Water frustrations... more apple snails, same problem!

That's good to know about Maracyn having copper. Using Maracyn on my betta was a mistake that I truly regretted. I wasn't even aware that fish meds would kill snails until I had these recent problems, so this has been a learning experience. I wish the manufacturers would make that clear on the label. Last night I put the snails in a separate bowl while I ran charcoal in their tank overnight. They were no better this morning - just sitting on the bottom partially open and lifeless. It's either my water in general or the meds from the old tank poisoned them. I thought about getting some water from work (which is municipal water) and see if that makes a difference. I honestly don't think they're going to make it, but I'm trying everything I can.
 
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I'm sorry you are still having troubles with your snails. I've never had snails do this so I'm kinda stumped. I think the advice on water changes and adding carbon are spot on.

Is there anything else in the tank that could have been in with the medication, such as driftwood? Driftwood can sometimes act as a sponge and soak up the bad. What do you use as a water conditioner? I have heard that some people who overdose with Prime can have issues with their inverts. I've used it many times with no issues though. I can't remember if your tank is planted. Are you using any fertilizers?

Do you have city water or well water? If they are in a container with a little bit of tank water and some tap water, do they perk up? If after doing a water changes so they slowly acclimate to all tap water do they perk up? If no, I wonder if there is something in you water from the tap. If it's well water it could have some chemicals and run-off from fields and lawns that may be harming them that would not show up in your tests.

How big is the tank? Is it one that the water changes could easily be done by buying water?

I have no idea if any of this is useful, I'm just trying to help you come up with some answers or ideas.
 
Hi Mykids: Questions are always helpful and appreciated :) I really want to figure this out.

It's a 5 gallon tank and I have one plant and a moss ball. I have well water. I did switch tanks after AquaticAustin suggested the sealant might've absorbed some meds. The heater and filter were in the medicated betta's tank and I'm still using those. Can they absorb meds too? It's hard plastic...? Is there any way to detox all this stuff? The filter media was new and so is the substrate. The snails don't really perk up after water changes. They sometimes perk up if I put them in a smaller bowl, but not lately. I do use Prime and was worried about overdosing it since I was doing so many water changes. I posted that question on here before, but everyone said it wasn't a problem (?). I never use more than the label says.

Today on my lunch hour I got water from work (municipal) and did a 60% w/c. I want to see if this water makes a difference. If it does, then I'll KNOW it's my well water. The ivory snail perked up immediately and began climbing on the plant with its tentacles out! :dance2: I was sure it was dying because there was no recoil at all when I touched the operculum. So that was a pleasant surprise. The blue one opened up a tiny bit more but not much else. However, when I was leaving the ivory one was back to closed up and floating. :( Ugh, who knows. It's so baffling I can't stand it.

I have no problem bringing in water from outside sources if I have to. I just wish I knew for sure that was the problem. BTW, ammonia and nitrite readings are both 0. Nitrate is 20.

Will drastic changes in pH cause this problem? Mine is quite high at 8.4. I tested the water from work and it was only slightly lower. Since I'm sure Petsmart uses the same tap water I can't imagine their water would be much different. I could call them and ask, but I've gotten so much BS from those people that it exasperates me. I so wish I had a LFS around here!

Will keep you posted...
 
Some fish med's and plant fert's contain copper and aren't safe to use if you have snails or shrimp.
Heavy dosing of prime shouldn't hurt anything I've done that myself before and it didn't bother any of my fish or invert's.
Your ph is pretty high but shouldn't have that affect on them, higher ph is better then low ph when it comes to snails.
 
Hey sorry been busy so I havnt been back. I think the tank and medicine remnants are a problem, the medications do say something like "not safe for inverts" and most medications are bad for snails. They all warn online they can stain your sealant (in the case of colored ones) and if they can do that it is clear they can be absorbed and slowly leached into the water and in such a small tank may be enough to kill them. Iv never heard of it actually killing them but it is very possible. I do not think they will leech into hard plastic and rocks, but can leech into plastic plants and cloth decor. I actually had maracyn 2 kill a apple snail I forgot in my tank when I used it to trear, great medication just not so much for snails lol. Other than that im confused as to the problem, they are generally pretty hardy to water conditions, when my egg clutches recently hatched my tank nitrates spiked pretty high and I didnt lose any of the 400 babies or my 5 golf ball ones. I forgot are you using prime? It is supposed to remove some heavy metals I believe. It is also again possible that the snails from petsmart arnt healthy as is often true of big box store livestock. maybe ask what they feed and duplicate it? Your situation is truly odd im sorry to say. also you can try using bottled or purified water and see if that can help.

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Squid, good to know that about the pH! Austin, yes I'm using Prime. I'm stumped too. The reason I got snails again is because I thought they'd be lower maintenance than another betta. It's possible Petsmart has unhealthy stock, but they were plenty lively when I bought them, as were the other two. And they both got sick together. So it has to be in my tank. They don't have very healthy looking shells though - one has a pinhole and both are quite chipped away at the edges. I wonder if this makes them more vulnerable to toxins? And their operculums (opercula?) are concave and seem too small for the opening. Does this mean something?

I'm not seeing any improvement tonight. I'm puzzled by the short-lived spurt from the ivory earlier today. It was so encouraging but it hasn't happened since. I have charcoal in the filter and I'm trying to be patient. I don't think the big water changes are helping so I'm going to lay off on that and let the poor snails rest and try to recover.

All I can do now is wait it out and hope they pull through. If anyone thinks of something else, feel free to let me know.
 
You said earlier that the temp was 76 F. Can you slowly bump your heater up to closer to 79/80? Try and see if that helps. Mine are more active at warmer temps. Other than that I am completely stumped.


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The blue snail has died :( The ivory is hanging in there. It has short spurts where it moves around a little, but then it goes back to being inactive and sliming. I'm keeping it in a small bowl while the tank is running charcoal and I'm now using water from work. So... different bowl, different water and still sick and sliming. The only common denominator I can see ... Prime!
 
Chickadee said:
The only common denominator I can see ... Prime!
Click to expand...

I've just been keeping up with this thread to maybe learn something. But I have serious doubts about it being Prime. I'm sure there are Alot of people here with snails and have used prime in their tanks for years.

Sorry, I don't have much experience with snails myself.

GL with everything, and finding the problem.
 
I know, everyone says it isn't possible. I just can't figure it out. One thing I have observed is that her shell is quite chipped and the operculum doesn't fit the shell opening. She slimes where her flesh is exposed. Is this typical of snails with shell damage? I probably should've posted this thread on the invert board, but it all started out as questions about water quality.

I've been taking her to work in the small bowl so I can monitor the temperature. She's become quite a star there. She has spurts of activity where she will cruise around and look almost normal, but she's still mostly inactive. I'm encouraged that she's now sticking to things instead of just sitting motionless and partially floating. That's a good thing, right? Tonight I boiled some veggies and am trying to get her interested in eating.

I don't know for sure it's a female, but I did get a good look inside her shell and didn't see any male parts. Of course she's probably too young to sex, but I got tired of calling her an it. So for now she's a she. :)
 
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