Ongoing battle with rescued Discus

[prolude006]

I noticed in the water report that only 1% of the water ever comes from the other water systems. It says 99% of the water is from the catskill watershed and that the other systems were shutdown or are shutdown most of the time. It also says they add flouride, sodium hydroxide because the catskill watershed resevoir starts out very corrosive, and they add a few other chemicals to stop metals from leaching in from old pipes.

I will see what I can find out from my cousin about his water, hopefully find a inexpensive solution for your water parameters.

I would not use the fizz tabs as a last resort, to me they are the last step as they will kill the infestation of multiple parasites, which usually discus have all at once.

 

[avionics30]

Sounds like something that might work! From what I understand, TDS and GH at the 200 mark is mainly for providing nutrients in the water for growing Discus. Discus that are grown, and ready to breed should have lower TDS, correct? I might seperate the herd if that's the case, since I have a mix in there right now.

If a temporary KH drop is ok with the Discus, then I may very well go the CC route instead of the Baking Soda route. Although, I've made a 4dKH solution for my Drop Checker already, it might not be too hard to figure out how much baking soda is needed to raise the dKH to 4 with a 50% water change.

I tested the water, and the pH is currently at 6.6-6.8 and the Nitrate is at 5-7ppm. I didn't bother to test the rest, since everytime I test, it's always 0. Do you think I need to do a GH test? That's probably the only thing that may increase, would be interesting to see.

I've read some of the other information that has been given to you and everyone is giving greta advice. I realize that you have a fixed budget and I'm attempting to assist you within your means. I wouldn't even try if I didn't think it was possible.

Anyway, yes, you need to check your GH to ensure that you have at least 8 to 12 degrees with your discus. You do not have to worry if you have adults mixed with the juvies. The only reason to soften your water is for breeding. Soft water stimulates breeding and is required for hatch out. With your setup and space restrictions, I would NOT try and breed these fish. You're going to run in to problems!

What I wold do for right now is reconstitute your water with a product such as RO right and possibly some baking soda or CC to bring the GH and KH in to resonable ranges respectively. Once you have your water right, you should be OK.

Oh, and to answer the question about the weird (wide) Ph swing...

With a KH of basically "0" anything that you add to the water for "treatment", as the water company does, that has ANY possible impact on Ph will cause it to swing wildly in one direction or another. That is why, through multiple test points they identified such a huge Ph range in their report. Your water will do the same in your tank. This is why we need to get your KH back on line.

Best wishes!

 

[Star_Rider]

One thing I missed, are you doing water changes while using the prazipro and or the jungle anti parasite tabs? Unfortunately you have to do one big water change and then not change any water for at least 5 days, even if you are growing out discus!! I had to do this myself so just checking. I would also suggest going with the epsom salts which will help the fish pass the infestations they have. There is a reason for using prazipro first and then the fizz tabs, first the liquid causes the parasites to loose control of their latch systems without causing internal injuries to the fish. That is really the only point to prazipro, the parasites dont actually die right away. The parasites will be weak from not feeding and then the fish will pass them at this point. The fizz tabs will then kill the parasites within the tank itself. With medicated foods you have no idea how much the fish are actually getting plus it dissolves in the tank as well so again what amount of medication are you dosing them with!!
You could try plants and use EI dosing, that may help your levels come up a bit, although your fish should get all the nutrients and minerals they need from their food, mine grow and breed fine with a tds of 65.
I would also check your kh again as my cousin just told me his is around 6 from the tap in NYC. Does your building use any other filters or treatments itself?
I have a question to, how does a ph range of 6.6 to 9.1 tell you anything about the carbonate hardness? The city adds sodium hydroxide to raise the ph from the catskill watershed as it is very corrosive. I would get an RO system and then add ro right as suggested, there is just too many things the city is putting in to make the water "safe"

I would love to discuss use of medications for internal parasites off line. but bar none the best delivery method for ridding internal parasites is ingested.

I have it from a very reliable source(read veterinarian)
bath, as in dosing the water, is used if the affected animal is not eating.

most meds will have their effect within 24-48 hrs (exception metronidazole which effective on protozoa and bacterial)and most parasites may reinfect within 2-3 weeks depending on gestation/incubation of the eggs since few meds will kill the eggs(exception if fenbendazole)

prazi is often used in conjunction with metro treating doses per directions with a 25% water change between doses can be repearted 48 hrs again 25% WC between doses..

shawn hang in there

 

[shawnhu]

I'll get to work on this once I have a strategy in place that best suits both myself and the fish. Onwards!

 

[avionics30]

I like your attitude!

Best wishes!

 

[shawnhu]

Thanks for all the support from everyone, I'll update as I go along.

Chad, I may not have enough room for an ugly bin sitting around to do water changes, but I can probably sneak in a 20 in my bedroom or something for breeding! Hey, if they wanna pop em out, I can't say no, right?

 

[avionics30]

Ooooohh. I'd be really careful about breeding. You're going to need at least a 20 (tall)gallon for a breeding pair. I use 29 gallon tanks. If and when you do have fry, you'll need, IMO, at least a 55 for grow out. Attempting to grow out 80 to 200 fry in a 20 gallon is NOT a good idea. You'll have disease simply due to population and you'll have to do several water changes daily. Wish I had a better solution for you.

Best wishes!

 

[shawnhu]

Chad, appreciate your concerns. I actually made a pact with a good friend of mine. If I am as lucky as to successfully breed a pair, he would give up his 55 gallon. Although I can't take on a new tank, his tank would pretty much be mine, but at his home. I'm sure he won't mind taking care of the babies, and keeping most of them for himself. Now if you I had multiple pairs that was breeding, I would be in trouble.

Think it'll work?

 

[avionics30]

Well You would likely still need at least a 20H to 29 gallon for the pair to breed in. Once you have fry, the 55 would be a great grow out tank, assuming that your friend wants that BIG responsibility. Grow out from smaller than penny size is not that easy. Lots of water changes and feedings!

I'm not saying that a pair could not actually produce a fry bearing spawn in your tank, it's just not recommended especially in a bare bottom tank. IMO planted tanks or large (100+ gallon) tanks that offer seperation and privacy to breeding pairs typicall work best especially with other discus in the same tank. Like I said above, breeding is usually done in bare bottom 20 to 29 gallon (or bigger) tanks with just the pair. I guess you'll just have to see what happens! I've never done that in your size tank before.

Best wishes!

 

[prolude006]

I would love to discuss use of medications for internal parasites off line. but bar none the best delivery method for ridding internal parasites is ingested.

I have it from a very reliable source(read veterinarian)
bath, as in dosing the water, is used if the affected animal is not eating.

most meds will have their effect within 24-48 hrs (exception metronidazole which effective on protozoa and bacterial)and most parasites may reinfect within 2-3 weeks depending on gestation/incubation of the eggs since few meds will kill the eggs(exception if fenbendazole)

prazi is often used in conjunction with metro treating doses per directions with a 25% water change between doses can be repearted 48 hrs again 25% WC between doses..

shawn hang in there

I have to disagree with ingested meds method in this case. He has multiple sick fish in the tank. I would med the whole tank and kill the parasites as fast as possible to get to the water changes sooner than later. The faster the fish are healthy the less chance they will be reinfected regardless of parasites present in the tank. The bullied or stressed discus are the ones that usually succumb to sickness. I will have to check this discussion over on Simply to see what some of them think in this case.
Imo only of course. I recently had the same problem with my discus and found the prazipro then fizz tabs method was cheap, quick and easy to do.
My fish made a great turn around.