OE-RFUG + Canisiter questions

[sypp]

We're upgrading from a 10 to a 75 gallon tank (48x18). A sale got us a Fluval 404 and and are going to also use RTR's OE-RFUG. Canisters and RFUG's are new to both of us. So we bought 2x Penguin 1140's w/reverse kits to drive the rfug so far, which should be arriving with the UG plate tomorrow.

Our current plan is to try for a clown loach tank with a small dither school, a pleco, etc. We bought the smallest natural looking gravel we could find at the LPS, and don't plan using real plants.

Our RFUG questions are:
- How much (relatively) would doing a second layer of filter floss help?
- How much (relatively) would a third (forth?) powerhead would help?
- How thick should we make the (fine) gravel over the OE-RFUG?
(We were thinking of 1-2" over top of eggcrate)
- We've read about the heat from running 4 powerheads?
(Our house is 68-72 year-round, and we were thinking of tank temp ~77)

Our Canister questions are:
- What do you recommend to put in these trays?

Our tap water qualities are as follows: (using Tetratest Loborette)
pH: 7.7
KH: 23 deg dH
GH: 26 deg dH (city spec. is ~400ppm)

Basic, buffered, and hard.

Our original thoughts were:

Tray 1: Filter Floss stuff for increased mechanical (ok to buy craft 100% poly batting instead of spendy filter floss?)
Tray 2: Some carbon for chemical (Was looking into peat also, but sounds like more mess/hassle than benefit?)
Tray 3: More floss material (prevent carbon/peat from entering system?)
Tray 4: Some Bio-surface for backup (over the RFUG) biological.

Any suggestions are welcome.

 

[FishHunter8]

I would stay away from UG at all cost. The fluval alone would be sufficient.

 

[sypp]

Rfug

Wife's always been a big fan of UG's (from back when), and I was the one that pushed for the RFUG. If it can cut her vacuuming time in half, then it was very worth it. She's busy enough with the two kids. :bowing:

Worth a shot anyhow.

 

[rrkss]

I have limited experience with UG filters but based on what I've read, RFUG is the way to go. Keeps the gravelbed oxygenated and pushes the detritus out of the gravel making a mechanical filter more effective. Maybe someone with more experience on this technology will confirm or refute this.

 

[RTR]

The second layer of bonded floss is icing on the cake, and IME only needed/desired with heavy bioloads (example: I used this for the 75 mbuna tank with massive rockwork so reduced water volume but lots of fish). I also used two layers for goldfish tanks with less than 30 gallons per fish. The second layer can be considered insurance, and with fish at the mass of Clown loaches, it might be acceptable/good practice if you do not object to the apparent increase in substrate depth, which it obviously is, and it does look thicker than the single layer.

I have not yet used 4 1160s in a 75. That would be one pump per 1.5 square feet of footprint. The one tank in which I have overheating issues has one pump per 1.25 square feet of footprint. That tank also has two internal mechanical-only filters, so the total wattage/square foot load is higher than you project with an external canister. Daveedka has more experience than I do with the higher powered tanks, and I don't believe he has any heating issues, but I'll let him detail his own experiences.

If the external canister you have is user-friendly I would use sponges-only as pure mechanical, with weekly rinsing of the enclosed media, just as with the 1160 prefilters.

My gravel beds atop the OE-RFUG are prety much tailored to the needs/desires of the setup. For planted tanks I do use deeper beds, for fish such as the mbuna, other Cichlids, or goldfish, just enough for them to play with atop the plastic grid/fiberglass mesh. I have never kept full adult Clowns (I trade them off midsized - I have not to date wanted to give them one of the big tanks for themselves, and am now too old for fish that will long outlive me ). Considering their size and lifespan, I'd go with the 1-2" atop the grid that you project.

 

[sypp]

Thanks for the input so far.

Since the UG plate is two pieces and they don't have a direct water-path between them (just figured that out today) it seems like an odd number of power-heads would only make since if an asymmetric balance of decor were used to maintain an even pump to unblocked-gravel ratio between the two plates. (off my rocker?) Given the choice of 2 or 4 uplift tubes we'd prefer to only try hiding the two.

Will one pump per 3 sq. ft. be enough to push through 2" of fine gravel? I suppose we can add more later, I just don't have an intuitive feel for this.

What would be a good progression for the fine-ness of the mechanical filtering? Or can it be done with just sponges? (supposed to be user friendly... we'll see)

Was thinking sponge > filter floss > micron filter pad...

Being paranoid (me), I think we'll keep a bio-surface in the last tray incase the rfug goes down.

 

[RTR]

IMHO, any biomedium in parallel w/RFUG is wasted space/effort. If you want to use a dual purpose medium, Eheim's Ehfimech is sold as a coarse mechanical medium, but it serves also a functional biosubstrate - it could be the base layer. On my 75 mbuna tank I did have only two pumps, but less gravel than you project, and it was standard commercial Estes stuff ('Nutmeg'). That tank did have a W/D sump in parallel, with bioballs in the tower, but the main purpose was to add water volume. Later I removed the tower and bioballs for use elsewhere, no detectable inoxidized metabolites ever showed. If I reset the same or similar setup today, I would use 4 pumps, and yes, they are a pain to hide. Nonetheless, the two pumps apparently were enough. Not I believe optimum, but workable.

My separate mechanical filters are mostly internal (another hard to hide item, plus additional heat load)and sponge based. If I were doing external, I would likely just pack with Ehfifix - a coarse mech medium with some surface-action holding ability beyound its apparent coarseness, then top with Ehfisynth for fine ploishing. All these are Eheim materials, but I'm sure other brands have comparable media available. All but the Ehfisynth are near-eternal, but that last needs replacement as it does not wash well. If graded sponges are available for your unit, use those.

Micron pads are fairly specific to a particular brand, and unlikely to perform well in other units. Clogs are standard. Personally I prefer a slightly large capture size and easier upkeep. The RFUG itself provides clearer water than most other filter options.