new discus tank setup

If Pink Said It I believe it! Let me tell ya this much! Debbi has my unquestioning respect when it comes to matters of Fish keeping. The Lady knows what she is talking about!!!!!!!!!!!

PS - and FYI the fish Turbosaurus is getting from me are well past the 2.5" mark!

Arkangel77
 
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Thanks Arkangel. The discus in your avatar....one of yours? It is absolutely gorgeous!
 
Carbon DOES NOT leach anything bad back into the tanks. Carbon is really only active for maybe a month, doing what it was designed to do, adsorbing some impurities in the water and clarifying it. I keep and have always kept carbon in all of my filters. I have two filters on every tank over 30G and one on the smaller ones. Nitrifying bacteria will live on the carbon the same as it does on your normal ceramic media and sponges. So while I only throw new carbon in maybe once a year to help clear water after a rescape (yes I rescape at least once a year), it stays put as an established part of my biological filtration, gets rinsed along with the other filter contents when I clean my filters, and gets put back in. I could throw it out, I know it's usefullness as carbon is long expired, but I'd be throwing 1/3 of my nitrifying bacteria out and don't want to do that. The other 2/3's of the nitrifying bacteria are on my sponges and ceramic media. If I throw it out from my aquaclears, I'd just put another sponge in and have to wait for the bacteria to establish on the new sponge. There's just really no point to do that. You don't need carbon to keep your water clear and healthy if you're not overfeeding and you're doing adequate, routine water changes. I'm sure it seemed more useful years ago when people DIDN'T perform the necessary water changes that we now know are essential for the health of our fish. My tanks are spot on beautiful and my fish are beautiful, healthy, breeding and thriving and have been for years, including my discus. As are my plants, snails and shrimp. With thousands of dollars worth of fish and plants, any supposed leached toxins would have surely shown up by now. I dislike myths....a lot! Someday we'll discus how regularly and thoroughly rinsing all of your filter media in municipal tap water does not kill your nitrifying bacteria too.:grinno:

And while I don't advocate everyone raising young discus in planted tanks without fishkeeping experience and a thorough understanding of discus and aquarium/water care .....mine were all raised from 2" in this planted tank with 3 water changes weekly, then down to 2, then down to 1 now that they are adults. There are basic requirements that must be met in order to do this and not everyone can meet these requirements....IF the tank is large enough, IF you feed frequently but carefully, IF you're not feeding beefheart several times daily as the staple growth food where leftover beef fat goes uneaten and rapidly spoils in water, IF you've got healthy discus from healthy discus parents who possess the genetics to even achieve the average 6" discus size, and IF you are dedicated to this routine care for them, then you may be able to successfully raise 2-2.5" fish in a planted tank. There's a lot of IF's there. If the tank is large enough to promote proper growth, and your stock is good and it is barebottom and you change the water religously every day, yet you feed juvie discus only 1X or 2X a day...I guarantee you won't ever have a 6"+ discus. So the IF's are connected and required. Take a look at the competition/challenge going on the past year over at simplydiscus where each discus keeper got juvies from the same batch and each person is growing their discus out in a completely different manner and tank set up with differing maintenance and feeding schedules and routines, including in a planted tank without daily water changes and without beefheart. They are all equally successful in rearing unstunted fish that are very comparable in size. The IF's were all met and the keepers all had a thorough understanding of fishkeeping before they started. Here's a quick pic of my guys. 6" is average, some will be smaller no matter what you do (smaller, not stunted), and occasionally someone will get an 8" or 9" discus. It would be impossible to get an 8" or 9" discus with no genetics for it, no matter how much beefheart your feed and water changes you do. And even breeding two 8" or 9" discus isn't going to assure you 8" or 9" offspring. You MIGHT get another fish that large out of that batch, but odds are you won't. The average size for wild discus is 6" as well. It's the norm.

Turbosaurus, the first discus you got weren't fed or cared for properly period. Stunting and odd shaped discus can occur with a fish or two in any batch. It's a proven fact.

From what I am learning. I feel a barebottom tank is best for a mating pair of discus. I have a pair in my tank with all the plants etc; what a mess. Fry disappear get stuck in the gravel, wood, plants. This pair I have now are a major egg laying factory. Need to get a new tank. :nilly:
 
If Pink Said It I believe it! Let me tell ya this much! Debbi has my unquestioning respect when it comes to matters of Fish keeping. The Lady knows what she is talking about!!!!!!!!!!!

PS - and FYI the fish Turbosaurus is getting from me are well past the 2.5" mark!

Arkangel77
Debbi has helped out many times! I need all the help I can get! ; )
 
You are right to only keep a breeding pair in barebottom.
 
Lethalcustoms since it's your first experience with growing out discus, if you go forward, keep it as simple on yourself as possible. And follow the basic guidelines and be sure you can meet the discus requirements. The temperature in the tank needs to be kept at a mimum of 84-86F for growout so you need a reliable heater. The warmer temps keep their immune systems kicked in higher gear as well as their metabolism too. They do not need soft water, or low pH. Domestic discus are raised in varying pH's all over the country without issue. Growing out fish, not just discus, requires frequent nutritious feedings. Young fish are hungry fish so feeding a minimum of 4X a day for optimal growth is a must. A 5th or 6th feeding would be even better. Lots of high protein foods. A variety of quality foods. House brand community fish flakes isn't going to work very well.

Clean water keeps them healthy and growing. They eat often and excrete lots of ammonia and solid waste. Substrate and some plants are do-able if you keep uneaten food from decaying around the plants and in the gravel. It's easier to clean up fish waste and food waste from a barebottom tank where you can obviously see it, than in a tank with substrate. Substrate in any tank will slow your tank maintenance down a bit. Don't plant masses of groundcover where you'll never get the food out. Stick with a few broadleafed swords and crypts until the discus don't require so many feedings. Work on your ultimate aquascape after they've grown up. I personally don't believe that daily water changes are necessasry UNLESS you're feeding a raw food mixture like beefheart. (I also don't believe that beefheart needs to be part of the discus diet for the hobbyist. Cows do not find their way in the discus habitat in the amazon.). Raw food mixtures and the fat leftover from the raw beefheart can foul your tank within hours. That is when daily water changes become a necessity. Most serious breeders feed beefheart several times a day for quick growth. They want to grow them fast and sell them. We just need them to grow normally. A minimum of 3 large water changes a week to be sure to get leftover food out of there. That means gravel vaccing too. With frequent feedings you're going to have some food get trapped in the substrate. Cories are invaluable in a discus tank to eat the food on the substrate that the discus can't get to. Good food, frequent feedings, clean substrate, clean warm water. They are all necessary to grow juvie discus and really any baby fish up right.

As for keeping them with angels...while they are compatible and can be kept together successfully, I would skip the angels to concentrate on the discus and keep the discus from getting stressed out by the angels or getting outcompeted by the angels for food.

It is very different raising all young fish from juvie to adults in a tank when compared to just keeping a tank that contains full grown fish. Juvenile fish have more needs than adults. So the tank requires more attention. I think you'll find that everyone who is seriously breeding fish will agree with this.

If you've got experience keeping a tank balanced and fish healthy, you'll have more success than someone who's learning lots of different aspects of fishkeeping while trying to grow discus out at the same time.
 
Thanks Arkangel. The discus in your avatar....one of yours? It is absolutely gorgeous!

I was at the ZOO all day today! LOL :grinno:

Yes that's one of mine, I have had it for a while. I think that was one of the fish I got from Snookin and it has bin coloring up and growing nicely sense I got it! I want a few more of them and I have bin in contact with him about getting more! I am fine tuning my tank stocking right now.

Anyway Thank you!

Arkangel77
 
pink, thanks for the advice. this wont be as hard as i thought. i have given up on the angels, they too have their own tank. i do have sand in the tank, and a few plants but not many. I already too the water changes, so maintaning wont be a problem.

a new question. how should i stagger my lights on/off durring the day. I have 2 t8 bulbs on the tank now. they come on at 7 and are on 3 off 2 untill 8.
 
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