New gold nugget pleco (L018)

[Blinky]

I traded in a bunch of platys for store credit today (after I lost my angel, the population got absolutely out of control, there are still ~15 babies in the tank). I'd been admiring the gold nuggets in the store for a while, but was wary of buying an expensive fish (I guess it's all relative, they're expensive compared to what I've bought in the past, but not overly pricey when it comes to plecs). With my staff discount and the trade-in, the price of a gold nugget wasn't so steep, so today I brought one home :D
S/he's in quarantine, with an established filter, plenty of plants and some driftwood. The tank is at 82F, similar to the display tank that will be his/her permanent home.
The 65g has lots of bogwood with many places to hide and is heavily planted. The only territorial fish in the tank are a 1/2" angel and a 3" bristlenose (Ancistrus claro). I'm a bit hesitant to put the new catfish with the bristlenose, but everything I've read seems to indicate that as long as there's room for both to establish territories they'll be fine.
Just curious if anyone has any advice on keeping the little guy happy and healthy - from what I've read, they like a warm tank with decent current, and eat just as much 'meaty' food as algae/veggies, but I'm sure there are things I haven't learned yet.

[MonoSebaelover]

You sound very well on track! I love Gold Nuggets, esp L018. When I had mine (years ago-I also had a Zebra) I would feed them both algae wafers, frozen bloodworms, frozen brine shrimp, cucumber, zuch., and lettuce. Good luck with him, they are amazing!

[Biznatch]

Well he will outgrow your 65 if you are sure he is a L18. If it's an L81 (I think) then it will stay like 6-8". Otherwise There are 3 different L numbers for gold nuggets that get ~14". Not that I should talk, they had a sale on them for half off so they were 25$ instead of 50$ and I bought a very nice looking one. They had a bunch of little ones that looked beat up/not great and 1 2 1/2" one with perfect fins and nice color.

Look at his belly and make sure it is nice and round and not sucked up at all. If so I would take it back for a replacement as those ones usually die (from what I have read on planetcatfish). Mine is in a tank with a 1 1/2" bristle nose and a 1" rubber lip. He will occasionally chase them away if they are grazing near him but that's about it. Good luck with him, he is a very good looking fish (One of my favorite next to my Starlite bristlenose plec). I love watching mine swim around the tank grazing on algae. When I put shrimp pellets in he will drop to the ground and eat some of them. He's not very shy at all considering I have had him for like 5 days.

[Blinky]

S/he wasn't labeled with an L number in the store, but I looked at planet catfish and I'm pretty sure this is L018 (medium spot). S/he is about 2" long, and looks very close to this picture:
http://www.planetcatfish.com/images/mid/loricariidae/baryancistrus/sp(l018)/1.jpg
Looking at the catfish of the month article (http://www.planetcatfish.com/cotm/2000_12.php) from that site, I'm fairly certain it's not L177, and L085/81 seems to have many more, smaller spots than the fish I bought. My fish also seems to be a brighter yellow, so by process of elimination, along with the fact that it seems to be the one most commonly available, I'm pretty sure it's L018.
If s/he outgrows the 65g, hopefully it won't be for quite some time - based on what I've read they grow quite slowly. InThis thread (http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=46229&page=1&pp=15&highlight=gold+nugget) others said it's rare for them to reach 14" in a tank, but if s/he does, I'm prepared to get another tank (I'm sure my husband will be thrilled! ;))
I'm happy to say it appears s/he's eating. His/her belly isn't exactly round, but it's not hollow, and there's poop on the sand this morning so s/he must be eating something :)

[nursie]

Wow...I just got a golden nugget pleco for about 3 bucks. I trust this LFS to know what they have, and they said it would stay small.
After looking at the linked pics...I don't think that is what I have. It's rather small, about 1 1/2". Maybe I misunderstood what they said. Any other small pleco with golden in it's name?

[cohazard]

Maybe you got a snowball pleco?


HTH,
Serg

EDIT: on second thought, they can be pricey like gold nuggets

[nursie]

I'm not sure what I got. This thing is such a baby! It's only about 1 1/2" long. His/her belly is white..and the back was pale when he came out of the bag, and he has been cleaning the front of the tank all evening so that's all I've really seen. I went around to the side to try to take pics through the side to post to get a look at the rest of him, and by golly, he is dark with little spots. Maybe he is one. I have plenty of algae...on the back of the tank of course. I wish he's go there. I got some algae wafers and put in for him and the loaches. Of course the skanky snails are all over them. the loaches munched a bit, and have nipped at a few of the snails..yeah!..but I hope this little guy does ok. I don't have any veggies in the house except carrots, I'll have to get some tomorrow. I had no clue the bigger ones went for so much.
My pics turned out bad...shooting through the glass to something on the front glass apparently isn't a good thing. When I get a good pic, I'll post in a new thread.

[Blinky]

I'd give the store a call, ask for the plec's L number or latin name. Common names aren't always reliable, sometimes people make names up too, believe it or not. You could try doing a search through planetcatfish.com, see if you can find your little guy. I'm curious :)

[nursie]

I actually did go out to planetcatfish to look, but didn't see any pics of young golden nugget plecs.
I'm going back to the store later next week, I'll ask. They were low on stock, I could only get 2 clown loaches and 1 kuhli loach and they had no pearl gouramis. They get excellent stock and care for them well.

[Biznatch]

The smaller ones will look like the bigger ones. The pet store I went to had some that were about 1 1/2 inches and they were the same color, they just had smaller spots. The spots aren't too small either. They also have yellow on the tips of both of their tails. If it doesn't have that yellow it isn't a gold nugget. The small ones were the same price (25$ on sale which is the cheapest I have seen anywhere). If the one you have has really tiny dots and you got it for 3$ I would say you prolly got a rubberlip or bulldog plec. I have one that is about 1 1/4" and he has small spots on his face only.

[cohazard]

The small ones were the same price (25$ on sale which is the cheapest I have seen anywhere)

:OT:

Sorry Blinky, I really hate posting off-topic, and I've never done it before, but I have to say, Biznatch.........$25 is on sale? I got my gold nugget (L18) from my buddy Steve who owns a pet shop, for $13 bucks! :D Plus, since I'm a friend of his, I always get a discount on whatever I buy, and don't pay sales tax. :dance2: So my gold nugget was under $13 bucks for a healthy young specimin (1.5").


Serg

[nursie]

Could be, Biznatch. He's going to have to get a little bigger and look like one of the pics some more for me to figure it out. I keep trying to snap a pic of him and he's being coy...

[MonoSebaelover]

Have you looked at Bristlenose plec's? They are brown and some have tiny yellow spots. They generally go really cheap. I think I would die if I saw a true Gold Nugget for $3. But hey, 4 years ago I bought a Zebra Pleco for 20 bucks. Amazing how 4 years can change the price (they are now ~250!).
SoCalSunset-it really depends on where you live. I know here in Colorado they are generally always in the 25-29 dollar range, the places that buy wholesale and can get a lot are priced at 19.

[Blinky]

SoCalSunset, don't worry about it, it's not really a hijack, we're still talking about catfish with spots ;)
nursie, check out Ancistrus claro on planetcatfish, I wonder if you've got a 'gold marble' bristlenose. Mine was about $7.50CD, has small pale yellow dots all over, and the tips of his tail are yellow, but it's not a stripe like the gold nugget. These are great fish, I love my bristlenose to death :)

Just an update on the nugget, he's still SKINNY, and I'm quite worried about him, but he's pooping normally (no white, stringy feces), not hiding, and munching away at the little bit of algae on the glass. I've got the blinds open, trying to encourage more algae growth, but all it's done is give me green water lol. I've tried feeding him daphnia (it's a gel food my other fish go crazy for), chunks of freeze dried brine shrimp, algae wafers, bottom feeder wafers, staple flakes, spirulina flakes, he's not touching anything. The snails jump on any food I throw in the tank, so I'm wondering if he's just too chicken to challenge them. I think tomorrow I'm going to move the shrimp and most of the snails into another tank to see if that helps.

Here's a pic from planetcatfish of A. claro, and an attached image of my little guy :)

http://www.planetcatfish.com/images/full/loricariidae/ancistrus/claro/1.jpg

[wayne]

I would get some bits of shrimp in there and leave them in overnight. Until they get going they are not great feeders, and eating only algae is a bad sign they're starving. I've posted before on how I think it works best to keep them. I never bred them , but people local to me ave, and i do the same as them.

[Blinky]

Wayne, do you mean shrimp from the grocery store? I've got some freeze-dried brine shrimp and freeze-dried 'baby shrimp', which I believe are just full grown brine shrimp - they're about 1cm long, would these be suitable? I can go to the store if something like cocktail shrimp are what he'd prefer.
I have read that gold nuggets eating algae isn't a great sign, I've tried feeding him everything but the kitchen sink, he's just not interested.
He's checking out the driftwood and polyresin wood decoration this morning, which I take as a good sign (he's on top of it, not hiding). He's been sticking to a few areas of the glass so far, not doing any exploring. I figure if he's on the wood, it's just a short trip down to the substrate, where the food is.
I'll be doing a water change later, taking out most of the snails and I'll add a few tidbits and see if he'll eat :)

[Swimfins]

I'm not sure what I got. This thing is such a baby! It's only about 1 1/2" long. His/her belly is white..and the back was pale when he came out of the bag, and he has been cleaning the front of the tank all evening so that's all I've really seen. I went around to the side to try to take pics through the side to post to get a look at the rest of him, and by golly, he is dark with little spots. Maybe he is one. I have plenty of algae...on the back of the tank of course. I wish he's go there. I got some algae wafers and put in for him and the loaches. Of course the skanky snails are all over them. the loaches munched a bit, and have nipped at a few of the snails..yeah!..but I hope this little guy does ok. I don't have any veggies in the house except carrots, I'll have to get some tomorrow. I had no clue the bigger ones went for so much.
My pics turned out bad...shooting through the glass to something on the front glass apparently isn't a good thing. When I get a good pic, I'll post in a new thread.

I think you might have a gold ancistrus pleco. They can max out at about 6 inches. Nice.

Blinky, I don't mean to rain on your parade, but are you sure you want that gold nugget in you beautiful planted 65g? I'm wondering wether that 7 inch (or more) plec isn't going to have a poop fest and a good time plant bashing. I was considering a mango plec, they have several beauties this week at my lfs, and I'd even shell out the 50 bucks they're asking, but maturing at 11 inches? I can say bye bye plants :(

Wait a minute! The L18 maxes out at 6 inches. Nice :) Pretty one.

[Blinky]

From what I've read, they have the potential to reach quite a large size (14" or so in the wild), but rarely reach more than about 7" in tanks. If he begins to outgrow the 65g, he'll get a new, larger home, no worries :)
Everything I've read says these guys don't eat plants, they like to sift through the bottom for goodies and eat algae as a last resort. I can see a big plec doing serious damage in a planted tank just from sheer size, they'd be like a bull in a china shop. Right now I'm just hoping he makes it over this hunger strike he's got going on, I'll be mighty proud of him if he ever makes it to a size big enough to crush my plants :D.

[Blinky]

Update...
This afternoon I moved most of the snails into a breeder trap (since it's a QT I didn't want to put them in another tank, on the off chance they may carry a disease brought in by the plec). I dropped half an algae wafer and a couple crab cuisine pellets into the tank, one in the spot where the plec spent last night, and one directly under his nose. He sniffed it, and a few minutes later he moved to another spot.
After doing some more reading, something dawned on me: for a plec that likes current, there's really not much in this tank. In addition, there's lots of CO2 (for the plants), and it's quite warm (~82F). The plants are pearling, so I know there's lots of O2, but for a fish accustomed to lots of current maybe these conditions aren't appropriate. I know that lethargy and lack of appetite are signs of too much CO2, so just in case I added an airstone to off-gass the CO2 (I think the plants will be fine with just Excel for carbon) and threw a small internal filter in the tank to add current. It's not overwhelming, but it's definitely moving the water a lot more than the small HOB filter was.

After a few hours, the plec has perked up a bit. He's still not eating the algae wafer, but he's busy chewing on a piece of driftwood which I take as a good sign :)

[Swimfins]

My little clown plec started out in life like this as well. I had to lower the lights and stand in front of the tank for just a glimpse to know if he was still alive.
I fed spirulina tabs and by morning they were gone. On the other hand I had a tiny ancistrus that went about munching straight away, no qualms. He passed away, unknown as to why, about 2 weeks later. He was no larger than a half inch or so. I thought my old clown got to him but he had no visible sign of injury. Dunno.
Anyway, I think plecs are one of those fish that need time to establish themselves. Now, my clown plec owns the tank and is visible at any time during the day. Give him some time. Its a good thing about blowing off some co2. I think where these fish come from, raised or wild, there is likely no added co2 and maybe the ph being lower is something he needs to adjust to.
Try a nice piece of zuchini and see if come mornig there's any chomps in it.
It is a pretty plec. Yup. Makes me feel like getting a new plec too....oh my!

[Blinky]

I sure hope this little guy makes it, he's got a great personality, so incredibly brave :D
This morning, he's hanging on the internal filter, near the nozzle. I'm not sure if he's looking for the spot in the tank with the most or least current, but he seems happy there. Unfortunately, the chunk of algae wafer is still there, but I'll try out some other foods tonight.

[Haggisman]

I have both a gold nugget(L177) and mango in my 40gal semi planted tank and they actually dont produce much waste compared to larger pl*co types(plus they are very slow growers).They both eat about as much veggies as they do meaty foods although both would only eat zuchini when first introduced(you may want to try this), neither eat my plants.As long as its belly is not hollow and its eyes are not sunken you should be ok.If its eating algae and wood then theres nothing wrong with its appitite, remember these are wild caught fish and dont know what a food pellet is, have you tried feeding it frozen bloodworm?Also many fancy pl*cos die as soon after they are added to the tank(even if they are eating)as they are full of worms and when in the lfs/being transported they dont trend to feed as they are stressed and the worms basically multiply while the fish is in a weakened state.Its a good idea to quarentine them and treat with a worming med(I actually have a wormer thats supposed to be for cattle but it works wonders with fish in the correct dose).

[Blinky]

Thanks Haggisman :)
His belly is quite hollow, but I still have hope since he was eating algae and wood. Now he's hanging out on the internal filter and doesn't seem to want to move. His eyes aren't sunken, he actually looks quite healthy other than the skinny tummy.
Normally I don't medicate fish unless they show definite signs of disease, but I made the decision this morning to treat him with Metronidazole, since many imported fish come with parasites. I've read that many discus breeders treat new fish with Metro as a preventative measure even if they show no signs of illness, since it's effective but mild.
I did try zuchinni, also freeze-dried shrimp, daphnia (paste), algae wafers, bottom feeder wafers, flakes... he's not interested. I'll try zuchinni again today, hopefully he'll get the hang of it soon.

[TONO]

If his eyes ar suken the plec has reached the point of no return.

[Blinky]

Um... I did say his eyes aren't sunken from what I can see.
He doesn't look 'past the point of no return', but I guess it is possible he just won't adjust and start eating.

[Swimfins]

Goodluck Blinky. Haggisman, I love the mango plecs. Last I saw them they were squabbling over zuchini bits. I'm going back to have another peek at how they're doing on Friday. I don't like to buy unless the store has had them awhile.

I say leave a nice slice of zuchini and wait til morning. I sure am hoping he'll be ok.

[Swimfins]

http://www.aquahobby.com/gallery/gnugget.html

Here's a link on the gold nugget, from what they say he's not an easy keeper.

[Blinky]

Just another update...
I feel like I'm losing my mind, this poor little fish doesn't seem to get it. He was looking more enthusiastic last night after lights out, so I dropped a few pellets in. One landed right under his nose. I held my breath, he sniffed at it, thought about it, sniffed more enthusiastically, and then it rolled off the driftwood and he forgot about it. Argh! It's so frustrating - I know if he just tastes one piece, he'll figure it out.

[Swimfins]

try regular catfish tabs..perhaps

I was bad. Bad. very bad.
I just got home from my LFS.
Yup This is your fault Blinky.

scroll down........

Here he is Royal pleco. L190. A beauty. (he was flasely labelled as l191 but he's an l190)

He was labelled as l191 (dul eyed royal plec) but he's not. He's a real Royal Pleco. Hard to come by I think.
I thought he looked better than the newer mangos, and he had been in the store for "a few weeks" so I know he is prolly good. Here's a pic.
I put him in with my betta and clouds for now. I will move him to the 66g tank in a week or so.
His colors are more vivid than this pic displays.

[Blinky]

Sweet! Gorgeous fish, I don't think you were bad at all! I was at a LFS earlier today, saw some Royals, they're really appealing fish - I can totally understand why you came home with one :)
I nearly bought a black and white striped Pecolita, they had thin and thicker striped types, they were just beautiful. I would have brought one home, but I'd have nowhere else to put him other than in the QT with the gold nugget, and I don't want the nugget to have to compete for territory or food, or risk him getting an infection from another fish.
The little guy seems to be perking up, he's more active and working very hard on cleaning the wood and polyresin decoration ATM. He's pooping, so at least I know he's eating something, even if it's only algae. I'm treating with both Metronidazole and MelaFix - he has a lighter patch near his dorsal fin, I'm afraid he may have started to develop a bacterial infection, so I'd like to nip it in the bud with MelaFix and water changes, before it can take hold. The Metro should help if he's got internal parasites.
I absolutely love his personality, I sure hope he keeps getting better *fingers crossed*.

[Swimfins]

I'm glad to hear he's perking up.
This one has cleaned all 4 panes in my little 25g and if it continues, he'll be moved by the weekend.
Tis a nice fish. I think I liked him better than the mangos who weren't showing as much color as I had hoped. I remember seing one about a month ago that was beautiful, but these guys weren't as pleasing from what I could see of them and they seemed shy and were hiding. They were charging 59.00 each which did seem outrageous. (the one I saw was 49.00 a month ago) They had 2 royal plecs that weren't hiding, just basking out in the open and I liked the coloration and the fact they were so laid back blinking at me with those red eyes. I'll call him Blinky :) hehehhe.
They had a 'medusa' pleco that looked interesting as well golden commons, and some rubber lip and a couple ancistrus, a gibbiceps. I had my eye out for a snowball or a goldnugget but didn't see any.

I put in a bottomfeeder tab and a few bloodworms tonight.

[Blinky]

Well, we gave it the old college try, but unfortunately he died this morning. Poor little thing, I wish I could have done more for him. Thanks for the help guys, cross your fingers for me - I'm going to see if I can get another plec today, if there are healthy ones in the tank.

[Swimfins]

:sad: wow I didn't think it was so bad....

[cohazard]

Sorry to hear about the loss Blinky. Truth is, some wild caught specimens simply will not adjust to captivity.

You didn't do anything wrong, so I'm glad to hear you're not giving up. Hopefully you're next one will be more hardy.


Serg

[Blinky]

Thanks SoCal, it feels terrible when they're sick and you can't save them, I appreciate the support :)
I read an article online that talked about how these fish can lose their gut bacteria during shipping, and it prevents them from being able to take in nutrition - they starve, and there's really nothing you can do to save them.
I went back to the store today and they had three plecs left of the 10 or so that were there when I got mine, they've been dying off with the same symptoms mine had. I suspect it's more to do with shipping than disease, since they're otherwise so healthy looking.
They gave me a replacement, she (I think it's a female) is slightly larger than the others in the tank were, and has a nice flat tummy, not at all concave. She's quite active, exploring the tank and chewing on the driftwood. There are little bits of frozen shrimp, a piece of algae wafer, and a piece of zuchinni in the tank, I'm hoping after lights out she'll feel brave enough to settle down and have a snack.
As a precaution, I'm still treating the tank with Metro. *Fingers crossed*

[Swimfins]

If they are snooping around within 15 mins. or a half hour, I think you've got a good one. How do you know its female? They say royals can't be sexed so I'm guessing its a her, now that I think about it. Yes. I know she's a lady. (Not at all shy about pooping however.)

[Blinky]

Actually, it appears from what I've just read that my instincts are backwards! I thought because this fish was bulkier it was likely a female, but it seems with gold nuggets the males have a longer, more sloping profile (females have slightly more rounded foreheads), and are a bit 'thicker'. This fish has a decidedly 'horsey' face, and is thicker through the middle than the two others in the tank were, though that could be because it's just not as skinny. Everything I have read indicates that they're very hard to sex, so it's a guess at best.
He's rooting around all over, but hasn't discovered the zuchinni yet. Hope you're right and I've got a good one :D

[Haggisman]

With pl*co its usually the males that are bulkier but females will get rounder bellies when full of eggs.

Hope you have better luck with this guy.

[Blinky]

WooHoo!
I put some frozen brine shrimp into the tank, they landed all over the substrate - I figured the plec would find at least one in his travels. He perked up when he smelled food, found not one but two shrimp, and ate them! :dance: He's eating, I'm so happy. We may not be out of the woods yet, but now at least there's a chance :D

[Swimfins]

well interest in food, and snooping... I think he/she will b just fine

[Blinky]

I'm doing a happy dance --> :dance:
The new plec is acting a bit shy, hiding under the wood - seems to me this is a good thing, I've just learned on Plecofanatics.com that sick plecs tend to hang out in the open and not react to much. He's a little pale, but looks healthy, and he's EATING!! He ate frozen brine shrimp this morning, and tonight he gobbled up about ten frozen bloodworms. I'm absolutely over the moon, I think my husband thinks I'm insane, grinning from ear to ear because a fish ate some food :D

[Swimfins]

:coffee2: I'm happy dancing this morning too. I dropped in some spinach tied to a spoon yesterday and some cucumber rings last night. The spinach is gone and the cuc's have telltale holes in the middle. :)

[nursie]

My little pl*co died yesterday am. I saw it poo a little, but never saw eating much. I tried zucchinio...peas. :(

[Blinky]

Sorry to hear that nursie :(
SF, glad to hear your little guy's doing well, that's wonderful!
It's official, the gold nugget is eating well and behaving normally - I'm thrilled :D

[Swimfins]

Sorry Nursie, that's the ups and downs of the hobby. Its a heartache.

I try to buy fish that have been in the store awhile. I've lost out on fish, however, by waiting too long and then going back only to find them gone.
But you can reserve a fish by putting a down payment on it and coming back to see it for a week or so. If you decide you don't want it, you just lose the ten bucks or so.
Good news Blinky I hope it continues.
Yes my royal is doing fine and I found a new LFS that has beautiful big tanks at very reasonable prices, so who knows. :huh: OMG! Did I say that?

[Blinky]

Just another update for anyone following the little guy's progress :)
Yesterday I noticed he seems frustrated with all the plants in the tank (micro swords), whenever a plant blocks his way he takes off and goes back to his hiding spot. I decided to remove about half of the plants and leave a large open area - that way he can either hide or come out in the open at his discretion.
As soon as I'd finished the water change and pruning, he was cruising around exploring, much less shy than before - he's obviously not as much a fan of planted tanks as I am!
He's eating everything from frozen shrimp and bloodworms to algae wafers and pellets, and doing very well. I'm starting to see a little personality as he gets used to things, he's a real cutie pie :)

[Swimfins]

I see mine out alot scrubbing down the plants. Its funny to see his round little body hike up a vals leaf and then see him work his way to the tip and the whole leaf slowly bends to the substrate and he hops off. I don't know if that will be so cute at 10 or so inches long however lol. He thinks he's an otto. He's usually grooming the driftwood. I drop in tabs, but I haven't seen him actually eat. But they're gone by morning so I think all is well.
sounds good Blinky..
I am of the opinion that a sandy, less heavilly planted tank is more suitable for these guys with rocks and lots of wood.

[TorturedSOUL]

Well I picked up a gold nugget about 1 week ago for 25 bucks. It seems to be eating pretty well. I usually find it attached to some of the wood in my tank. The guy said it was a dwarf and wouldn't get over 4 inches..I guess on the bright side, at least it is a cool looking fish for when it does get huge.

[Blinky]

It may not get huge, but I'm guessing it'll top 4" - there are a few kinds of GN, some of which apparantly won't get much larger than six inches. Others reach more than a foot in the wild, but I've seen many posts where people say they've rarely seen one more than seven or eight inches long, which is plenty big enough for me :D