Please explain ammonia removers.

mathchris

mathchris

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Aug 18, 2005
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Brooklyn NY
www.chrisramey.com
I bought a bottle of "pH 7.0 Seachem Neutral Regulator". For only a few dollars this bottle treats 500-1000 gallons, incredible! It ajusts pH, treats tap water & removes ammonia. It seems like the best deal on the market & I used it for a few months when my fish were in their 20 gallon. Once they outgrew the 20 & I started cycling the new 65 gal, I read a lot about cycling & ammonia & then I couldn't figure out why I would ever use an ammonia remover. A few months went by & I tried it out in the 65 & within the week the water was cloudy (bacteria bloom?).

I read over & over again to not use ammonia removers while you cycle. I sort of understand why. But when do you use them?

...only if I get a reading of ammonias in the water from a test kit?

Does anyone else use this product?

My pH is off (save that for a different thread), is a neutral regulator chemical not as good as a pH "up" or "down" chemistry?
 
You really shouldn't use chemical pH regulators in your tank. They cause instability and a lot of ups and downs, as you've seen. Fish can adjust to pH, so long as it's not in the extremes and there are very few people who have pH in the extreme range. What fish can't adapt to is constant changes in pH.

If it's a cycled tank and you are doing regular water changes, you shouldn't be seeing ammonia in your tank unless you have chloramines in your tap water. Water conditioner (the "proper" ones like Prime and Amquel +) break down the bond between chlorine and ammonia (chloramine), removes the chlorine and turns the ammonia into a harmless ionized form that can still be used by the bacteria in your tank, but is harmless to your fish.

If you do see a spike in ammonia, then you have a problem and using chemicals will only mask it. Ammonia = nitrites. Ammonia can't be removed, it's just changed into a different form and it will *still* be processed into nitrites, which are even more deadly to your fish.

Can you post what your readings are: ammonia, nitrites, nitrates and your pH *without* any chemicals added?

From the tank and the tap, please.

Thanks
Roan
 
This Seachem product just seems so economical for all that it can do. I needed more experienced people telling me if it's not good to use & why.
I hear what you're saying about the chemicals.

My Ammonia, Nitrate & Nitrite levels are fine, my question was more general about the product.

Recently though, I am having a problem with my water being too soft & pH dropping. This is probably due to my snail overpopulation. I'm going to try either supplementing calcium for the snails or using limestone. That discussion is at this thread.
 
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You really need to mention that you are using that SeaChem stuff in the other thread. It could account for some of the pH drop problems you are having.

I'm going to link it in, if you don't mind.

Roan
 
Ph regulators are a good thing, they hold ph steady. Ph adjusters, like ph up or ph down are bad for the fluctuation thing. That being said, if you have good buffering capacity from your tap water, I wouldn't use it because I don't like to add any more chemicals then I have too.

In my case, my tap water has almost no buffering capacity so I need to add a buffer.
I have used seachem neutral regulater for about 4 months. Ph never changed. The ammonia remover is not meant to remove ammonia produced by fish, its intended to remove the ammonia produced by the breakdown of chloramins.
 
joephys said:
Ph regulators are a good thing, they hold ph steady. Ph adjusters, like ph up or ph down are bad for the fluctuation thing. That being said, if you have good buffering capacity from your tap water, I wouldn't use it because I don't like to add any more chemicals then I have too.

In my case, my tap water has almost no buffering capacity so I need to add a buffer.
I have used seachem neutral regulater for about 4 months. Ph never changed. The ammonia remover is not meant to remove ammonia produced by fish, its intended to remove the ammonia produced by the breakdown of chloramins.
Click to expand...
You might be better off using crushed coral instead of chemicals. Everything you throw in your tank adds to the TDS. Coral contains a lot of stuff that fish/plants can actually use.

Roan
 
Ammonia detoxifiers, IMO, are to be used ONLY when there is an emergency that results in an ammonia spike over and above what the bacteria would normally handle. for example, if someone drops an entire can of food into the tank--an immedaite water change and substrate cleaning would resolve it. If the CAT does this at 9 AM and it's undiscovered until 5:30 that night, it's likely that immediate water changes won't completely resolve the problem, so using a detoxifier, in addition to the water change, will help. You know the source of the ammonia, remove as much as you can, and use chemical treatment as insurance.

Otherwise, I don't use them at all, nor the chemical medias (which work differently--they actually bind the ammonia to the media, so it's completely unavailable for bacteria). All are emergency treatments only.
 
as stated in other posts. ammonia is usually not an issue in a cycled and well cared for aquarium.

ammonia removers do not remove the ammonia..they use chemicals to lock the ammonia up..making it safer for the tank.
if I remember correctly,, chem compounds are constantly looking to become stable.
in the case of 'ammonia removers' these compounds seek out ammonia. the ammonia attaches itself to the compound and becomes more stable and less toxic(for lack of better terms) . supposedly, the ammonia is safe for fish and still usable by the bacteria which are needed to conver the ammonia to nitrite..
another bacteria will then convert the nitrite to nitrates...nitrates are kept in check with water changes(tho some plants use nitrates). fyi, during the nitrite spike many folks add a bit of salt to the tank..this usually reduces the nitrite uptake by the fish until the bacteria can catch up and turn it into nitrate.

I think that's how it works :confused:
 
Gah?! I barely understand that post (edit, that would be post #8), but if I get it correctly, you're saying that you use them because they're inexpensive? Do they cost more than free? If so, you're overpaying. Ammonia is removed by nitrifiers free of charge, so why spend money on something unecessary?

Same goes for "neutral regulator". pH regulators do not "hold pH steady", as the name implies, they force the pH to a particular level and hold it there. Buffers hold pH steady, or, by definition, buffer the pH. So the operative question remains: what is your KH? As far as a commercial buffer goes, Seachem's Neutral Regulator may be a good deal, but what are you buying, and why? If your water has an adequate buffer, you're good. If it's a tad on the low side, you'll need to keep up with regular water changes and/or stock more lightly than someone with highly alkaline water. Also, you can just buy a little crushed coral or Aragonite, put 3-4 table spoons in a mesh baggie or cutoff nylon. A couple dollars worth of crushed coral will last you a year plus, depending on where you live and the local price.

We've already covered the ammonia binders, so only the dechlorinator is left. You can pick up dechlorinator dirt cheap, depending on your needs. Are there chloramines in your tap water? If not, buy the cheapest, simplest available: around here that's Insto Chlor by Jungle, about $3 CAD for a 2 oz. bottle treating at 2 drops per gallon. However, I'm also ordering some sodium thiosulfate which will allow me (and you too!) to reduce this to about $0.03 CAD per bottle at the up-front cost of about $15 CAD after shipping.

Recipe:
6 grams thiosulfate per 200 mL water
a pinch of baking soda to raise pH (thiosulfate is degraded by H+, the baking soda extends the lifetime of the dechlorinator)

That's it. Add 1 drop or more of this per gallon of water to be treated.
 
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