My 55 gallon viquarium
- Thread starter reptileguy2727
- Start date
Yes, they do give off toxins, they're coated in them. I suggest you do more research.
You should read these by the way.
http://www.livingunderworld.org/amphibianArticles/article0007.shtml
http://www.amphibiancare.com/frogs/articles/communitytank.html
http://exoticpets.about.com/od/frogsandtoads/f/fbtandfbn.htm
http://exoticpets.about.com/od/reptilesandamphibians/f/mixingspecies.htm
From one of your links:
"both fire bellied newts and fire bellied toads can secrete skin toxins. It is thought that the toxins are different and distinct and they could potentially affect each other."
Note that it says they CAN, not that they do constantly. It also explicitly states that it is BELIEVED that they COULD, not that it has even proven that if they were constantly leaking toxins that they WOULD affect eachother.
In my experience I have seen nothing that suggests:
1-that they constantly leak these toxins. The toxins are an adaptation as a defense. They spend energy on them. They do not constantly leak them. If this was the case I find it hard to believe there are no observable effects at all. The guppies are healthy and breeding like crazy. Fish are highly sensitive to anything in the water and would in all likelihood have some sort of negative response to toxins in the water. The snails are also doing very well.
2-that they are toxic to eachother. If the toxin from the newts was toxic to the toads wouldn't the toads die or show some sort of negative effects after ripping the limb off of a newt? That physical attack is exactly what these toxins are there to prevent, yet they seem to be having no effect on each other.
Yes, many articles cite reasons for not mixing them. They cite differing parameters, physical attacks, and the toxin issue. Yet I have not seen any evidence to support this nor have I come across or been shown ANY scientific article showing that they constantly leak these toxins. The physical attacks are definitely a threat. But these are usually a result from under-sized and improperly setup enclosures, overcrowding, and underfeeding. The same results would occur in a community aquarium, so I guess we need to keep every species of fish alone too.
This setup is young. Many years ago I had this same combination setup for years without any issues the entire time. I really cannot take the word of others regurgitating what they heard from someone else about something they have not tried over my own observations. I have not observed anything that suggests they are inherently incompatible.
I am in no way saying 'they are fine together', 'go ahead and mix them', etc. I am saying that when their enclosure is properly setup, the populations are low, they are kept well fed, etc. it can work.
"both fire bellied newts and fire bellied toads can secrete skin toxins. It is thought that the toxins are different and distinct and they could potentially affect each other."
Note that it says they CAN, not that they do constantly. It also explicitly states that it is BELIEVED that they COULD, not that it has even proven that if they were constantly leaking toxins that they WOULD affect eachother.
In my experience I have seen nothing that suggests:
1-that they constantly leak these toxins. The toxins are an adaptation as a defense. They spend energy on them. They do not constantly leak them. If this was the case I find it hard to believe there are no observable effects at all. The guppies are healthy and breeding like crazy. Fish are highly sensitive to anything in the water and would in all likelihood have some sort of negative response to toxins in the water. The snails are also doing very well.
2-that they are toxic to eachother. If the toxin from the newts was toxic to the toads wouldn't the toads die or show some sort of negative effects after ripping the limb off of a newt? That physical attack is exactly what these toxins are there to prevent, yet they seem to be having no effect on each other.
Yes, many articles cite reasons for not mixing them. They cite differing parameters, physical attacks, and the toxin issue. Yet I have not seen any evidence to support this nor have I come across or been shown ANY scientific article showing that they constantly leak these toxins. The physical attacks are definitely a threat. But these are usually a result from under-sized and improperly setup enclosures, overcrowding, and underfeeding. The same results would occur in a community aquarium, so I guess we need to keep every species of fish alone too.
This setup is young. Many years ago I had this same combination setup for years without any issues the entire time. I really cannot take the word of others regurgitating what they heard from someone else about something they have not tried over my own observations. I have not observed anything that suggests they are inherently incompatible.
I am in no way saying 'they are fine together', 'go ahead and mix them', etc. I am saying that when their enclosure is properly setup, the populations are low, they are kept well fed, etc. it can work.
Hey man, it's your tank. You can do as you please.
On a side note: some species do give off toxins constantly. Try keeping a pickerel frog in a smallish tank with other frog species and see what happens after a couple hours.
On a side note: some species do give off toxins constantly. Try keeping a pickerel frog in a smallish tank with other frog species and see what happens after a couple hours.
Fortunately I am not housing a pickerel in my tank so that does not affect me.
With the species in question I have not found any evidence to show they are toxic to each other. I tried it. I have still yet to find any evidence that they are incompatible.
This is just my tank, but others should also be aware that just because articles and people say it and regurgitate it all the time, does not mean it is true.
With the species in question I have not found any evidence to show they are toxic to each other. I tried it. I have still yet to find any evidence that they are incompatible.
This is just my tank, but others should also be aware that just because articles and people say it and regurgitate it all the time, does not mean it is true.
Yes but most articles have truth behind them. Besides, how long have you had this setup going? Come back in a year and let us know how things have gone. I know and talk to plenty of people who breed rare, and endangered herps and pretty much everyone of them frowns upon mixing species unless it's a biotope.
As I stated before THIS setup is young. Years ago I had the same combination for years and there were never any issues at all.
I am not trying to apply what I have found with THIS combination to other scenarios and combinations. Yes, many are incompatible for numerous possible reasons. In my experience none of them posed for this combination seem to be true.
I am not trying to apply what I have found with THIS combination to other scenarios and combinations. Yes, many are incompatible for numerous possible reasons. In my experience none of them posed for this combination seem to be true.
This is something that people enjoying your setup should keep in mind. Good luck with what you are doing but I think its important that caution is taken when mixing species. Keep this thread updated so we know if any complications or issues arise or if it continues to go smoothly.
I had fire bellied toads, african dwarf frogs, green anole for over a year before i brought it down for fish without any problems
