The Rescued Goldfish Build

I would say a young shubunkin would be OK for a year - with overfiltering and frequent WCs . They are both non-fancy and would than both be able to go in a pond.
40 gallons is much better than what most goldfish get for life, so I wouldn't worry too much about keeping them in that tank for a year...

just seen your last q: even if you have to keep them longterm well yes it is only 20 gallons per goldie, but since the comet is already stunted it will probably not reach its potential size so I think you might get away with another shubunkin (non stunted) lopng term. Still better than what most goldies get. Tho the pond is preferable!
 
Well I still had questions on this one about the fish being OK in the 40 gallon.

Anyhow, I checked the LFS on my way home from work - they had 2 shubunkins, but neither were appealing to me. Both pretty ugly to be honest... :(

So I'll check back later this week. They should get a new shipment of fish in tomorrow, so maybe they'll get a prettier one. They had some gorgeous koi and comets though! Those will come later though, once the pond is a reality. :)
 
rainbowcharmer said:
Well I still had questions on this one about the fish being OK in the 40 gallon.

Anyhow, I checked the LFS on my way home from work - they had 2 shubunkins, but neither were appealing to me. Both pretty ugly to be honest... :(

So I'll check back later this week. They should get a new shipment of fish in tomorrow, so maybe they'll get a prettier one. They had some gorgeous koi and comets though! Those will come later though, once the pond is a reality. :)
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Remember that when it comes to anything but standard common goldfish, what you see today may not and probably won't be what you see in a few months or longer. Especially when it comes to fancy goldfish and calico colored goldfish. I've seen Black Moors turn brown and then gold.. calico's are ALWAYS changing their spots... sometimes getting more spots, sometimes losing a LOT of spots.... and even "gold" goldfish will often get white areas or spots or turn completely white.... so those Ugly Ducklings that you saw could be Beautiful Swans the next time you see them in someone's pond. ;-)

You might want to re-think your pond size if you are considering Koi. If I recall correctly, your pond is only going to be around 1,500G.... right? Koi grow to 3' long and are very fast swimmers and the minimum sized pond recommendation is usually around 2,000G and that's just for two Koi and even that pond would be on the small end for a 3' long fish. They should reach 80% of this length in the first 10 years if they aren't stunted and reach 50% in the first 1-3 years. 18" Koi would need a few hundred gallons each and full sized adults would need 500-1,000G each depending on filtration, water change schedule, etc. Stick to Comets, Shubunkins, and/or a few other long-bodied varieties. Even common goldfish which should grow to nearly 2' long, with 18" expected, puts a burden on the bioload of a small pond unless you plan on doing lots of pond maintenance.

Also... plan on your goldfish breeding in a year or two so you don't want to fully stock it today or you will be grossly overstocked in a year or two and you'll be looking for homes and as you know, there's not a lot of people out there that can handle long bodied goldfish. This is another reason not to mix Koi and goldfish as they can interbreed and the hybrids are often not very pretty and many revert back to looking more like common carp with greenish to brownish coloring.

This site has pictures and descriptions of most of the commonly available man-bred variants of common goldfish. http://www.bristol-aquarists.org.uk/goldfish/goldfish.htm Click on the thumbnail images to see them larger.
 
I read somewhere that min size was 1000 gal per koi. My plan was one koi and a school of goldfish and perhaps some rosy reds and minnows. I really only wanted one koi to make a pet out of. :)

Dimensions on the pond at the "small end" are 6' x 6' wide x 3' deep, Dimensions at the "big end" are 8' x 7' wide x 4' deep, with a couple stairs built into this end as well, so that will lower the gallonage a bit. I don't know how accurate those pond calculators are, but I get anywhere from 1700 gallons to 2900 gallons depending on which calculator I use. I'm not sure which to trust??
 
As for them changing colors. I was not aware that they would continue to do that? The two that they had were almost solidly orange with a few little brown blotchies on them. They looked very much like slightly discolored common goldfish. Is this usual for a young shubunkin? These guys were around 2-3" long including tails.
 
rainbowcharmer said:
I read somewhere that min size was 1000 gal per koi. My plan was one koi and a school of goldfish and perhaps some rosy reds and minnows. I really only wanted one koi to make a pet out of. :)

Dimensions on the pond at the "small end" are 6' x 6' wide x 3' deep, Dimensions at the "big end" are 8' x 7' wide x 4' deep, with a couple stairs built into this end as well, so that will lower the gallonage a bit. I don't know how accurate those pond calculators are, but I get anywhere from 1700 gallons to 2900 gallons depending on which calculator I use. I'm not sure which to trust??
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Correct... anywhere from 500G to 1,000G per Koi is the minimum amount with 500G requiring more pond maintenance and filter cleaning. BUT... there's always a BUT... the pond size still has to be an acceptable size for a BIG fish like that. Since the minimum length of a Koi pond should be at least 18' long with 24' being my preferred minimum (8X their expected length to give them plenty of swimming room) and that would mean 6' to 9' wide to give them turning room and an average of 4' deep with 6' being preferred to give them some vertical swimming and diving room, the math adds up to... using the smallest numbers above, 18' x 6' x 4' avg. depth = 3,231 gallons and my recommended numbers above, 24' x 9' x 5' avg. depth = 8,078 gallons. So, with the smaller pond numbers, you could have 3 to 6 Koi with 6 meaning LOTS more pond maintenance. With the bigger numbers, you could have 8 Koi and have an easier life to enjoy the pond.

As I mentioned mixing Koi and goldfish is NOT recommended as you will almost certainly end up with hybrids and you will then have to make the choice to cull (a nice word for kill) them since you won't be able to rehome them very easily. Most people don't have room for goldfish, much less Koi hybrids that get bigger than goldfish and are reasonably ugly looking carp. You already stated that you didn't want to buy ugly fish and neither do most other people... although you could grow them out and fry them up for the next backyard party! ;-)

If you look at that Bristol Goldfish Society page, you'll see a goldfish called a Wakin that looks similar to Koi but doesn't get as big so you could go for some of them but remember if you don't keep all Wakin's they will interbreed with your other variants and you'll end up with a bunch of calico's as time goes by.
 
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