Questions about eco-complete (please read)

[cohazard]

I'm setting up the 80g I bought a few days ago and it's going to be a planted tank. I've heard of a lot of people using eco-complete in their planted tank, and I was just wondering if there is anything special it does for plants, or if it's just black gravel with the nitrifying bacteria already living on it.

I've already put half of the substrate in the tank (half of the aquarium has a layer of normal black gravel covered in black sand), and the other half of the tank is bare. I did this because IF eco-complete isn't just cultured gravel in a bag, and actually contains stuff plants need, I'll buy some online and put it as the bottom layer on that side of the tank, and then cover it with black sand.

But if I do that, will the bacteria that's on the eco-complete spread to the rest of the gravel? Thanks in advance.



Serg

 

[TPIRman]

The bacteria on the Eco-Complete are novel but not critical to tank establishment, and they definitely aren't nitrifying bacteria. Those still must be produced the hard way, with a bottle of clear ammonia and patience.

EC is a good plant substrate because of its mineral content (esp. iron) and its high cation exchange capacity (CEC), which essentially means that it allows plants to extract nutrients from the water through the roots.

In my (far from extensive) experience, EC is a superb plant substrate. Flourite, Onyx, Flora Base and others offer similar benefits, but YMMV and like you, I've heard a great deal of good about EC from other aquarists. Flourite has a large following, too, but EC has the added benefit of being far more attractive in my opinion -- but that is getting into more subjective territory. Choice of substrate is nearly as contentious as choice of canister filter, and for the same reason: there's more than one quality product out there.

The bacteria that come in the EC bag constitute an interesting footnote but are basically irrelevant to the success of a planted tank.

EC won't do much for your plants as the bottom layer of the substrate. You'd definitely want it on the top. I don't know if that fits into your plans or not at this point since you have already laid down half of the substrate, but just don't expect EC to work wonders from the bottom of the tank. The plants need to be in contact with the EC when putting down roots in order to fully harness its benefits.

If you want a black-sand look, you might try Onyx Sand from Seachem, which is another good plant substrate. It's more "dark gray" than black, but it might be a good compromise between appearance and plant health.

You can, of course, grow plants in plain sand -- the addition of laterite and substrate ferts would help -- but if you are putting together a serious planted tank, I think it would be best to get things right from the start and choose a substrate that is designed to boost plant growth.

HTH.

-John

 

[cohazard]

Thanks John, that helps a lot!. I had planned on putting the EC on the bottom because I've heard of plants not staying anchord well in the sand, and my theory was that if I pushed the roots to the bottom where the EC was, they would get a much better grip.

Since you've suggested putting EC as the top layer.............yeah it's a little out of line with what i had planned (EC bottom, nothing but 'tahitian moon' on top) but I started realizing that the sand and gravel would eventually get mixed up anyways . But this is kind of a good thing. I wont get the 'all sand' look that I wanted, but it means that I'll finish the bottom with the normal gravel and the sand, and then cover it in EC!

I do plan on making this a serious planted tank *looks at 80g* so I want to do things right. Here's my very first serious planted tank, a 10g nano:

Just on a side note, can you give me some help with the lighting for the 80g? I was looking at ahsupply.com but none of their kits give me the ammount of light I want. Thanks in advance.





Serg

 

[cdawson]

I too just started using EC in my new apistogramma tank, it's much more attractive than laterite and offers more in the way of nutrients for your plants. Any planted tanks I plan on setting up from now on will be having EC as a substrate. As for the bacteria in the substrate, I've had my tank setup for two and a half weeks and it was cycled after a week. Possibly you got dried out or popped bags? There was a bacteria bloom on day 5 and since then I've had nitrate readings of about 2ppm at the most. 0 amm and 0 nitrite.

 

[phanmc]

Quite a alot of people mix EC with tahitian moon because tahitian moon has a finer grain and looks nicer. Having a thin layer of tahitian moon on top isn't going to be a problem since you'll want to bury most rooted plants pretty deep so they don't get uprooted. Eventually, the sand and EC will mix but it will still look very nice.

 

[cdawson]

Originally posted by SoCalSunset
Thanks John, that helps a lot!. I had planned on putting the EC on the bottom because I've heard of plants not staying anchord well in the sand, and my theory was that if I pushed the roots to the bottom where the EC was, they would get a much better grip.

Since you've suggested putting EC as the top layer.............yeah it's a little out of line with what i had planned (EC bottom, nothing but 'tahitian moon' on top) but I started realizing that the sand and gravel would eventually get mixed up anyways . But this is kind of a good thing. I wont get the 'all sand' look that I wanted, but it means that I'll finish the bottom with the normal gravel and the sand, and then cover it in EC!

I do plan on making this a serious planted tank *looks at 80g* so I want to do things right. Here's my very first serious planted tank, a 10g nano:

Just on a side note, can you give me some help with the lighting for the 80g? I was looking at ahsupply.com but none of their kits give me the ammount of light I want. Thanks in advance.





Serg

I highly recommend the JBJ series of lights, there should be a strip large enough for an 80g. What's the measurement of length? Although I think 65w x 4 is the highest you can get with JBJ. BY far the best lights on the market aside from metal hallide lamps.

 

[TPIRman]

Originally posted by cdawson
As for the bacteria in the substrate, I've had my tank setup for two and a half weeks and it was cycled after a week. Possibly you got dried out or popped bags?

That would have been messy! All three of my bags were in pristine condition. I say that the bacteria are not nitrifying bacteria (i.e., not nitrospira) because those bacteria would not survive for long without food and oxygen, or refrigeration. I'd attribute your fast cycle not to the substrate, but rather to a light fish load and, of course, the fact that there are plants in the tank to gobble up ammonia.

The EC bacteria are probably good for something, but CaribSea's claim that the bacteria speed the cycle of your tank is dubious.

(Edit: Cleaned up a mess of a sentence)

 

[cohazard]

I haven't actually seen a bag up close (that's why I'm asking my peers). I didn't even know CaribSea claimed that it sped up the cycle! What I meant by "will the bacteria spread?" is whatever good stuff is on the EC that helps plants, will that spread? My guess is that it probably wont (the main good thing is the iron right?). Since I still need to spend a lot of time looking for the best lighting setup, I'll wait on the EC.

I filled in the rest of the bottom with the normal black gravel and more black sand. I wish I hadn't put any gravel at all in there because it sounds like my idea of putting the EC on the bottom would've actually worked because I planed on planting the plants all the way to the bottom (I hate it when I don't go with my gut! ). If worst comes to worst, I'll pull all of the gravel out and start all over (what a waste of $70 that would be!:laugh: ).

My stepmom gave me some ugly unwanted mollies from her tank so I could cycle the 80g. I wish I would've said no, since I don't like cycling with normal fish (however ugly they may be, actually she gave me some marble mollies that are actually pretty cool). My original plan was to use feeder goldfish to cycle it, and medicate the water after the cycle was finished, and before adding any permanent fish in case the feeders had any diseases and what not. Anyways, getting off topic, thanks for the help .




Serg