So discouraged (kind of long)

[laurabb]

On Friday I got a shipment of 5 ember tetras and what's apparently a trapdoor snail (was supposed to be a zebra nerite). I lost one ember on Saturday, one on Sunday, and 2 this morning. I have one left, and no confidence that he'll survive. He seems fine now, but then, they all seemed fine. The snail also seems fine - very active. All the tetras have been active, were coloring up nicely, and then half an hour later I'll check and there's either one dead or dying. I see no signs of disease, but I'm new to embers and they're tiny.

Tank has been set up for about a month (new tank). It's a 6.6 gallon tank, about 2 ft long, so there's a lot of surface area. Tank specifics are:

Ammonia: 0
Nitrite: 0
Nitrates: 10
pH: 7
Temp: 79*
Small gravel for substrate
Lightly planted: anubia nana, some sort of crypt, java fern, java moss, wisteria
Driftwood
AquaClear 20 filter and Visitherm stealth heater. I use Prime as a water conditioner. Added 1 root tab (divided) for the plants on Saturday, and a little Flourish Excel.

Any ideas what's wrong? It's a new tank, but I rinsed it out well when I tested it for leaks before filling. I don't see any way that contaminants could have made their way into the tank.

I bought the fish from AZ Gardens, which is supposed to have very good stock. The only thing I can think of is that the box they were shipped in was not marked "Live Fish" or anything, and the FedEx guy was literally tossing the box from hand to hand when he came to the door to deliver it (he had no idea there were fish in there). But I would think that the fish would have all died sooner than this if the jostling from the shipment was to blame.

This is my first attempt with fish other than bettas, and I feel terrible. Any ideas on why this is happening?

 

[rsanz]

How did you acclimate them to your tank?

 

[laurabb]

Oh, I meant to put that in.

I floated the bags for about 45 mins, then slowly took out their old water and replaced it with tank water. I did that over the course of about 2 hrs, then emptied them into a net and released them.

 

[avionics30]

That is strange. Fish typically get tossed around no matter what you put on the box, so unless they were literally playing football with the box, I wouldn't think that they were any more stressed than normal shipping.

You acclimated correctly IMO. Did the shipper give you acclimation instructions? I'm just curious. Some shippers hold their fish in conditions that require different acclimation proedures. In fact, sometimes the acclimation procedure that they advocate must be used to uphold any warranty that they may provide on the fish.

Honestly, from what you have written, there is nothing that I can see that YOU did wrong. Wish I had something more to offer.

Best wishes.

 

[laurabb]

Thanks for your response. In their FAQ they recommend drip acclimation for all their fish, but I don't have an airstone nor extra tubing, and was concerned about the water cooling off too quickly in a bucket.

 

[Egress]

I have to disagree about drip acclimation being the right thing to do in these situations where fish have been in the bag longer than a short trip home from the LFS. Here's a scenario: your fish are in their bag, producing among other things ammonia and carbon dioxide. The carbon dioxide lowers the pH, allowing the ammonia buildup to be in its non-toxic form. Upon arrival, the fish undergo a drip acclimation which allows the co2 to outgas, driving the pH up and the ammonia buildup to change into the toxic variety. Your fish suffer ammonia burns on their gills and die off slowly over the next few days.

 

[cellodaisy]

I have to disagree about drip acclimation being the right thing to do in these situations where fish have been in the bag longer than a short trip home from the LFS. Here's a scenario: your fish are in their bag, producing among other things ammonia and carbon dioxide. The carbon dioxide lowers the pH, allowing the ammonia buildup to be in its non-toxic form. Upon arrival, the fish undergo a drip acclimation which allows the co2 to outgas, driving the pH up and the ammonia buildup to change into the toxic variety. Your fish suffer ammonia burns on their gills and die off slowly over the next few days.

What procedure would you recommend?

 

[Egress]

What procedure would you recommend?

When fish have been in the bag for many hours I think the focus should be trying to get them out of that bag as quickly as possible. I would find out what sort of water the fish were being kept in and prepare a quarantine tank to match those conditions. Upon arrival, I'd get the temperature close then pour them into a net and into the QT they go.

 

[avionics30]

I have to disagree about drip acclimation being the right thing to do in these situations where fish have been in the bag longer than a short trip home from the LFS. Here's a scenario: your fish are in their bag, producing among other things ammonia and carbon dioxide. The carbon dioxide lowers the pH, allowing the ammonia buildup to be in its non-toxic form. Upon arrival, the fish undergo a drip acclimation which allows the co2 to outgas, driving the pH up and the ammonia buildup to change into the toxic variety. Your fish suffer ammonia burns on their gills and die off slowly over the next few days.

You're spot on with this scenario. I always place shipped discus right in the tank after I float their bags to acclimate for temperature. I guess the big question is how was the fish shipped? Pure oxygen, RO water, hard water, what was the TDS in the shipping water. This is the big reason that I asked the OP what the recommendation of the shipper was. They know their processes best.

Ph shifts will not harm fish as most people think as badly as ammonia spikes will. A ph shift that was initiated by a change of TDS WILL shock your fish and kill them. If the bag was shipped with RO water (very low TDS) and the fish are not drip acclimated, the rapid TDS/Ph change will result in osmotic shock. In the same breath, the ammonia can become toxic with a rise in the Ph due to outgassed CO2 accumulation during shipping and have the same lethal effect.

If you have no idea what the shipper's perameters are, best way to be sure that you are REALLY acclimating your fish is to drip acclimate to adjust for TDS and add Prime to compensate for toxic ammonia levels. The Ph shift, if you are even looking for one, will not be an issue.

Best wishes!

 

[Star_Rider]

drip acclimation is the preferred method in cases where gh is a major concern.

but Egress is correct..in some cases you may have a spike occur.

fortunately for us there are additives we can use to prevent the ammonia issues.(prime ammo lock etc)

but I have used the drop/plop method with no real issues. as long as the gh is not way off.