I was just reading the marine section about cycling. They use cocktail shrimp for ammonia? Can this be used in FW setups to kick start the cycle? Cuz I KNOW I can find shrimp hehe.
Thanks
Thanks
Cycle
- Thread starter countrygirl
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Sure, you can use any kind of rotting organic material. The problem, aside from the stench, is that you can't really control the levels of ammonia and nitrite. I belive that SW tanks are usually much less heavily stocked than typical FW setups. A rotting shrimp might produce enough ammonia to cycle a tank for SW, but maybe not enough for FW. Liquid ammonia, if you can find it, allows much easier dosing. Also, your house won't stink.
Jim
Jim
gotcha. my apartment has a weird smell to begin with, rotting seafood won't help. I'm hunting down ammonia
Cycle with poor filter
i have a relativly new tank, still not fully cycled with a few fish in it. its been 3 weeks since ive had the tank. i have a penguin 170 bio-wheel filter on my 20 gallon tank. and its been doing a great job. it recently has slowed down alot and i checked the filter cartride (not the bio wheel) and it is filled with gunk. i read somewhere that i shouldnt change the filter while im cycling cuz of the bacteria loss, but how would i go about cleaning my tank if my filter is soo dirty??? thanks in advance+
i have a relativly new tank, still not fully cycled with a few fish in it. its been 3 weeks since ive had the tank. i have a penguin 170 bio-wheel filter on my 20 gallon tank. and its been doing a great job. it recently has slowed down alot and i checked the filter cartride (not the bio wheel) and it is filled with gunk. i read somewhere that i shouldnt change the filter while im cycling cuz of the bacteria loss, but how would i go about cleaning my tank if my filter is soo dirty??? thanks in advance+
Just rinse it in tank water while doing a water change and stick it back in. no need to replace it unless it wears out, or you need activated carbon for some reason.
dave
dave
Okay you will be happy to know that in the process of setting up my new tank I have bought a load of water testing kits and I will be doing a fishless cycle.
Untill finding this forum I had never heard of fishless cycling and I had been advised against bothering with water tests.
So anyway I spend last night cleaning out the Eheim professional filter I got second hand with the tank. I dont think the last guy had ever cleaned his filter as it was filled and I mean filled with poo! bits that I looked at thinking were soild filter material were not foam at all but solid waste. So I took bucket after bucket of water out my 50imp gal tank and cleaned all the filter material in that and reassembled adding new filter wool at the top. Now if I fill my tank tonight with tap water and de-chlorinator and get the pump running how long are we talking before adding fish? I have hunted around both my LFS's for amonia to add and cant find any, will I be okay without as I have a mature filter?
I am also going to do a test for the first time of my 50gal tonight just to see if it is all okay, will be quite interesting!
**Also just another thing I have noticed, so many books I have and one of my LFS's say to do a 25/30% water change once a month. why do so many books etc say this as I dont believe any fish would be happy with this!
Untill finding this forum I had never heard of fishless cycling and I had been advised against bothering with water tests.
So anyway I spend last night cleaning out the Eheim professional filter I got second hand with the tank. I dont think the last guy had ever cleaned his filter as it was filled and I mean filled with poo! bits that I looked at thinking were soild filter material were not foam at all but solid waste. So I took bucket after bucket of water out my 50imp gal tank and cleaned all the filter material in that and reassembled adding new filter wool at the top. Now if I fill my tank tonight with tap water and de-chlorinator and get the pump running how long are we talking before adding fish? I have hunted around both my LFS's for amonia to add and cant find any, will I be okay without as I have a mature filter?
I am also going to do a test for the first time of my 50gal tonight just to see if it is all okay, will be quite interesting!
**Also just another thing I have noticed, so many books I have and one of my LFS's say to do a 25/30% water change once a month. why do so many books etc say this as I dont believe any fish would be happy with this!
How long did the filter sit without running? I'd be concerned that the bacteria were overwhelmed, or inactive due to Old Tank Syndrome--that much waste will go through the buffer quickly and can drop pH below the bacterial tolerance.
Ammonia won't be at the LFS. Check Walmart, Home Depot, a pharmacy or grocery store.
You always want to test the system. Even when pulling a sponge from one of my filters to setup a new tank, I always challenge the filter with ammonia before introducing fish. Just safer than guessing.
Newer books advocate more frequent water changes. Many older books, and many LFS employees, use old techniques, qith little understanding of the chemistry involved in the tank. So, water changes used to be a bad thing--and they weren't done monthly, sometimes not even annually. Getting people on board requires getting them to let go of the myths, and that, my friend, can be painful.
Ammonia won't be at the LFS. Check Walmart, Home Depot, a pharmacy or grocery store.
You always want to test the system. Even when pulling a sponge from one of my filters to setup a new tank, I always challenge the filter with ammonia before introducing fish. Just safer than guessing.
Newer books advocate more frequent water changes. Many older books, and many LFS employees, use old techniques, qith little understanding of the chemistry involved in the tank. So, water changes used to be a bad thing--and they weren't done monthly, sometimes not even annually. Getting people on board requires getting them to let go of the myths, and that, my friend, can be painful.
first issue, the filter is only "mature" if the bacteria has been fed and kept in water. If the Eheim sat dry or without any circulation for any period of time more than a day or two you are starting from scratch. You can jump start a cycle with filtermedia, mulm or Gravel from another tank.
Next item. look for ammonia at the grocery store not at the LFS. Generic ammonia sometimes labeled clear ammonia. When you shake it it should not foam. it should also not have many ingredients listed. Mine had ammonia water and cheleating agents nothing else.
Without a good bacteria culture, you are looking at 4-6 weeks to cycle the tank. with a good culture you are looking at 2 days to verify that it is cycled. everything else falls in between.
Water changes: pollutants build in our tanks, solid watse is converted to nitrogeneous waste, phosphates metals and any number of other things. these build up. water changes reduce them quickly. A bitrate test is a good judge of pollutant levels in a tank, because notrates are easier to test for than most other nasties we get. Water changes should be done to keep the tank below 20 ppm nitrate IMO. this will ensure low pollutant levels, and a stable tank. The percentagew and the frequency of water changes will vary from tank to tank depending on fish load and feeding habits. I change a lot of water. I also stay way below the 20 ppm mark (personal preference) and I have big messy fish that like to eat a lot. I'd start with a 30% change weekly, and test nitrates. if they stay below 20 ppm each week then you are fine. if they go higher increase volume and or Frequency.
LFS advice. Read the sticky on information and how to asses it. Remember a couple of things. LFS's arent necessarily as well informed as they should be. LFS make a living by selling you stuff. Their advice should always be considered but never banked on.
Dave
Next item. look for ammonia at the grocery store not at the LFS. Generic ammonia sometimes labeled clear ammonia. When you shake it it should not foam. it should also not have many ingredients listed. Mine had ammonia water and cheleating agents nothing else.
Without a good bacteria culture, you are looking at 4-6 weeks to cycle the tank. with a good culture you are looking at 2 days to verify that it is cycled. everything else falls in between.
Water changes: pollutants build in our tanks, solid watse is converted to nitrogeneous waste, phosphates metals and any number of other things. these build up. water changes reduce them quickly. A bitrate test is a good judge of pollutant levels in a tank, because notrates are easier to test for than most other nasties we get. Water changes should be done to keep the tank below 20 ppm nitrate IMO. this will ensure low pollutant levels, and a stable tank. The percentagew and the frequency of water changes will vary from tank to tank depending on fish load and feeding habits. I change a lot of water. I also stay way below the 20 ppm mark (personal preference) and I have big messy fish that like to eat a lot. I'd start with a 30% change weekly, and test nitrates. if they stay below 20 ppm each week then you are fine. if they go higher increase volume and or Frequency.
LFS advice. Read the sticky on information and how to asses it. Remember a couple of things. LFS's arent necessarily as well informed as they should be. LFS make a living by selling you stuff. Their advice should always be considered but never banked on.
Dave
Okay, well the filter has been sitting for a week with water in but not circulating and I have used water from my other tank which is up and running to clean the media with. I will do a lager water change on the 50 gal tonight and put that in the new tank, perhaps ring out the sponges into the new tank as well. Do you think this will be enough to get the cycle going or do you suggest adding amonia as well?
As for my LFS well the main one I use are very good in the fact they are a couple of old guys who have been fish keeping for a number of years, and its not like a big pet store where its a load of kids as staff who dont know a thing about fish. But yeah as they are old guys they have their old methods of doing things, I take on board what they say but I always tend to look on line or refer to my little library, 'Knowledge is power' and all that.
I have always done more frequent water changes as I like my tank to be pretty clean, plus Im quite heavily stocked at the mo while the other tank is being sorted. But it will be good to use tests for a more acurate guide in the future!
I like you LFS advicce on the other thread by the way.
As for my LFS well the main one I use are very good in the fact they are a couple of old guys who have been fish keeping for a number of years, and its not like a big pet store where its a load of kids as staff who dont know a thing about fish. But yeah as they are old guys they have their old methods of doing things, I take on board what they say but I always tend to look on line or refer to my little library, 'Knowledge is power' and all that.
I have always done more frequent water changes as I like my tank to be pretty clean, plus Im quite heavily stocked at the mo while the other tank is being sorted. But it will be good to use tests for a more acurate guide in the future!
I like you LFS advicce on the other thread by the way.
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Cycle has always worked magic for me. I Cycled a 60 gal. in 5 days with that stuff. I suggest not doing water changes everyday especially in new tank that size. You need to give your tank a chance to build up bacteria. I feel when you change water everyday your defeating the point by putting more amonia in the tank a losing bacteria.
