ExPeNsIvE HoBbY
Formerly ExPeNsIvE AdDiCtIoN on MFK
So how's the ICH going? Did you get it all taken care of? How's the fish doing? And lastly, how is the brackish tank setup going?
Setting up a Brackish 20 Gallon?
- Thread starter NewZealandFish
- Start date
ExPeNsIvE HoBbY
Formerly ExPeNsIvE AdDiCtIoN on MFK
Didn't see post
Sorry, ya didn't see that post. I keep a gymnothorax tile, so I have to either put him in his own tank, or keep the community brackish. The other fish handle brackish no problem, but he doesn't handle pure fresh. Also, I know it has not be empirically proven, but I show no signs of HITH in any of my cichlid species. My guys, as well as many others, is that the salinity and higher PH of synthetic sea salt offers some protection against HITH and Lateral Line Disease. Also it seems like most if not all the fish I have are benefiting by the trace elements in the salt water, and the calcite hardness seems to be a more stable buffer, and with my fairly high stocking levels and bioload, a PH swing is the last thing I need to wipe out my main tank. However every single one of my other tanks have zero salt in them, aquarium, rock, table or sea salt, and they all are doing very well.
Sorry, ya didn't see that post. I keep a gymnothorax tile, so I have to either put him in his own tank, or keep the community brackish. The other fish handle brackish no problem, but he doesn't handle pure fresh. Also, I know it has not be empirically proven, but I show no signs of HITH in any of my cichlid species. My guys, as well as many others, is that the salinity and higher PH of synthetic sea salt offers some protection against HITH and Lateral Line Disease. Also it seems like most if not all the fish I have are benefiting by the trace elements in the salt water, and the calcite hardness seems to be a more stable buffer, and with my fairly high stocking levels and bioload, a PH swing is the last thing I need to wipe out my main tank. However every single one of my other tanks have zero salt in them, aquarium, rock, table or sea salt, and they all are doing very well.
I dont know if the ICH is gone yet, but some fish are still scratching on the ground. The fish seem to be fine, theyre all eating, no spots.
I can't set up a brackish tank (if i do) unless the ICH is gone in both tanks, long story but it wouldn't work with plants, loaches etc.
So yeah have to wait for that
Thanks for all of the info from everyone else :thm:
ExPeNsIvE HoBbY
Formerly ExPeNsIvE AdDiCtIoN on MFK
carpenter547
The Desert Punk
as far as setting up a brackish tank goes if you set it up with ich in it and raise the salinity up to 1.012 or a bit higher it will wipe out the ich all on it's own. it might play havok with your plants but hey that is the price of brack tanks.
don't get a dragon goby unless your have more than a 20 gallon tank.
also if you aren't going to read up on the links and non spoon fed advise stop asking.
don't get a dragon goby unless your have more than a 20 gallon tank.
also if you aren't going to read up on the links and non spoon fed advise stop asking.
ExPeNsIvE HoBbY
Formerly ExPeNsIvE AdDiCtIoN on MFK
Ya the plant selection in a brack tank is rather limited, at least as far as families of plants and what is available readily. Unless you wants swords and moss there isn't that much commonly available. Well let me know if you do decide to do one. And as far as ich being eliminated solely to the salinity change, I wouldn't put much stock in that. Dieseases are fairly tough, that's how they survive for so long. Generally the rate at which you could raise any parameter to kill the ICH would have killed your plants and fish FAR before the ICH dies. That's why they make anti-parasitical treatments. If not we would all just turn up the heat and throw in some salt and never worry about it lol. And you can get ICH in full fresh water, full salt water, or anywhere in between. In fresh it is called ichthyophththirius multifiliis, and in marine it is called cryptocaryon. If you run brackish, depending on the salinity and the fish you choose(if you don't quarantine) you may get either.
Just something concerning ICH and salt for ya.
Just something concerning ICH and salt for ya.
carpenter547
The Desert Punk
the two organisimns that are ich are related but not the same.
plants aside salt kills ich. it is proven. if you have marine ich hypo salinity kills.
if you have fresh ich hyper salinity kills.
saying that disease exists for millions of years and as such can't be killed by "just salt" is like saying "well since orchids have been around for a million years so 120 degree heat and a pint of water a day won't kill them." or since all water in the ocean came from rivers and that doesn't have salt means that every fish marine doesn't need any marine water. heck for that matter every one who says that puffers need brack and marine are just wrong cuz they have been around for millions of years in just river water.
bah.
plants aside salt kills ich. it is proven. if you have marine ich hypo salinity kills.
if you have fresh ich hyper salinity kills.
saying that disease exists for millions of years and as such can't be killed by "just salt" is like saying "well since orchids have been around for a million years so 120 degree heat and a pint of water a day won't kill them." or since all water in the ocean came from rivers and that doesn't have salt means that every fish marine doesn't need any marine water. heck for that matter every one who says that puffers need brack and marine are just wrong cuz they have been around for millions of years in just river water.
bah.
carpenter547
The Desert Punk
the bottom line is there is a range of brackish that is too low for marine ich and too high for fresh ich.
i believe could be wrong but believe that it is 1.012 or 1.015.
i know it is written some where. i also know that everything has limits bacteria fungus virii and higher life forms. every thing has parameters if you exceed the high or low end of them then said system will fail. put any thing in a ph of 1 and damage will happen. deny most living organisims water and they will lose chemical functions that sustain life.
i believe could be wrong but believe that it is 1.012 or 1.015.
i know it is written some where. i also know that everything has limits bacteria fungus virii and higher life forms. every thing has parameters if you exceed the high or low end of them then said system will fail. put any thing in a ph of 1 and damage will happen. deny most living organisims water and they will lose chemical functions that sustain life.
ExPeNsIvE HoBbY
Formerly ExPeNsIvE AdDiCtIoN on MFK
Nobody said that salt couldn't kill ICH, but being that we were talking about brackish conditions that contain salt, it is pertinent to say that in that environment, salt will have little to no effect. And comparing organisms living for millions of years to improperly caring for terrestrial plants or the composition and salinity of the water is a little extreme. And yes, put anything in a PH of one and damage will most definitely occur, but that is an example of an extreme. With that said, I will revert to my precious post, a slight change in any parameter will not kill your fish, but it most likely will not cure the problem of ICH either. Any extreme that will kill the protozoan parasite, will most likely kill your fish as well. I'm all for finding things that are non chemical treatments, but for the most part, there is little that works quicker than a chemical treatment. For example, raising the temperature will speed up the life cycle of ICH, but unless supplemented by another treatment, it only speeds it up. Raising the salinity rapidly will kill the ICH but would also most likely kill the fish. And if you did do it slow enuff where the fish could endure the change, who's to say the ICH cannot acclimate as well?
I guess all I'm saying is not every home remedy works, and not ever commercial treatment works either. Use what is best for YOUR particular situation. I myself have been lucky enuff to not get ICH in my main tank, but if I did I would have a handful of problems being that I have a gymnothorax tile, who do not do well with formalin, methaline blue, malachite green, or any other anti parasitical treatments available. Same situation in which this thread was about, having loaches or cories, whichever it was.
Anyway it's late, I'm tired, and I will actually read what I wrote when I am fully lucid and conscious. Hopefully I made sense tonight lol. If I didn't I apologize.
I guess all I'm saying is not every home remedy works, and not ever commercial treatment works either. Use what is best for YOUR particular situation. I myself have been lucky enuff to not get ICH in my main tank, but if I did I would have a handful of problems being that I have a gymnothorax tile, who do not do well with formalin, methaline blue, malachite green, or any other anti parasitical treatments available. Same situation in which this thread was about, having loaches or cories, whichever it was.
Anyway it's late, I'm tired, and I will actually read what I wrote when I am fully lucid and conscious. Hopefully I made sense tonight lol. If I didn't I apologize.
