cardinal tetras, and questions about peat moss

[jemanser]

I have a 55 gallon mature planted aquarium (several years old) w/ a little less than 2WPG and now no supplemental CO2, since it is an established tank and I inadvertently reduced my lighting from nearly 4wpg several months ago, when one of my JPS bulbs went out....What A blessing, no more CO2, trimming off excessive growth & messing with fertilizers. I have 2 varieties of java ferns growing over 3 pieces of driftwood , narrow leaf chain swords, red wendtii, and Aponogeton Natans, all doing well. The substrate is old eco-complete mixed with black aquarium gravel. My fish of several years are mostly gone... my Koi Angels lived about 8 years and my ~4 -5 year old SAE, African Knife rainbow and otocinculus cat remain. I need a change and want to go with smaller tetras, specially cardinals. A friend will take my knife and Irian rainbow fish, since my other fish should be compatible with the cardinals. I want the delicate cardinals to live and thrive, so I want ideal parameters knowing that these fish at the LFS have adapted to less than ideal water conditions. I 'm considering lowering my pH some; it hangs around 7.4. I live near Cinc.,Ohio ,where the water is hard but we do have a softener, which I will start to use. I'll probably have to use fertilizers to some degree to replace the mineral removed by the softener in order not to stunt plant growth. If I use a pillow of sphagnum peat moss in my canister filter, how lasting are its effects on pH and do I simply replace it with my water changes every 2-4 weeks or will it dissolve during that interval? Also would the miracle gro sphagnum peat moss (.05% -N, .04% K20-potash, & 02%- phosphate ) be harmful even if I thoroughly rinse it for several minutes under tap water prior to use. Of interest, after rinsing this product under soften tap water, I squeezed the water from it into a glass and tested it : pH- 6.8, nitrate 5, nitrite-0, 25GH, KH-120,but I can't test for ammonia and the N is .03% nitate nitrogen, and .02% is ammonium nitrogen.Presently, my aquarium parameters are: pH 7.3-7.4, GH25-50, KH-180, nitrate-5, nitrite-0. Also if anyone has had success with the cardinals and a reliable supplier, let me know. Sorry for this lengthy post.

[QUOTE:We can complain because rose bushes have thorns, or rejoice because thorn bushes have roses. Abraham Lincoln]

 

[Blown 346]

For a supplier I use Liveaquaria.com. They give a 14 day gurantee on all livestock and plant orders. There fish are healthy and top notch.

 

[jemanser]

thanks for this info... the site looks great.

 

[onebyone]

I filter with peat in my 10 gallon. I put about a palm sized clump of the moss in a stocking in the filter and it keeps the pH below 7 for about 2 weeks before it creeps back up again. Mine is probably close to 7.4 like yours without peat, and it drops 6.4 at the lowest with that much peat. After the two weeks I take the stocking out and replace it with a fresh batch of peat (boiled first for a couple minutes and then rinsed). I would be wary of the fertilized peat; it took me a while to find basic peat but I found it at Ace hardware for very cheap. I'd keep looking rather than use the Miracle Gro type. Also this is probably obvious but keep in mind that peat produces lots of tannins. My tank's water is orange-ish and looks pretty dark a day or two before I do water changes (30% weekly), regardless of the pH. My cardinals seem to love it though.

 

[jm1212]

i wouldnt use water that goes through a softener. they introduce salts and minerals to the water to artificially lower the pH, and these excess metals and minerals can be harmful for your fish in the long run. plus, cardinals and the fish you have now should be able to easily adapt to your tap water's chemistry.

 

[jemanser]

oneboyone- I guess from what your saying, the fluctuating pH does not bother the cardinals, or does it hang around the mid 6 range between peat moss changes? Are you doing your 30% water change every two weeks as well? I appreciate your comments -

 

[onebyone]

The pH fluctuates very slowly, and I think this is why the cardinals are not affected. I replace peat when the pH starts to rise again - I don't let it get higher than 7 before I replace it. It really depends on how often you want to replace it. For me I think the period of most rapid change is directly after the addition of new peat, where it establishes back to around 6.5 in a couple days (or a bit lower depending on how much I add). After that period, it stays around 6.5 for the remainder of the 2 weeks until it starts to rise back to 7 and I replace it again.

I actually replace peat mid week in between water changes, which are done on the weekends. My thoughts are that the most tannins leech out in the first couple days after peat is replaced so I try to time water changes to get rid of the darkest water. I don't use any activated carbon in my filter because I am told it works against peat to raise pH, so the water color is my biggest concern here.

 

[CWO4GUNNER]

i wouldn't use water that goes through a softener. they introduce salts and minerals to the water to artificially lower the pH, and these excess metals and minerals can be harmful for your fish in the long run.

Negative. A water softener is no different then using zeolite which is pre-charged to electrically attract hard water ions. A water softener is the same thing only instead of 200-300 beads in your filter a softener is a huge filter with 60,000 beads with the capability to recharge the zeolites and is the first step in every commercial RO system.


While you are correct that calcium and magnesium ions in relatively low GH PPM reading between 100 and 300 are relatively harmless to fish, higher doses above 450 can be deadly to fish in their ability to gas exchange as Cal Mag displaces O2 on a vastly higher scale then salt or potassium. When you compare toxic amounts of Cal/mag to an effective ion exchange with salt or potassium ions, these ions are vastly less harmful to fish in these ranges. In fact adding Prime has about as much salts ions added to control ammonia (not exchanged) that it is much more imposing on water quality.

I have to live with 550-600 GH PPM water and have out of necessity and experience from watching my fish previously die like flies switch to using a softener which has remarkably improved the water for my fish, now only 18 to 34 GH PPM. You have to have dealt with, understand and run the comprehensive comparative test to make any claim. Im not guessing here I am in the know and if you dont have Cal/mag above 350 PPM you don't need one, but above 450 PPM you definitely do.

 

[jemanser]

CWO4GUNNER- I appreciate your input and your comments mirror my rational in using the softener..But because of the softener I will have to add some fertilizers to my planted tank in order to avoid deficiency syndromes. Curious, are your tanks planted and if so your advice with fertilizers are welcomed. By the way, the Planted Aquarium Forum never responded to my post , thanks guys for your help-jemanser

 

[CWO4GUNNER]

Not planted and I don't mind admitting that Im awful at growing plants in the water probubly becasue Im not willing to make the lighting, fertilizer and CO2 commitment, not to mention their regulated care.

Im afraid I'm strictly a plastic and silk man, however I have had moderate to good success growing bare root plants out of my HOB, my latest success a large Pothos house plant that has really knocked down nitrates in my 60 tank from 40 PPM on by monthly water changes to 10 PPM without any special lighting or care the HOB pumping nutrients past the roots do all the fertilizing and the blue sponge insert provides the the substrata that the roots anchor into removing all the debris I might add.

With respect to water softening (ion exchange) I had to switch from using salt to using potassium which is a sort of fertilizer as you must know and it has made all the difference in the world with my bare root plants. I don't know what your using in your softener but I hope its potassium becasue salt ions interrupt the plats ability to circulate water and basically slowly kills the plant. Potassium is beneficial to plants provided you take the time to completely purge your softener system and not just start adding it which would take months to cycle out.

Again for those that don't know, Im not adding potassium just exchanging potassium ions for calcium, magnesium ions and other heavy metals for potassium ions which displaces gasses in water far far far less then the latter. Why you can have 50,000 PPM of salts in water and still maintain an O2 of 6% whereas with Cal/mag O2 levels drop to lethal limits (below 4%) at around 500 to 800 PPM Cal/Mag. Compare this with salt or potassium ion levels of only 1000 PPM and O2 levels can be maintained at the upper limits of 8-9%.