Question on Dosing Mg + Ca

Manganeese is a different element (Obviously) and is contained at appropriat levels in most trace mixes. I have some and dosed it but it made no difference. Magnesium is necessary in much higher quantities. While I am a huge fan of Gregg Watson, I do not by my magnesium from him MgSo4 is Epsom salts. I can get a 5 pound carton at Meijers for next to nothing. Go get some Epsom Salts and use that.

CaCo3 is calcium Carbonate the same as your crushed coral. It will increase Calcium as well as Kh when used. CaCl Calcium chloride will increase your calcium without effecting your Kh. Additionally CaCl will dissolve much faster and not add the cloudiness that The calcium Carbonate does.
I use both because I can get the Kh I want Long before I get the calcium I need. My tanks are at about 100-120 ppm Ca, but I am still struggling with plants. Calcium has definately improved my plants, but I have been hesitant to take it too High. If you are having good luck at 160 ppm I may want to raise mine some as well when time for proper testing permits.

Dave
 
My plant book says that it's (Mn) usually present in sufficient amounts in tap water, but it doesn't say that over dosing is bad, which it does say about some other trace elements (I suppose you can take that for what its worth).

Mg is a macronutrient so it needs a pretty good amount of that. It also says though, that if there is too much it can hinder uptake of other nutrients, espically potassium, and that potassium deficiency is often due to too much Mg in the water.

Source: Encyclopedia of Aquarium plants, Peter Hiscock.
 
I agree with Dave in that the CaCl does dissolve much faster and is easier to work with. Based on my experience I'm not using much of it anymore.
In my experience it is much easier to get the calcium to dissolve if it is mixed and poured separately from the Mg.
As you can see, many of us have much divergent outcomes with this element. It will be interesting to hear how it affects your tanks.

Len
 
daveedka said:
Manganeese is a different element (Obviously) and is contained at appropriat levels in most trace mixes. I have some and dosed it but it made no difference.
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Greg replied that either my stuff was labled incorrectly, or I was accidentally shipped a wrong bag. He is resending on Monday.

Magnesium is necessary in much higher quantities. While I am a huge fan of Gregg Watson, I do not by my magnesium from him MgSo4 is Epsom salts. I can get a 5 pound carton at Meijers for next to nothing. Go get some Epsom Salts and use that.
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I *was* using that, but the Epsom Salts crystals at my grocery store are huge and a royal pita to measure and dissolve. I had to use a pestal and mortar to get them down to a managable size just to measure them out properly.

Greg's Mg is only .85 per pound, actually cheaper than the grocery store, and since I already had an order in, I added some to my cart.

CaCo3 is calcium Carbonate the same as your crushed coral. It will increase Calcium as well as Kh when used. CaCl Calcium chloride will increase your calcium without effecting your Kh. Additionally CaCl will dissolve much faster and not add the cloudiness that The calcium Carbonate does.
I use both because I can get the Kh I want Long before I get the calcium I need.
Click to expand...
Excellent -- so my reasoning for using that was correct. I've ordered some CaCl from Greg already and will mix as you do. If I don't get the desired result, I will probably retain the crushed coral and just use CaCl.

My tanks are at about 100-120 ppm Ca, but I am still struggling with plants. Calcium has definately improved my plants, but I have been hesitant to take it too High. If you are having good luck at 160 ppm I may want to raise mine some as well when time for proper testing permits.
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I'm going to start taking pictures of the vals this weekend.

The 20g tank with no CO2 is going to be my experimental tank. I'm going to get the calcium levels up on par with my "good" tanks *before* I start adding CO2. I want to make sure it's the calcium level and not the lack of CO2 that is causing the twisty, sick-looking leaves. Lighting is around 3.25wpg and I leave the lights on for about 8-10 hours or so. It sits on my desk beside my monitor.

If I see any improvement in the leaves, then I'll start CO2 injection.

Roan
 
I realize you guys have way more light than I do.

But what PPM do you raise your : ( recommended )

Nitrate ( 10-20 )
phosphate (.5-2 )
pottasium ( 10-20 )
calcium ( 10-30 )
Magnesium ( 2-5 )
Iron (.1 )

If you're raising Ca to be 160 ppm then you'd have to carry Mg up, and I'd suppose all the others should follow. How do you figure the ratios? Just in examples I've read at low levels Ca to Mg is 5:1 but as Ca goes up the ratio does also, higher levels are 8:1. 160 ppm is over 5 times the recommended level so would you suppose the ratio would be closer to 15:1 ?

I'm guessing most of you go high and then drop down till you see the level at which they start to suffer, then jump back up a level.

I'd still like to know what levels you guys are at so maybe I can flirt around. Like Roan, I'm a little nervous about adding much ferts. I add close to the high levels recommended now and some plants look great while others look like they could use some help.

NOT meant to be a hijacking!
 
Ice (and Others)

Not ignoring your advice/replies! Just working on some stuff and trying to get my tanks in order. Been sick with the flu and behind on my water changes! I haven't changed out two of my rainbow tanks in 6 days! Okay, don't laugh, but that's how I am :)

I also have three tanks that are CO2-less because of a manifold problem and I HAVE to get the CO2 running again before the algae finds out.

Soon as I get caught up there, I'll get caught up here.

Roan
 
chefkeith said:
'Manganese...A lot of people don't even know what that is.'


-Carl Spackler, Caddyshack.
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ROFL!
I don't remember that line from Caddy Shack. What was it in reference to? And don't say "manganese, of course!" :D

Roan
 
djlen said:
I agree with Dave in that the CaCl does dissolve much faster and is easier to work with. Based on my experience I'm not using much of it anymore.
In my experience it is much easier to get the calcium to dissolve if it is mixed and poured separately from the Mg.
Click to expand...
This is good to know. Thanks, I'll mix separately

As you can see, many of us have much divergent outcomes with this element. It will be interesting to hear how it affects your tanks.
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I think it probably comes down to the types of plants in the tank. You've a lot of crypts, I think? And Dave and John have a lot of red stem plants, like I do. It's mostly the reds I want to bring the colors out on and they've indicated success with higher Ca dosing.

I like crypts, but you pointed out to me that Cryptocorne ciliata is a low light plant (although I read otherwise), and based on the growth rate I was getting, you are probably correct. I opted to remove it since the darn thing just grows too big to shade in most cases.

I'm just surprised none of those crypts melted on me.

Roan
 
I don't remember that line from Caddy Shack. What was it in reference to? And don't say "manganese, of course
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I believe chevy Chase Was playing through the apartment, and Carl Was explaining what he was studying so he could become head Greenskeeper someday. It was somewhere between the shtgunning the "fatty" and hitting the bottle. Either way it was one of the better scenes in Caddy shack.


Dave
 
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