Possible dropsy?

[Cerianthus]

Dont worry about the color of the water if the other ingredient, if any, in API Fungus Cure which I am not familar with may assist in healing.

I guess you can google for more info on other ingredient(s). Check the back of the package.

Although Acriflavine concentration may be low, I would take measure not to expose your skin to acriflavine. Everybody may react differently to exposure/contact with skin.

Check API Fungus Cure MSDS (Material Safety Data Sheet) FYI.

Since we have tool (search engine), why not use it to our advantage. Little extra steps taken by you can assist you and your fish better. I know, it is easy as most of us are nota chemist or biochemist.

I google for Nala-Gram (Nalidixic Acid) by API and I cant find it anymore. I guess it has been discontinued as it is not that well known to hobbyists.

Only problem I see is that right type of medications from Fish Pharmaceutical Co may have Oxolinic Acid or other med not so readily avail, only in bulk quantity.
Thus if and when possible, try to look for readily avail Oxytetracycline which is my secondary choice. If this is difficult, I will go for Maracyn Two, minocycline, which is another derivative of tetracycline.

If all of above is not possible, could try Kanamycin/Neomycin/Gentamycin as these aminoglycosides can be absorbed thru gill into bloodstream (for internal organ infecton/failure).

Like I said before , if you think adding salt to water has shown some reduction in body cavity, contunue the procedure (Osmosis).

Hope all goes well.

 

[Onna Shinigami]

Figured I would give him a chance, as long as he's eating and still moving around. Fed a bit of flake and caught him coming up to snag a few bites so I might try soaking the pellets before feeding tomorrow.

Onna

 

[Lupin]

If all of above is not possible, could try Kanamycin/Neomycin/Gentamycin as these aminoglycosides can be absorbed thru gill into bloodstream (for internal organ infecton/failure).

Where did you get this info? Interesting recommendation of kanamycin to a renal failure case.

 

[Cerianthus]

Figured I would give him a chance, as long as he's eating and still moving around. Fed a bit of flake and caught him coming up to snag a few bites so I might try soaking the pellets before feeding tomorrow.

Onna

I guess med you are using is not the API Fungus Cure.

Hope all goes well!

 

[Cerianthus]

Where did you get this info? Interesting recommendation of kanamycin to a renal failure case.

As precise cause(s) of this illness is not completely determined, my assumption on first few med was based on renal fuction failure but this symptoms can be the result of other possible infection caused by Mycobacterium infection on other visceral organs which may contribute to collection of fluid.
Thus Kanamycin was the last easily obtainable med recommended.
If memory serves, same or similar symptoms are displayed by other non related malfunction of their regulatory systems, not just kidney.

If your assumption is based on hobby level fish disease book, there are other research datas avail which may be too complicated to go in detail here and I dont remember/comprehend all the details and even terms anymore.

 

[Onna Shinigami]

Check on the guy this afternoon while fixing lunch. He looked ok this morning when I fed everyone but he ended up not making it. Though I did give it my best shot at trying to treat him. I'll make sure I pick the meds recommended here in the next few days to have in stock just gotta wait until bills are paid first. The other 2 females are doing fine and I'll keep them in the tank for another week or 2 before putting them in the main tank.


Onna

 

[Reframer]

Truth is that once they start pineconing, they very rarely make it, so economicaly and ethically it doesn't make sense to put the fish through such meds.
But I can understand why you would want to try anyhow. Sorry.

 

[Lupin]

As precise cause(s) of this illness is not completely determined, my assumption on first few med was based on renal fuction failure but this symptoms can be the result of other possible infection caused by Mycobacterium infection on other visceral organs which may contribute to collection of fluid.
Thus Kanamycin was the last easily obtainable med recommended.
If memory serves, same or similar symptoms are displayed by other non related malfunction of their regulatory systems, not just kidney.

If your assumption is based on hobby level fish disease book, there are other research datas avail which may be too complicated to go in detail here and I dont remember/comprehend all the details and even terms anymore.

Cerianthus, with all due respect to you, just because kanamycin is the last and easily obtainable med recommended (recommended by whom?), that does NOT make it any better than the option to try metronidazole which is safer the kanamycin itself. Kanamycin is nephrotoxic to fish with organ damage in case you are forgetting this. It simply aggravates the issue. How will you prove the renal damage was somehow involved especially as this is internal? Always err on the side of caution UNLESS you can arrange an appointment with an aquavet to have the fish under scan to see what was involved.

My assumptions are based on experience and archival abstracts cited from various vets such as Dr. Helen Roberts, Dr. Erik Johnson of Koivet, and Dr. Greg Lewbart. Being a member of one forum where vets are often enlisted for help, I am aware which meds would prove more damaging and which does not HENCE why I suggested to start metro first as a precaution since it's an antibiotic that has recorded improvements in few cases of dropsy.

Whether the fish's scales are protruding or not despite noticeable bloating, I do NOT see why one should give up hope and proceed to euthanasia. It's your OWN fish so for anyone to suggest euthanasia immediately, that is UNFAIR for those who truly are up for giving their own fish a chance for another lease of life.

I am so sorry to hear that, Onna.

 

[Cerianthus]

Lupin,

I am well aware of toxicity of aminoglycosides. Maybe not in detail anymore but at least I can remember to some degree. As day passes by, it does not get any easier though.
Unfortunately, most of us are not equipped with proper appartus and/or facility to correctly identified pathogenic microbeS. SO we depends on info avail + training some may have received. Thus my choices of med as explained earlier. And as you probably know, there are always possibility of side effects with any med depending on species..
One has to weigh the pro and cons.

My view on euthanizing fish: Why not try whatever you can in effort to learn from suffering/dying fish with a hope that one can obtain info which can save many fish down the road. Who knows, that last extra effort one rendered may yield successful recovery as I am sometimes amazed how well fish can recover, sometimes mostly on its own.

My info is not just based on literatures but also many many experiements I ran, just like you, based on facts obtained thru schooling and assistance of friends who were/are in pharmaceutical and veterinary field.

As far as Metronidazole, I did not find it be effective against bloating/dropsy + the literature backed it up. I think it may be in Merck Manual also..

Even with proper treatment, higher mortality rates yielded when treated at later stage of illness.

I appreciate the argument as I will always leave open mind since this can lead me to learn something new or even help me remember some things I forgot.

As I spend more time on the forums, I am seriously contemplating returning to fish industry. I visited one local facility of old colleague of mine todqy and was informed that they may want to really expand S/W and dedicate one room for corals.
Hope something works out as I enjoy/enjoyed working with aquatic life forms.

Onna, Sorry for your loss!

BTW, do you know the meaning of Shinigami?