Raising pH with Coral or baking soda - I need some help

LMOUTHBASS

My hypocrisy goes only so far
Jun 17, 2003
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Mark
Hi guys - I have been reading tons of stuff online and I'm not quite sure what to think.

In my 55 gallon, my pH is always under 6. I've had a few cases of cloudy eye/and or some fungus on a few different fish and over the past week have had a few full grown, healthy Corys drop dead (no symptoms).

Some have suggested that the low ph could be a problem and that it could be stressing the fish and weakening them.

The fish that have had problems are/were newer to the tank... a few weeks.

So, I'm thinking about attempting to raise the ph. I want to do this slowly and naturally if possible.

I have read that adding crushed coral to the HOB will do this. My questions is how much should I use on a tank of this size?

Also, my LFS suggested baking soda. For some reason this makes me nervous... how should this be done and what is the dose, should I decide to try this?

I also have been treating the tank with Furozol for the cloudy eye issue. But I'm really believing that possibly my ph is at the root of the problem.

To answer a few questions... I've been doing water changes frequently, more than normal the past few weeks. I'd say 20-30 percent every 2-3 days. Since I began the meds a few days ago, I've followed the directions and done daily partial water changes before retreating with the daily dose.

When this all began, Ammonia 0, Nitrite 0, Nitrate 5.0

However, a few weeks back I had a power outage which threw the tank back into a mini-cycle... maybe this had a role to play too, but following that I was checking my water parameters daily and performing water changes daily for about a week or two. I believe, based on finally getting readings of 0 on ammonia and nitrite that the tank did complete a re-cycle.

So... taking all of that into account, I'm thinking I should raise the ph. I mostly have South American Cichlids in that tank, and I know they like soft acidic water as it mirrors their natural parameters in the wild, but I think I should get this up to at least 6.5...

How long will crushed coral take to achieve this... what about baking soda? and what doses or amount of coral would I use etc etc etc... I want to avoid chemically doing this because I know that this is only a temporary fix while the chems are in the water. Also, should I wait until I finish the course of meds?

Thanks!
 
What type of water are you using for your water changes? It seems like you have an instability issue with overall hardness in your tank water. I had this problem in one of my tanks. The PH dropped to below 6 and because I was using RO Water with no hardness my tank crashed and killed most of my fish. I would look into using rocks that are known to raise PH or if you are using RO Water to mix it with your tap to get some hardness levels. I would get a liquid test for general hardness and see if that is your problem. If it is crushed coral, rocks, mixing your water could even out the PH crash and you will be able to get a stable PH reading.
 
I have maintained soft water fish in tanks with a pH below 6, down at least to 5 (the lowest test kit I can find) and probably below 5, with no issues. Now, not all fish will manage, but I've never had problems with corys. I will leave the cloudy eye/fungus issue, as I am not experienced in disease sufficient to offer positive advice on treatments, so others who are can help you there. But I will address the buffering issues, and say that I would suspect some other source for the disease.

If you do buffer...and I am not suggesting you should at this point...you first need to know the GH and KH as these are related factors. As Miguel said, if you are using all RO water that is one thing, but tap water is another and we need to know the GH, KH and pH of your source water. And we need to know the specific fish species, and if these are wild caught or tank raised.

The KH (carbonate hardness, or Alkalinity) has no direct affect on fish but it can "buffer" the pH to keep it stable at whatever level it is in the source water or tank water. This depends upon the KH value. The GH is related because some of the buffering methods will raise this, and more harm can occur to some fish. If you are using tap water supplied by a municipality, you can get these numbers from them before wasting money on a test kit.

Second, on the methods mentioned. Baking soda is not recommended because while it will initially raise the pH, it has no true buffering capability, so the acidic conditions in the aquarium will lower the pH over and over. This is not only debilitating on the fish, but the chemical aspects of bicarbonate of soda can harm soft water fish according to Dr. Stanley Weitzman, and who am I to argue against such a source.

Crushed coral can raise the pH, but it too is not a buffering agent; I have experimented with this. Dolomite or aragonite will work. For several years I kept about half a cup or less of crushed dolomite gravel in my canister filter of one tank and it maintained a pH around 6.4 when otherwise it would be at 5. This was something I was "advised" to do (much as you seem to have been), and before I realized that for the fish I was keeping and in planted tanks this is totally unnecessary. I now do nothing, and the tanks range from 5 (or lower, can't measure below that) up to 6.4 or 6.5 depending upon the specific aquarium. All receive 1/2 volume water changes weekly and have for many months now stabilized like this.

To fish, there is a close and important relationship between GH and pH, and one should not be messed with at the expense of the other. I should be able to offer more when I have the numbers and info requested.

Byron.
 
Remember, once you find a value you want to keep your tank at, KH-wise, you'll want to adjust your new water to match the tank water BEFORE you add it to the tank when you do your partials.

Mark
 
I suspect very low KH is what is causing the pH to drop. When I lived in MA we had very soft water especially in winter but check your tap water, not all areas are the same. My KH would often drop to 0 between weekly water changes & lack of buffering led to lowering of pH. I put a piece of pantyhose with ~1 or 2 Tablespoons crushed coral in the filter to keep it more stable. My plants were much happier.

Baking soda is also a buffering agent but I found this to be more bother trying to get the dosing amount & frequency "right" for each tank.
 
Thanks all for your info

To answer a few questions:
I just use plain old tap water. I live about 15-20 mins south of Boston, and we get our water from a municipality. I suspect our water in general, is on the softer side.

I remember checking my kh a few years ago, I had moved away for a number of months for work, and my tank fell into a state of neglect while I was away and experienced old tank syndrome. My ph was very low then too < 6. I'm not sure if its low from the tap, or if it becomes low when things go wrong in the tank... or the current acidity of the tank drops it.
I can't recall now what the kh/gh readings were, so I will have to check those again. I do have test kits for both.

I suppose I should also check the parameters of my tap water to know for sure what exactly is coming out of my tap. I read earlier somewhere that the best way to do this is to pour tap water into a bucket to let it gas off for 24 hours, while running an air stone in the bucket, then take a reading a day later. Would this be the correct way to gauge my tap water parameters?

Also, chemistry was never my thing, so kh/gh and everything was something I prob never had the best handle on. I know that soft water is acidic and usually has a low ph, and certain things like driftwood naturally lower ph, while hard water is generally more alkaline and things like coral can raise the ph. I understand that South American fish and Riverine Africans typically exist in soft acidic water, while Lake Cichlids from Africa and Central American cichlids generally come from hard water. I think I have the basics in my head sorted out (haha) but I'm not entirely sure what we mean by buffering and I want to be sure I understand it properly. When we say such and such "buffers" the water does this mean that it brings the water to a neutral level and maintains it at around a ph of 7? I saw where it was written in one of the posst that certain materials raise or lower ph but don't buffer it. So I think I need a better understanding of buffering.

So it looks like I have some homework to do, checking the kh/gh. I won't be able to do so for a few days though because the tank water has a yellow hue to it with the Jungle Fungus Meds in there right now. I'll have to wait til I can remove that with carbon later this week.

I really want to get a better understanding of water chemistry, and this is an area that I admit I am lacking and need to dedicate more time to understanding the finer details of it.

That being said if anyone would be able to also provide a better understanding of kh and gh I'd much appreciate it.

Finally - The fish I currently have in there are Threadfin Acara, Aggizzissi Cory (sp?) and Julii Cory, S. Daeman, and Red Headed Tapajos (One of the Tapajos has the cloudy eye, the only other fish with any symptoms are my Khulis, which have been in the tank for several years and live under a plastic log, one of them has patchy fungus growing on and around its head, it seems I've been able to keep it from getting worse, but it won't clear up).

Also, I know these fish need a larger tank, and will be moving them to a 130 as soon as I get it set up. For now, they're mostly juveniles.

Thanks again for all of your help - I truly appreciate all the info!!!
 
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I believe that Byron touched on dolomite or aragonite as capable of buffering .
btw at low pH ammonia is not really much of a problem as it is rendered harmless but the low pH. that said there is a turn in belief that some of the factors (bacteria) that consume ammonia some actually do form(low pH aka acidic water is said to slow bacteria growth).
I keep my altum at low pH (less than 6) and many of the black water fish are fine in low pH.

my tap is 6.8 kh3-4 altum water is run thru RO filter and lowered with leaved and driftwood.
 
I just use plain old tap water. I live about 15-20 mins south of Boston, and we get our water from a municipality. I suspect our water in general, is on the softer side.

I remember checking my kh a few years ago, I had moved away for a number of months for work, and my tank fell into a state of neglect while I was away and experienced old tank syndrome. My ph was very low then too < 6. I'm not sure if its low from the tap, or if it becomes low when things go wrong in the tank... or the current acidity of the tank drops it.
I can't recall now what the kh/gh readings were, so I will have to check those again. I do have test kits for both.

I suppose I should also check the parameters of my tap water to know for sure what exactly is coming out of my tap. I read earlier somewhere that the best way to do this is to pour tap water into a bucket to let it gas off for 24 hours, while running an air stone in the bucket, then take a reading a day later. Would this be the correct way to gauge my tap water parameters?

Testing one's tap water is an important initial aspect of fishkeeping but one that is seldom advocated which is a shame. The water chemistry not only can affect fish and plants, but other problems may be linked, as here (not suggesting there is a problem, but the lowering of the pH is obviously partly due to the source water). You can test GH and KH straight from the tap. But pH is affected by the amount of dissolved CO2 in the water, and this can vary. Sitting out a glass of water overnight is one way, with or without an airstone, but a quicker one is to vigorously shake some water in a closed container for several moments to out-gas the CO2. CO2 reacts with water to form carbonic acid which lowers pH, so getting rid of the CO2 will give you a more accurate reading of the actual pH of the water. [This is not necessary for tank water because you want to know the true state of the tank water as it exists in the tank.] The GH and KH will not likely change significantly (if at all) in the aquarium unless it is being targeted somehow, for example the wood and leaves will soften/acidify and calcareous substances will harden/raise pH. And the change either way also depends upon the initial source water GH/KH and pH in relation to the amount of substance. [I hope you can see how involved this gets.:)]

Also, chemistry was never my thing, so kh/gh and everything was something I prob never had the best handle on. I know that soft water is acidic and usually has a low ph, and certain things like driftwood naturally lower ph, while hard water is generally more alkaline and things like coral can raise the ph. I understand that South American fish and Riverine Africans typically exist in soft acidic water, while Lake Cichlids from Africa and Central American cichlids generally come from hard water. I think I have the basics in my head sorted out (haha) but I'm not entirely sure what we mean by buffering and I want to be sure I understand it properly. When we say such and such "buffers" the water does this mean that it brings the water to a neutral level and maintains it at around a ph of 7? I saw where it was written in one of the posst that certain materials raise or lower ph but don't buffer it. So I think I need a better understanding of buffering.

Some authors will say that "buffering" is not the best term. What we aquarists mean by the term is maintaining a stable pH, i.e., the pH to start with remains stable and does not change regardless of acids or bases added. A "buffer" may or may not have any effect on changing the pH, again depending upon the GH, KH and pH of the source water. If the GH and KH of the tap water are fairly high, the natural "acidification" going on in every fish tank will not have much if any effect on the pH. But if the GH and KH are very low, then acidification may lower it considerably, and conversely adding calcareous substances can send it soaring. This can seriously harm fish. Which is why I said previously that crushed coral was a poor substance to use on its own, because it does not "buffer," it simply adds calcium which raises the pH but the pH may still be subject to other factors. In my situation, with near-zero GH and KH of my tap water, just two tablespoons of crushed coral sent the pH in my 90g tank from 6.4 to 7.6 in a day or two. But the GH and KH remained zero, so here there is no "buffering" at all, merely an agent that is significantly impacting the water chemistry. Also, in my case, the "buffering" is solely within the tank, not the tap water; by this I mean that the tank maintains a stable GH and pH because of the biology, and this is stronger than my non-buffered tap water, so when I add tap water with a pH of 7 or 7.2 to my tanks, with a 1/2 tank water change, the tank pH of 6 does not vary at all.

So it looks like I have some homework to do, checking the kh/gh. I won't be able to do so for a few days though because the tank water has a yellow hue to it with the Jungle Fungus Meds in there right now. I'll have to wait til I can remove that with carbon later this week.

I would test your tap water first, as this is the source of the natural "buffering," and what is really important. It will determine what happens in the aquarium with respect to acidification (or not). And it will tell us how much impact other factors like wood, leaves, calcium rock, etc will likely have on the tank water.

I really want to get a better understanding of water chemistry, and this is an area that I admit I am lacking and need to dedicate more time to understanding the finer details of it.
That being said if anyone would be able to also provide a better understanding of kh and gh I'd much appreciate it.

After I post this response, I will add another post which will be an article I wrote to (hopefully) explain GH/KH/pH simply enough for aquarists, of which I am one. I used it to learn as I wrote it. It is probably longer than what will fit in this post.

Finally - The fish I currently have in there are Threadfin Acara, Aggizzissi Cory (sp?) and Julii Cory, S. Daeman, and Red Headed Tapajos (One of the Tapajos has the cloudy eye, the only other fish with any symptoms are my Khulis, which have been in the tank for several years and live under a plastic log, one of them has patchy fungus growing on and around its head, it seems I've been able to keep it from getting worse, but it won't clear up).

We don't know the actual pH, but certainly being on the acidic side should have no detriment to these fish. The cloudy eye could well be an injury; I've had a fish or two suddenly go blind in one eye. The fungus on the kuhliis may be due to an open scrape they have from some rough object in the tank? This is frequent, as they like to squeeze into very small openings and can easily scrape off scales on rock, wood, ornaments, filters. I would myself not associate either problem with the pH, at least not yet.

Also, I know these fish need a larger tank, and will be moving them to a 130 as soon as I get it set up. For now, they're mostly juveniles.

Good for you, this is the right thinking. Limited space has real limits and sooner than many realize.

Byron.
 
Water Hardness and pH in the Freshwater Aquarium

Water in its pure form does not exist in nature; it is a powerful solvent, meaning a substance that easily dissolves other substances to create a solution. As rain falls, it picks up many gasses and particulate matter, and it continues to do this as it passes through the ground. Natural water values therefore vary with respect to hardness and pH because the water acquires specific properties from the landscape. Water flowing over or through rock will assimilate minerals from the rock, becoming what we term “hard” water. Water flowing through soils that contain organic matter will be “soft” because the organics bind with and thus remove minerals while creating acids that enter the water. The pH is largely the result of the hardness as well as the amount of carbon dioxide dissolved in the water.

As each freshwater fish species has evolved over thousands of years, their physiology has adjusted to the water values that occur in their respective habitat. We refer to these values as water parameters, and they include hardness, pH and temperature; each of these has an impact on fish. As an ecological example of this, it is hypothesized that the distinct Corydoras species that are endemic to specific tributary streams of the Rio Negro in Amazonia but are not found in the main river or in adjoining tributary streams is likely due to differing parameters including pH and temperature that act as a barrier to the fish. [1] While many fish species appear to be somewhat adaptable, their physiology can be negatively affected if the parameters are outside the fish’s natural preference. Providing suitable water parameters in the aquarium is therefore an important aspect of providing an environment that is less stressful—and this directly relates to healthier fish.

Total Dissolved Solids [TDS] is the measure of all inorganic and organic substances in suspecnded form in the water. This includes the minerals salts. "Salts" here refers not to our common salt (sodium) but to various mineral salts, the most prevalent of which are chlorides, bicarbonates, carbonates, and sulphates of calcium, sodium, magnesium and potassium. Fish are directly impacted by TDS. In fact, when we speak of soft water fish, we are actually referring to the very low, sometimes near zero, level of TDS in their water.

Water hardness is the measure of dissolved mineral salts in the water, a portion of the TDS. There are two basic types of hardness of importance to aquarists, termed general hardness (abbreviated GH) and carbonate hardness (abbreviated KH, from the German “karbon” [carbon]). The combined GH and KH is sometimes termed “total hardness,” but this is of less importance because the GH and KH individually impact the water in different ways.

General Hardness is basically determined by the minerals calcium and magnesium; GH is sometimes referred to as “permanent hardness” because it cannot be removed from water by boiling as can KH. GH is measured in several different units, but in the hobby the most common are parts per million (ppm) and degrees (dH or dGH). One dGH equals 10 milligrams of calcium or magnesium oxide per litre [2], and is equivalent to 17.848 ppm. Multiplying dGH by 17.9 gives ppm, and similarly dividing ppm by 17.9 gives dGH [the same formula works for KH]. The following chart equates the degrees and relative ppm to common terms in the hobby.

0 - 4 dGH 0 - 70 ppm very soft
4 - 8 dGH 70 - 140 ppm soft
8 - 12 dGH 140 - 210 ppm medium hard
12 - 18 dGH 210 - 320 ppm fairly hard
18 - 30 dGH 320 - 530 ppm hard
over 30 dGH over 530 ppm very hard

Fish are directly impacted by GH and TDS; their growth, the transfer of nutrients and waste products through cell membranes, spawning (sperm transfer, egg fertility or hatching), and the proper functioning of internal organs such as the kidneys can all be affected.

Carbonate hardness is the measure of carbonate and bicarbonate ions; carbonates and bicarbonates are the salts of carbonic acid. It is sometimes referred to as Alkalinity [not to be confused with alkaline as in pH, something very different]. Carbonate hardness is also measured most often in either degrees (dKH) or parts per million (ppm), and the same formula to convert dGH to ppm and reverse also works for KH. KH is normally tied to the GH, since carbonate minerals include limestone, dolomite, calcium and calcite. Mollusc shells and coral are primarily calcium. Carbonate hardness is sometimes called “temporary hardness” because it can be removed from water by boiling which precipitates out the carbonates.

KH has no direct impact on fish; but it does “buffer” the pH by binding to additions of acids or bases, keeping the pH stable—or more correctly, preventing it from changing—and the higher the KH, the greater the buffering capacity. A simple way is to think of the buffer as a sponge that soaks up the acid being added; however, at some point it will become saturated, and further additions of the acid can then cause a sudden and very large fluctuation which is usually fatal to the fish. This buffering is why attempts to adjust (lower) the pH of hard water are dangerous and will fail unless the KH is first reduced.

pH stands for pondus hydrogeni, Latin for “potential of hydrogen.” Water is made up of positively-charged hydrogen ions and negatively-charged hydroxyl ions, and pH is the measurement of the ratio of hydrogen and hydroxyl ions in a body of water. Acidic water contains more hydrogen ions, and basic (alkaline) water more hydroxyl ions; neutral water has an equal proportion. The pH is closely linked with the level of carbon dioxide (CO2) because CO2 produces carbonic acid. The hardness also impacts pH, since the carbonates bind to acids as they appear; as mentioned previously, this buffering will prevent or limit changes in pH.

The pH is measured with a scale from 1 to 14 with 7 being neutral. Numbers below 7 indicate acidic water, increasingly more acidic as they lower, while numbers above 7 indicate basic or alkaline water, increasingly as the numbers rise. This scale is logarithmic, meaning that each unit is a ten-fold increase/decrease; so a pH of 5 is ten times more acidic than a pH of 6, and 100 times more acidic than a pH of 7, and a thousand times more acidic than a pH of 8. Fish must never be exposed to sudden pH changes approaching one unit, as this is very stressful and may kill some species.

The impact of pH on fish is significant; water constantly enters the fish via osmosis through the cells, and the pH of the water can shift the pH of the fish’s blood if they are different. The fish must therefore regulate its internal pH accordingly, and this takes energy. Fish do this regularly in nature in response to changes in its environment, but these are usually minimal. Some fish species have a wider range of tolerance than others, for reasons that are not certain.[3] Fish that are wild caught show intolerance for hardness and pH levels that are not close to their origins. Maintaining a species in water that is reasonably close to its natural habitat is usually advisable.

Adjusting water hardness and/or pH should only be done by natural means, never with chemicals and preparations because these will often be “blocked” by the initial KH and may have or lead to other effects that can be highly detrimental to fish and bacteria. Water should always be prepared outside the aquarium and then used to gradually replace the aquarium water over a period of time to avoid shock to the fish.

Hard water can be made softer by diluting it; Reverse Osmosis (RO) water, distilled water, and rainwater can be used. Water will soften in proportion to the dilution; mixing hard tap water half and half with one of the afore-mentioned waters will result in water that is half the original hardness. A caution on home water softeners: many of these work by replacing the calcium [Ca] and magnesium [Mg] ions with sodium (=common salt) [Na] ions. Each Ca and Mg ion is exchanged for two Na ions. Therefore, the end result is water containing twice the ions--or double the total dissolved solids--it previously had, and for soft water fish this is an even worse situation, plus there is the detrimental impact of the sodium (salt).


Soft water can be made harder by using calcareous substances in the filter (preferably) or the substrate. Dolomite is the best, since it is composed of both calcium and magnesium. Crushed coral, marble and limestone also work but need to be in crushed form (gravel, sand) to have more of an effect. If these latter are used, magnesium can be added with Magnesium Sulphate [pure Epsom Salt] at each water change; very little is needed. The amount required can vary depending upon the softness of the original water, but in general, very little calcareous material is required.

Adjusting pH should not be attempted except in conjunction with altering the GH and KH, since these are closely related. Most municipal water supplies will be medium hard to hard with a correspondingly higher pH in the basic range (7-9). It would not normally be necessary to raise this further, but if the tap water range is medium hard with a pH in the 7’s, adding a calcium or magnesium base to increase both the GH and KH will naturally result in a higher pH, as one might do for rift lake cichlids.

The GH and KH will remain steady once adjusted, provided no substances to increase it are present in the aquarium. Once the KH is low, the pH will naturally lower due to the carbonic acid being added to the water from natural biological processes such as fish and plant respiration, bacteria through the breakdown of organics such as fish waste, uneaten food, plant matter, etc. Regular partial water changes using either similarly-prepared water or even tap water [in smaller amounts] should not overly impact the hardness and pH if the tank is biologically stable.

A final comment on using baking soda (sodium bicarbonate) to raise pH. This can be useful in an emergency, but should not be used long-term. Sodium bicarbonate has no effective buffer action and cannot stabilize pH when additional acids are being produced such as by waste products. Further, the sodium ions will eventually reach levels that are intolerable for soft water fish (Weitzman et al. 1996). Commercial preparations such as rift lake mineral salts and others are effective though they are very expensive long term or in larger aquaria.

Footnotes:

[1] Sands (1995), p. 9.
[2] Baensch & Riehl (1987), p. 29.
[3] Muha (2006), p. 68

References:

Baensch, Hans A. and Rudiger Riehl (1987), Aquarium Atlas, Volume 1, First English Edition.

Ghadially, Feroze N. (1969), Advanced Aquarist Guide, The Pet Library Ltd.

Hiscock, Peter (2003), Encyclopedia of Aquarium Plants, Interpet Publishing, First Edition for the United States and Canada by Barron’s Educational Series, Inc.

Hiscock, Peter (2003), Aquarium Designs Inspired By Nature, Interpet Publishing, First Edition for the United States and Canada by Barron’s Educational Series, Inc.

Muha, Laura (2006), “The Skeptical Fishkeeper,” Tropical Fish Hobbyist, April 2006, pp. 66-69.

Sands, David D. (1995), “Four New Corydoras (Callichthyidae) species from Upper Negro River tributaries and a range extension, together with a discussion of C. bicolor Nijssen & Isbrucker,” Freshwater and Marine Aquarium, Volume 18, Number 7 (July 1995), pp. 8-18.

Weitzman, Stanley H., Lisa Palmer, Naercio A. Menezes and John R. Burns (1996), "Maintaining Environmental Conditions Suitable for Tropical and Subtropical Forest-adapted Fishes, Especially the Species of Mimagoniates," Tropical Fish Hobbyist, Volume 44, No. 11, June 1996 (Part One), pp. 184-194 and July 1996 (Part Two), pp. 196-201.

June 19, 2011
 
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Nice article. Thanks for the refresher. These overviews generally have one or two things that remind me to look up something else. This was no exception. I do love the scientific nerdiness of the whole hobby. Thanks again.
 
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