RTFM (If you don't know what it means, please see inside)

I think telling new fish keepers that they 'fail' and that it's a good thing they're suffering is way too harsh. Imagine walking into a pet store and asking about a problem you have, and the clerk saying to you, "You fail, you don't understand basic biology, andI hope you suffer."
That's not a very good way to teach new fishkeepers. Of course most of the info people need has been discussed on these forums, but that doesn't mean that ignoring them or insulting them is going to fix the problem.

If you want to help new aquarists, my suggestion would be to reply to threads with the correct information to the best of your ability, or give them a link to the information. If they're here, they obviously want to learn and ignoring them or telling them they've already screwed things over isn't going to help.

I also have to disagree with you on your article. I don't think reading every post and every article is nescessary. I think there's a far more basic approach to it...in my opinnion, the basic information that people need is...

Know the requirements/needs of your fish - Do they like to be in a school? Alone? Are all your fish compatible? Will they fit in your tank? Do they require any special dietary needs, temperature needs, hiding places etc.?

Know the basics of water chemistry - Know that ammonia -> nitrite -> nitrate. Nitrate isn't really toxic in levels below 30-40 ppm, but it's a good indicator of other junk building up in the water. Plants utilize nitrate, so if you have a planted aquarium you can't really use nitrate as a gauge for water changes. If ammonia/nitrite go above zero, consider a water change. Keep up with regular water changes depending on your fish load/aquarium filtration and setup.

Know your water/what to add to it - Along with the thing above, it's always good to know whether your tap water is soft/hard, what pH it is out of the tap etc. so you can gauge potential problems. If you're not too sure what's in your water, use a water conditoner like Prime that does it all (gets rid of chlorine/chloramines/heavy metals/detoxifies ammonia/nitrite/nitrate). Don't try to regulate pH excessively unless you really have a problem.

I think some of the articles on Aquaria Central are unnescesary for people to read. Some people just want to setup tanks, change water every once in awhile and be done with it, while others want to go deeper into the hobby. I don't think it's nescessary for people to know every single process that goes on in their aquarium, but learn information as nescessary for when something goes wrong (and that's where the experts here come in handy :cool:)
 
Cheese Pope said:
I understand what your saying, dont buy what you dont understand, people who think that its the easiest hobby in the world, but in reality is alot more complex. But there are "nicer" ways to put it. :dance2:
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Agreed.

The comic has a good routine, but needs some work on delivery ;)

I would also like to point out that for every grain of good information on the internet, there are 100 grains of misinformation and pure myth. It's very hard, as a newbie, to know *what* is correct information and what is wrong information.

Roan
 
A lot of newbies come here in a panic asking questions after following the advice of their LFS.... some feel as if their problem is unique. Sure, they could go to the search option, maybe some do even.... but like I said, some feel their situation is more unique, although most of us would not think so. Some old-timers do refer people to the archived stickies and articles, I've seen that done dozens of times and have ever referred them there on more than one occasion. The fact of the matter is, some people come into the hobby without thinking that there is more than fill the tank, wait a day, and you're good to go. When I first started umpteen years ago, I did the same. It's boards like these that are the saving grace of many tanks though because of the questions asked. If you're so annoyed at the simple questions in such an early part of your existence on AC, why bother dealing with it in the first place. If you don't like the redundancies that you see, try another board. I'm sure you'll see that most have this very same issue. As an old-timer myself, I'd rather help the inexperienced or panic stricken hobbyist rather than scare them away about it. Starting such an aggressive thread could only discourage people more when in the whole picture, it's about saving that guppy being housed with the bala.
 
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I guess the topic creator never read a book on aquariums. I have about 15 books all together. They range from basic saltwater setup, to advanced planted tanks. And I'm here to tell you that sometimes you understand even the most simple aquarium related tasks a lot better when somebody tells you instead of trying to figure out what a writer was trying to portray. In any instance you sound more like you're easy to annoy over trivial things instead of trying to actually help. People make mistakes they have trouble understanding. That is life; if you can't realize that then you are doomed to have bad days for the rest of your life. This applies to ammonia and fish stocking methods. How many people here can honestly say they knew what they were doing when they started? For the longest time (years and years) I never know about the ammonia cycle. I tested only for ph, and used chemicals to treat every aspect of my tank. And I even did research on what I could find.

The information is so broad and vast that people need help to narrow it down and put it in more of a perspective that they can understand. Not everyone is a die-hard aquarist that puts everything they own into a tank. They are the casual aquarist that needs a little help from time to time. And frankly, this is a quicker way than trying to search for information on the net by yourself.

Wow, that was a long post for me.
 
msouth468 said:
How many people here can honestly say they knew what they were doing when they started?
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speaking of which, I spent the first 3 years in the hobby with a 10 gallon tank with an angel, 2 black tetras, a blue gourami, a common pleco, a giant danio, and I think a few more fish I can't remember anymore. can't say I knew what I was doing then, and I've been finding that I'm still learning a lot 10 years later ;)
 
I agree with what many other have said on this post, that often newbies - of which I am very definitely one - come here after being bombarded with contradictory, invalid, outdated and just flat out wrong advice. I have been reading constantly for the two weeks or so since I started on my 35G aquarium. My 10G is still alive due to dumb luck apparently. I heard about cycling, but when I asked the fish store about it I was told, add your first fish, then add a few more in a couple of days - HAHAHAHAHAHA. Now I know this was a joke, my mistake for hoping the person selling me fish knew what they were saying. I did my research on what fish play with each other, and there is a ton of conflicting information out there on that subject. I have opaline gouramis and tiger barbs together and it seems the jury is still out on whether they play well, but so far so good.

I am here to tell you that finding information on the basic care (how to do a water change for example) is really hard to find. Everyone says do water changes in the books, articles, web pages, etc, but I only found info on how to actually PERFORM one on this site in the forums because someone finally broke down and asked a basic question like that. I am probably one of those that sparked the initial post on this thread, I admit I was under informed, but I tried and I am willing to remedy my lack of knowledge mostly thanks to the help and friendly advice I have seen on this forum. Sometimes we newbies just panic because we read so much information - much of it conflicting - and can't make heads or tails of it, it helps to talk to people who apply that knowledge all the time in the real world. I have seen so much conflicting info on pH and ammonia levels I am still at a loss on what levels I should really be at nd still be safe (I know zero after the tank is done cycling, but I am still cycling now, with a tank full of fish unfortunately), but I am continuing to learn as fast as I can because I love my fish and care about doing the best thing for them.
 
hello............, if us newbies didnt asksuch silly questions on a daily basis, then there wouldnt be any posts to "go back and read"....

Also, i always try to go back and read to see if there is something unigue to my situation.But there just really always isnt.Every case is different.And if i have a fishy emergency...I REFUSE TO SPEND ALL DAY TRYING TO READ.Thank GOD there is a forum like this that i can ask questions in.
 
Just two more cents of my own, here.

Even though I'm used to being asked the same question 8 million times (I work with little kids), I totally understand where Goatman's frustration comes from.

I'm also very new to keeping fish, and have been as guilty as the next newbie when it comes to posting repetative questions.

But here's the thing. What may seem totally obvious to someone who knows about how to do research on a computer (or in a library) may not even occur to someone who never learned those skills. Combine that with knowing nothing about the hobby, and you get someone looking for answers who doesn't even know which questions to ask, and who has no idea how tedious it is for someone to keep answering those same questions.

But IMO that's the main reason this forum has a seperate "Newbie" spot, just so we Newbie's don't annoy people who don't have the patience to put up with us.

I found this site when my daughter asked for a goldfish. Before I even posted a question, I had learned (elsewhere) that I couldn't keep a goldfish in a bowl...but then, I have basic internet and pc skills and I also read books. They say "A little knowledge is a dangerous thing." Well, a little knowledge got me as far as selecting the proper equipment and fish, but that was BEFORE I even knew there was such a thing as "cycling" a tank. I didn't find this site until I had begun to lose some fish, and then my tank stabilized, and then I got bitten by the fish bug and made some impulsive buys based on partial information, and now I have several tanks (if all this sounds FAMILIAR that's my point....)

We all arrive here at different points in the fish-keeping timeline. Those of us at the end of the line really don't enjoy being hit over the head with our own stupidity. It's the same concept as teachers not using the dunce cap anymore.
 
My question is, How old are you? You say you have been fishkeeping for 9/11 years you have been breathing and by the Green Power Ranger slogan under you name my guess is you are 11 yrs old. If you are tired of people post questions that you think are dumb and asking things over and over again then quit coming and reading the post and keep your opinions to yourself. People are here for answers and support not to be told how stupid and inadequate they are. I wish that they (the forum monitors) would just take away your posting privelages if you have nothing better to do than degrade everyone who is trying to get some advice so that they don't kill their fish. You can not tell me that when you first started out that you didn't have the some of the same problems everyone in this forum are having and are trying to get advice about. No matter how much you know, things go wrong and things happen and that is just life. No one cares to read every opinion you have on how stupid people who come to this forum are. STOP POSTING YOUR OPINIONS AND START POSTING ADVICE IF YOU ARE GOING TO POST ANYTHING AT ALL!!!!!!!!!
 
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