Mildly controversial topic, prestressing fish for shipping

pinkertd said:
Have you found any reference to this happening to black cories from anyone else? I have a group of 10 that I was hoping to breed. I think they are not quite 2 years old. But if they do the same thing for shipping, I'll not be selling any young ones. Redkahuna would be a good one to ask, he has shipped a gazillion cories.

No. I'll see if he has any incidences with it. My one and only experience with them was when I originally got the breeding group and lost one fish in each bag, with others languishing. I had one roll on its side while acclimating, but they all made a full recovery (minus the two females that died in transit).

Ever since that happened I decided that I wasn't going to risk it at the sake of a little fish comfort.

Inka4040 said:
OMG!!! The CRUELITTIES!!! Jeta, how dare you do that to those sweet little feldmans? You're obviously just a bitter, terrible, fish murderer!
it's okay, we still got the other Cor...oh..=[ (too soon?)
 
Do you know what the toxin is that they release, btw? Is it something that can be tested for? You probably can't tell for sure when they've released it since I'm sure it's odorless and colorless...

I'm under the impression that its the same toxin that many catfish carry in their spines. If you've ever had an experience catching/handling a catfish while out fishing then you know what it feels like to grab a catfish the wrong way. It's not the most painful thing ever, but it's definitely not pleasant, and I could see how in a very tiny environment it could quickly turn deadly.

That's total speculation on my part, though.
 
I use the breather bags when shipping, but with cories, I still leave a small spot at the top where they can grab a gulp of air. I never heard what would happen if they needed to gulp air and couldn't, so I didn't take any chances. Do you do the same?
 
As a breeder of sterbai cories, sterbai are known to release a toxin from behind their gills when stressed, therefore commiting suicide and taking the rest of the fish in the bag or container to heaven along with them. I had to do a little research on this before I shipped my baby cories. I used a method called "kick the bucket". Before shipping, I'll catch the cories 1st, and kick the bucket every time I pass it. They will release toxins into the water, which you can actually see at the top. It appears as a clear, foamy looking substance at the top. They release most of it into the bucket, so then you change the water, and bag them up. They'll still have some left during shipping, but it is estimated to be less then 20%.
From what I've read, the species that have the most toxins are Sterbai (Sterbai is considered the worst), Arcuatus, Adolfoi, Haroldschwartzi, Burgessi and possibly Robustus. I think if you can ship them while they are still small there is much less chance of the poisoning happening. I shipped many, many small sterbai (approximately 8 weeks old) all across the country without issue. Until I shipped a batch of larger sterbai....which released the toxins and arrived DOA. Shipping fish is stressful enough for me, after this happened I stopped breeding the sterbai. Maybe try the "kick the bucket" method.

Have you found any reference to this happening to black cories from anyone else? I have a group of 10 that I was hoping to breed. I think they are not quite 2 years old. But if they do the same thing for shipping, I'll not be selling any young ones. Redkahuna would be a good one to ask, he has shipped a gazillion cories.
From the only journal paper I could find on the subject, the so-called toxin is released from the skin (particularly around the pectoral spine), not from the gills. It's thought to be either a defense mechanism or an antimicrobial that is released in quantity when the fish is overly stressed.

Sterbai were the only Corydoras tested, so they are not necessarily more prone to this behavior than any other Corydoras species. Most catfish species are known to produce some type of dermal secretion.
 
Thanks RustyRay. I have not found any journal papers, only experiences and stories from people who have experienced these deaths. I may send Frank Falcone an email and ask him to share what he knows.
 
OMG!!! The CRUELITTIES!!! Jeta, how dare you do that to those sweet little feldmans? You're obviously just a bitter, terrible, fish murderer!

it's okay, we still got the other Cor...oh..=[ (too soon?)

:eek: :rofl:


Seriously, I'd also wondered about the necessity of leaving air space for cories to gulp air during transit.
 
Now that I know more about cories I do not disagree with stressing them before shipping. What I do disagree with is making it into an entertainment video where people might see it without knowing why you are doing it and think it is okay to do on a regular basis (rather than only before shipping).
 
Now that I know more about cories I do not disagree with stressing them before shipping. What I do disagree with is making it into an entertainment video where people might see it without knowing why you are doing it and think it is okay to do on a regular basis (rather than only before shipping).

Did you even read his first post where he said he normally doesn't go to such elaborate measures? If people are stupid enough to think that shaking around some fish is fun and want to do it on a regular basis, then they're gonna do that. I highly doubt Jeta's video is going to promote fish shaking.
 
AquariaCentral.com