Plant nutrition vs bio load:Aquaponics

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Daenimus

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Oct 19, 2008
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First off I want to say hello, its been a while since I've posted anything, and it wasn't anything this "advanced". I'd also like to say I'm new to this in practice but I've done lots of reading and I usually retain it well.
Secondly; I didn't know where else to start this thread, I figured planted tank enthusiasts would need to know about plant nutrition.

I want do what some might call aquaponics, I want to use fish waste for plant food. I was thinking of describing it like a tank with a really big refugium, for the biological cycle. Plumbing and delivery still up in the air.

This video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3IryIOyPfTE has a lot of the delivery methods I have in mind. Of all the information I've collected one are that I have nearly nothing on is bio load, how much "food" does a plant need and how much "waste" does a fish create that can turn into "food" for said plant. Also, is there anything different in terms of nutrition and biology I would need to be concerned about with plants that aren't "aquatic" plants?

General info https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26xpMCXP9bw I'd like to try this with tropical fish...ie indoors.
 
What's your primary purpose, nutrient reduction in an aquatic system, or the production of biomass?
 
Oh more of the hobby of keeping fish and growing something for now. I like the idea of using nature's cycle to keep the fish healthy and a plant fed.

I guess I'm honestly doing it more for the hobby but if I could produce something edible would be cool...an herb garden might be relatively productive for something small, that would be cool. So nothing farmy like those videos. I don't want to get into that kind of money....yet

Its hard to tell how many plants or what volume of water in all those big farm fish grows do. There are people on here with very very dense and beautiful planted tanks, the amount of nutrition they use should be at least on the same order of magnitude as an herb gardens nutritional needs?
 
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Ok you have realistic expectations! Herbs are exactly what I would grow, because producing weight of anything requires more weight of nutrient input, and herbs give a lot of bang for their weight. Trying to keep fish as the primary source of nutrients in a vegetable garden is another world entirely! Something as simple as a powerhead on a timer, feeding a tray resting on the tank in a sunny window would work.
 
SubRosa said:
Ok you have realistic expectations! Herbs are exactly what I would grow, because producing weight of anything requires more weight of nutrient input, and herbs give a lot of bang for their weight. Trying to keep fish as the primary source of nutrients in a vegetable garden is another world entirely! Something as simple as a powerhead on a timer, feeding a tray resting on the tank in a sunny window would work.
Click to expand...

My concerns are the garden would starve then I'd be scared to feed it without hurting the fish. Well lets say I didn't upgrade in size, I have a 20g thats been empty. Could I keep safe stock levels in a 20g to feed a plant. I know that sounds counter intuitive but I feel there is more than just the fish waste to stocking. Also I'm sure there is something in fish waste that the plants don't break down or do it too slowly for that bio load and could reach toxic levels with over stocking. I was thinking hearty small fish like neon tetras, I've read they have a really wide pH tolerance, pH is another concern but a small one.
 
I guess total volume of water would be a good amount more than the 20g that the fish would occupy, I don't know how much bigger until plumbing is worked out.
 
You can definitely stock much more heavily, and would want to if production is a priority. If you're just trying to make your fish happier, you could simply add a small tray to the system. You'll want to monitor key nutrients such as nitrate, phosphate, and perhaps iron to see who's winning the nutrient wars, the producers or the consumers.
 
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@plantbrain, wow that's sexy. That would be considered a riparium? I think that's the term I was seeing.

I think this might be one of those things that you scale as you go. I think I'll start and get a tank cycling, with filtration that can be removed/turned on/off, check chemistry. Add fish after cycling and check chemistry, add plant load, I'm thinking of a spray or drip system in nutrient-less intert media, check chemistry. Turn filtration on timer/ween off and check chemistry. In theory moving the bio filtration from filter to plant's growing media. I also considered slowly scaling fish feeding up and down to dial in after stocking. I think a nice big school of tetras would be nice. I also could control plant food consumption with light control.
 
I do not do any water changes, I dose about once a week, very light. I use the fastest growing weeds as my test mostly N, to tell when if I need to dose more/less etc.
I have a wet/dry filter and you can see the Mame overflow, all glass.

I removed the Anubias recently and added all Buce's. This will be the 4th incarnation. It's a riparium, bit the water level is at the top. Trimming is easier this way.
Plants have a utilitarian function, yet they also have an aesthetic function that is of likely higher value.
So blending both is often sot by Hobbyist.

This looks like something you might find in Cameroon in a stream.

You would have really overload things, possible etc, with fish waste, but you also need a heavy duty filter to convert the NH4 to NO3 if the plants cannot get it all at once.
Limits: about 3-4ppm per day of NO3, or about 0.8 ppm per day of NH4 or a mix thereof. Emergent plants grow faster than submersed. But have less water and more lignin etc in the stems, leaves etc. So the total dry weight biomass is fairly higher than mere appearances.
No CO2 issues, algae, you can dose minimally and use one plant, pennywort is real good, for N control.
 
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