Why my Ammonia is high and my pH level crashed again?

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Byron Amazonas

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Thanks Miguel for the link and help.

Byron thanks again. What really baffles me is that I didn't get readings of ammonia after my tank cycled, until my old tank leaked.

I am now realizing that the filter and filter media stood in tank water without oxygenation for several hours!
Also the gravel completely dried up too.

Would these be the cause of my Ammonia readings?
Would dosing Prime more than recommended (trying to save fish from the ammonia readings) also cause false readings?

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On the last question first, Prime might possibly add chemicals that will affect test results, as Miguel earlier mentioned. A microbiologist friend of mine once told me that we don't always know exactly what chemicals may be in certain products, and some absolutely do cause inaccurate tests. Given my previous comment about using Prime, I certainly would not use it more than necessary to condition "new" water being added. Aside from anything else, Prime, like all conditioners, adds TDS (total dissolved solids) and Prime actually adds quite a bit, and this is something that soft water fish like cardinals do not at all appreciate. We think of "hard" water as meaning mineral hard, like calcium and such, but hard water also includes any TDS, and these arrive in all sorts of things from water conditioner, fish food, plant fertilizers, treatments, additives, etc. The fewer the better.

As for the ammonia from the substrate drying, I have heard this elsewhere. No direct experience, but someone else may be able to confirm. Same for the filter media. Nitrifying bacteria will survive longer than many realize in the absence of oxygen, ammonia, etc, and I've no idea just how long. This article may have more info for you:
http://www.practicalfishkeeping.co....r_bacteria?_Dream_on…&utm_content=html

Byron.
 

PattyCakes81

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Thanks Byron for the link and help. Tested the ammonia and still is at 1ppm but luckily the pH is 6.0 as well.
My order off Seachem Equilibrium and flourish comes tomorrow. Where I going to do another water change and stay adding the equilibrium and flourish. Hopefully this week help out the my plants.





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Byron Amazonas

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Thanks Byron for the link and help. Tested the ammonia and still is at 1ppm but luckily the pH is 6.0 as well.
My order off Seachem Equilibrium and flourish comes tomorrow. Where I going to do another water change and stay adding the equilibrium and flourish. Hopefully this week help out the my plants.

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On the Equilibrium, go easy. I would not do more than one level tablespoon for the tank. Then test the GH the following day.
 

PattyCakes81

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On the Equilibrium, go easy. I would not do more than one level tablespoon for the tank. Then test the GH the following day.
So I guess got to buy a GH test kit.:) On my way to Amazon to buy.

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PattyCakes81

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Did my weekly water change today. I removed a little over 70 percent of the water. I added 1 tablespoon of Seachem Equilibrium (whoa that made the tank cloudy of a while), 1ml of Seachem Flourish, and 1 ml of Seachem Prime to my tank.

I know the Seachem Equilibrium is dosed once every water change. How about the Seachem Flourish? The bottle days 1 to 2 times a week, do I followed that?
Also do you guys recommend I start to dose Seachem excel too?

The GH testing kit a ordered comes tomorrow, so I will test my GH then and post the results.
I also removed one of the three light bulbs I had on (now I have 26 watts on for 8 hours a day) as you suggested in my other thread.

Water Parameters after 4 hours:
Ammonia-.25ppm
Nitrite-0ppm
Nitrate-10ppm
pH-6.6

Does Seachem Equilibrium and/or Seachem Flourish add any nitrate to the water?


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jpappy789

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Seems like your ammonia has become more manageable, that's a good sign.

Flourish comp doesn't have to be dosed after the water change, according to the directions...otherwise you are correct. It's intended to be dosed 1-2 times/week. It does have N (in the form of "protein hydrolysates" according to Seachem, which is very vague :rolleyes:). So that, plus any N added from food, and any additional internal breakdown occurring, could eventually feed into NO3 production.

Equilibrium appears to be K, Ca, Mg, Fe, Mn sulfates...so no discernible N as far as I can tell.

Excel might not be needed, but IME it can't really hurt...although some people have had certain species react negatively. I've never run into that issue myself. It may be worth a try if you think your plants need a boost.
 

Byron Amazonas

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Did my weekly water change today. I removed a little over 70 percent of the water. I added 1 tablespoon of Seachem Equilibrium (whoa that made the tank cloudy of a while), 1ml of Seachem Flourish, and 1 ml of Seachem Prime to my tank.
The cloudiness is my only complaint about Equilibrium, but it (the cloudiness) does disappear within a few hours or at most overnight. The liquid form in the AquaVitro line would avoid this. I cannot afford the liquid, I use Equilibrium.

This is a 20g tank, so I would add 1/2 teaspoon of Flourish Comprehensive after the weekly water change. No more, and just the once weekly. You likely won't need a second dose, given your plants and other balancing factors.

I know the Seachem Equilibrium is dosed once every water change. How about the Seachem Flourish? The bottle days 1 to 2 times a week, do I followed that?
Flourish Comp once, as mentioned above. Equilibrium after the water change, but probably less. Once you have your GH test you can sort this out. For the plants which is why you are using it here, you only need around 4 to 5 dGH. With the one tablespoon added, you will probably find the GH is around this now. When you do the water change next week, replacing half the tank volume, you only need add the Equilibrium to increase the GH in the fresh water, so depending upon the GH test result prior to that water change, a teaspoon not a tablespoon may be all you need.

I also removed one of the three light bulbs I had on (now I have 26 watts on for 8 hours a day) as you suggested in my other thread.
This should work. I have two 10w CFL Daylight over my 20g high, but no fish (the major source of nitrogen) so you should be fine.

Does Seachem Equilibrium and/or Seachem Flourish add any nitrate to the water?
Flourish Comp does have nitrogen, in the forms of ammonium and nitrate, but minimally. As I think I have said elsewhere, this liquid fert has all nutrients required by aquatic plants except oxygen, hydrogen and carbon. But some of the macro nutrients are minimal because they occur naturally from biological processes and water changes.

Also do you guys recommend I start to dose Seachem excel too?
No. There is no need in your tank for carbon supplements, even if they were safe, and Excel is not safe. It will melt some plants (Vallisneria is especially sensitive) at normal dosage, but if it should be overdosed it can kill plants, fish and bacteria. It is also hazardous to humans, as specified in the chemical fact sheet.

Excel (and API's CO2 Booster is the same) contains glutaraldehyde and water. Glutaraldehyde is a disinfectant used in hospitals, in anti-freeze, embalming fluid and elsewhere to kill bacteria. I do not see the wisdom of adding this to a fish tank.

Carbon occurs as CO2, present from the respiration of bacteria, plants and fish, but mostly from the breakdown of organics in the substrate. There is plenty of this for the plants, to balance your light and other nutrients and fish load.

Byron.
 

PattyCakes81

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Seems like your ammonia has become more manageable, that's a good sign.

Flourish comp doesn't have to be dosed after the water change, according to the directions...otherwise you are correct. It's intended to be dosed 1-2 times/week. It does have N (in the form of "protein hydrolysates" according to Seachem, which is very vague :rolleyes:). So that, plus any N added from food, and any additional internal breakdown occurring, could eventually feed into NO3 production.

Equilibrium appears to be K, Ca, Mg, Fe, Mn sulfates...so no discernible N as far as I can tell.

Excel might not be needed, but IME it can't really hurt...although some people have had certain species react negatively. I've never run into that issue myself. It may be worth a try if you think your plants need a boost.
The cloudiness is my only complaint about Equilibrium, but it (the cloudiness) does disappear within a few hours or at most overnight. The liquid form in the AquaVitro line would avoid this. I cannot afford the liquid, I use Equilibrium.

This is a 20g tank, so I would add 1/2 teaspoon of Flourish Comprehensive after the weekly water change. No more, and just the once weekly. You likely won't need a second dose, given your plants and other balancing factors.

Flourish Comp once, as mentioned above. Equilibrium after the water change, but probably less. Once you have your GH test you can sort this out. For the plants which is why you are using it here, you only need around 4 to 5 dGH. With the one tablespoon added, you will probably find the GH is around this now. When you do the water change next week, replacing half the tank volume, you only need add the Equilibrium to increase the GH in the fresh water, so depending upon the GH test result prior to that water change, a teaspoon not a tablespoon may be all you need.

This should work. I have two 10w CFL Daylight over my 20g high, but no fish (the major source of nitrogen) so you should be fine.

Flourish Comp does have nitrogen, in the forms of ammonium and nitrate, but minimally. As I think I have said elsewhere, this liquid fert has all nutrients required by aquatic plants except oxygen, hydrogen and carbon. But some of the macro nutrients are minimal because they occur naturally from biological processes and water changes.

No. There is no need in your tank for carbon supplements, even if they were safe, and Excel is not safe. It will melt some plants (Vallisneria is especially sensitive) at normal dosage, but if it should be overdosed it can kill plants, fish and bacteria. It is also hazardous to humans, as specified in the chemical fact sheet.

Excel (and API's CO2 Booster is the same) contains glutaraldehyde and water. Glutaraldehyde is a disinfectant used in hospitals, in anti-freeze, embalming fluid and elsewhere to kill bacteria. I do not see the wisdom of adding this to a fish tank.

Carbon occurs as CO2, present from the respiration of bacteria, plants and fish, but mostly from the breakdown of organics in the substrate. There is plenty of this for the plants, to balance your light and other nutrients and fish load.

Byron.
Thanks jpappy and Bryon for the great advice! We greatly appreciated it.
The GH and KH test haven't arrived yet but I tested my water parameters again:

Ammonia-Between 0ppm & .25ppm, FINALLY :D:D:D:D it's going down. It was a little hard to figure out the amount of ammonia it was more yellowish than the color of .25ppm.

Nitrite-0ppm

Nitrates-Between 5ppm-10ppm
pH-6.4

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PattyCakes81

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API GH and KH test kit finally came. arrived:)

I think I did the tests correct:confused:

GH-6 or 7
KH-3 or 4

Can someone explain the testing to me?
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Byron Amazonas

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API GH and KH test kit finally came. arrived:)

I think I did the tests correct:confused:

GH-6 or 7
KH-3 or 4

Can someone explain the testing to me?
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The number of drops you count until the water in the tube changes colour (the GH goes from orange to green, can't remember the KH colours) is the degrees of GH (or KH), roughly. So for the GH, if it takes 6 drops to turn from orange to green, the GH is 6 dGH. This equates to 107 ppm. You multiply dGH by 17.9 to get ppm, and divide ppm by 17.9 to get dGH. Same goes for KH. I personally like the smaller numbers, I sort of know what they mean now, but either scale is fine.

The colours are sometimes a bit faint, but hold the tube over something white (a sheet of paper) and look down into the tube (un-stoppered obviously, lol); I find this easier with the GH and KH tests. The change to green will be very apparent. Over time the regents do weaken, not sure how long; my old kit which I had had for several years was very hard to discern colours.

With the GH at 6 (or 7), next week only add 1 level teaspoon. Test the tank water next day. You want 4 or 5 dGH and no point wasting stuff and raising it higher, with soft water fish.

Byron.
 
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