest after a few minutes:
PH 6.4
Ammonia 0.25ppm
Nitrite 0ppm
Nitrate 0ppm
Temp 85F

Fed the fish some flakes and waited 10 minutes. Added the Bio-Spira. Will be retesting the water again in an hour, and probably in the morning before work.

The 3oz packet of Bio-Spira says for up to 90 gallons, and that you can't overdose a tank. This is correct, right? I didn't just innoculate my fish? :eek:

jay/kveeti: I see. Excellent. So, how do I tell when I've reached the limit for the tank? :confused:
 
Clurin said:
jay/kveeti: I see. Excellent. So, how do I tell when I've reached the limit for the tank? :confused:
Click to expand...

In theory, when you finally add a fish, get ammonia and can't get rid of it, you've maxed out your bio-filter. But, it's not just about how much waste the tank will accomodate. You want to think about what fish you have, how those species get along (or don't), where in the tank they live and the function they're providing ...

You've got tiger barbs, cory cats, and a gourami right?

Well, I'd love to help you out but I'm not not a barb/gourami person. I don't know enough about their behavior to know how they interact with each other and how much territory they need and where they typically place themselves in the tank. And those are the things you want to think about when you get fish.

If you've got a lot of fish that swim up high, it's best to add some bottom dwellers. If you've got very territorial fish, you have to be careful how many you put in or you'll have little fish wars all the time. Some fish are fin nippers. Some fish have nipable fins.

The best thing is to learn about the fish you have and to research any fish you're thinking about getting. You can always check back here for suggestions and to find out if what you read or what the lfs told you was correct.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
AquariaCentral.com
Top Bottom