dear fish people
- Thread starter beabroca
- Start date
Hi Bea, Welcome to AC. :welcome:You have come to the right place for help. These folks are awesome. I'm still learning, but have already learned a lot.
All the advice you've received by the AC members is right on. Don't feel bad, we have all been there with water quality issues, loss of fish, mishaps due to inexperience, and such.
I have a suggestion that, so far, I haven't seen. For your water conditioner get PRIME. Made by Seachem. It's at the lfs or Petsmart, Petco, etc. I haven't seen it at WalMart.
I have read hundreds of posts here on the AC, and the consensus is GET PRIME! All the experts here recommend it. It is even cheaper than most of the other dechlorinators.
The ammonia and nitrite you will be having in your tank, until it is fully cycled, is extremely harmful to your fish.
Prime has saved my life, more accurately, my fishies lives.
It removes chlorine, chloramine, but what it does that is HUGE is detoxify ammonia and nitrite for about 24 hours, giving you breathing room to make the big water changes you will need to make.
As you test your params daily, you may find dangerous levels... maybe late at night when you're already exhausted from a days work, you test the water and find you need to make an immediate emergency water change.
An emergency dose of Prime added to the tank, per directions, will give you time to do it the next day. Giving immediate relief to the fish because it immediately detoxifies the ammonia and nitrite.
You still have to do the big water change the next day, but your fish are saved, and you can rest and do it later, within 24 hours of adding the Prime.
Every time you do your water changes you add Prime to dechlorinate, and it also is a safeguard, at least for the next 24 hours, for your fish as your parameters fluctuate until the tank is cycled.
You've been through a lot. Please don't be discouraged or feel like you've let your fish down. You have been led down the garden path by the folks at the lfs. They don't mean any harm, they are just not very knowledgeable, usually, and remember their primary concern is making sales.
These guys here.... I can't tell you how incredible they are.
I even had one of them, mzjinkzd, send me, from her own personal stash of supplies, some veggie and shrimp pellets for a snail I have that was doing poorly. She sent it at her own expense.
These folks are generous with their time and expertise. I sound like a PR person for AC, but I can't say enough.
You will be fine. Anytime you need help, just ask. No question is dumb or goofy.
Please hang in there. (you really do need either a much bigger tank, or rehome the goldies)
Also, though I hate to have to mention this, there may be a time when you know you need to put a fish out of its misery. There is a humane way to do that, that is simple and gentle. (freezing is not the way to go)
I am going to include the link for this. I have had to do this a few times, and it is a blessing to know how to do this in a kind, gentle way, with no fear or stress for the fish.
I have copied and pasted that link into a folder I have on my desktop. I have an Aquaria folder that I have filled with information these guys have posted.
Here's the euthanasia link:
http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1370852#post1370852
This is a very helpful, detailed article by one of our members on AC.
I could say "hopefully you won't have to use this information", but realistically - you will.
Again, welcome to AC!
All the advice you've received by the AC members is right on. Don't feel bad, we have all been there with water quality issues, loss of fish, mishaps due to inexperience, and such.
I have a suggestion that, so far, I haven't seen. For your water conditioner get PRIME. Made by Seachem. It's at the lfs or Petsmart, Petco, etc. I haven't seen it at WalMart.
I have read hundreds of posts here on the AC, and the consensus is GET PRIME! All the experts here recommend it. It is even cheaper than most of the other dechlorinators.
The ammonia and nitrite you will be having in your tank, until it is fully cycled, is extremely harmful to your fish.
Prime has saved my life, more accurately, my fishies lives.
It removes chlorine, chloramine, but what it does that is HUGE is detoxify ammonia and nitrite for about 24 hours, giving you breathing room to make the big water changes you will need to make.
As you test your params daily, you may find dangerous levels... maybe late at night when you're already exhausted from a days work, you test the water and find you need to make an immediate emergency water change.
An emergency dose of Prime added to the tank, per directions, will give you time to do it the next day. Giving immediate relief to the fish because it immediately detoxifies the ammonia and nitrite.
You still have to do the big water change the next day, but your fish are saved, and you can rest and do it later, within 24 hours of adding the Prime.
Every time you do your water changes you add Prime to dechlorinate, and it also is a safeguard, at least for the next 24 hours, for your fish as your parameters fluctuate until the tank is cycled.
You've been through a lot. Please don't be discouraged or feel like you've let your fish down. You have been led down the garden path by the folks at the lfs. They don't mean any harm, they are just not very knowledgeable, usually, and remember their primary concern is making sales.
These guys here.... I can't tell you how incredible they are.
I even had one of them, mzjinkzd, send me, from her own personal stash of supplies, some veggie and shrimp pellets for a snail I have that was doing poorly. She sent it at her own expense.
These folks are generous with their time and expertise. I sound like a PR person for AC, but I can't say enough.
You will be fine. Anytime you need help, just ask. No question is dumb or goofy.
Please hang in there. (you really do need either a much bigger tank, or rehome the goldies)
Also, though I hate to have to mention this, there may be a time when you know you need to put a fish out of its misery. There is a humane way to do that, that is simple and gentle. (freezing is not the way to go)
I am going to include the link for this. I have had to do this a few times, and it is a blessing to know how to do this in a kind, gentle way, with no fear or stress for the fish.
I have copied and pasted that link into a folder I have on my desktop. I have an Aquaria folder that I have filled with information these guys have posted.
Here's the euthanasia link:
http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1370852#post1370852
This is a very helpful, detailed article by one of our members on AC.
I could say "hopefully you won't have to use this information", but realistically - you will.
Again, welcome to AC!
this is the sadness post i have ever read....i do not like to think about doing that to my fish...but i guess maybe i will someday.. i hope not soon....sad thing is i HOPE AND PRAY. that nothing will happen to the water that will need the PRIME because im not in postion to afford it at this time. not in any way. i really didnt expect to spend 600 on a 20 gallon tank honestly. just thought it was a stepping stone..BTW. what size tank should i have for my four goldies?
The test strips aren't accurate. I started out with them, too. You must get a liquid test kit. API Master is a good one. There are little vials that hold your tank water. There are little bottles of specific chemicals that, when you add to the vial of tank water, will give you extremely accurate readings.
And, yes, do another water change. You need to have the ammonia below .25
Also, I hate to do this to you, but if you live near a Petsmart or Petco, go quickly and get some Prime. You could call the lfs and as if they carry it. It is a life saver.
Their suggestion to add their tankwater was no help. Squeezings from a healthy tank biofilter, however, into your biofilter can help jump start your bacterial colony that will break down the ammonia and nitrites.
The experts here on AC, though, usually advise against getting squeezings from the lfs or big chain pet stores like petsmart, etc.
If you knew someone that has a healthy cycled tank, you could get a snippet of their biofilter, or squeezings from their biofilter.
Otherwise, you will just have to let things develope as they will.
Truly, I'm worried about your fish, though. There are just too many in your tank, and they are among the messiest fish out there.
Will your fish store take some of them back? If you could afford it, and I know you've dropped a bundle already, you could go get another bigger tank. The bigger tanks are really easier to keep, too, because they are less subject to swings in parameters, once cycled.
And, yes, do another water change. You need to have the ammonia below .25
Also, I hate to do this to you, but if you live near a Petsmart or Petco, go quickly and get some Prime. You could call the lfs and as if they carry it. It is a life saver.
Their suggestion to add their tankwater was no help. Squeezings from a healthy tank biofilter, however, into your biofilter can help jump start your bacterial colony that will break down the ammonia and nitrites.
The experts here on AC, though, usually advise against getting squeezings from the lfs or big chain pet stores like petsmart, etc.
If you knew someone that has a healthy cycled tank, you could get a snippet of their biofilter, or squeezings from their biofilter.
Otherwise, you will just have to let things develope as they will.
Truly, I'm worried about your fish, though. There are just too many in your tank, and they are among the messiest fish out there.
Will your fish store take some of them back? If you could afford it, and I know you've dropped a bundle already, you could go get another bigger tank. The bigger tanks are really easier to keep, too, because they are less subject to swings in parameters, once cycled.
Where do you live, Bea, if you don't mind my asking. You don't possibly live in the Dallas Fort Worth, Tx area do you?
I could give you some squeezings from a healthy tank biofilter.
I would even share some Prime with you.
I could give you some squeezings from a healthy tank biofilter.
I would even share some Prime with you.
*sigh* I can't believe your pet store took advantage of you like that. They sold you dirty water. 
Using a dechlorinator like Prime to dechlorinate your tap water will make it safe for fish immediately.
I'm sorry to tell you this, but I completely agree with Melody that a 20 gallon tank is just too small for your goldfish. It sounds like you cannot afford a larger tank, and that is totally understandable, but then IMO your only other option is to try to return 3 of the 4 goldfish. Or, you could return all 4 and complete your cycle without fish using pure ammonia or a raw shrimp from the grocery store. Here is an article on cycling your tank that should be helpful to you:
http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=81388
*edit*
If you happen to live around the Louisville, KY area, I would also be happy to share filter media with you. You can't instantly cycle your tank this way, but you certainly can cut down on the time it takes, and the amount of stress your fish experience in the process.
Using a dechlorinator like Prime to dechlorinate your tap water will make it safe for fish immediately.I'm sorry to tell you this, but I completely agree with Melody that a 20 gallon tank is just too small for your goldfish. It sounds like you cannot afford a larger tank, and that is totally understandable, but then IMO your only other option is to try to return 3 of the 4 goldfish. Or, you could return all 4 and complete your cycle without fish using pure ammonia or a raw shrimp from the grocery store. Here is an article on cycling your tank that should be helpful to you:
http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=81388
*edit*
If you happen to live around the Louisville, KY area, I would also be happy to share filter media with you. You can't instantly cycle your tank this way, but you certainly can cut down on the time it takes, and the amount of stress your fish experience in the process.
sigh ....seriously!!! you know...i can afford 6 bucks for some of the prime and ill do a water change first thing in the morning....my taxes come back in about 10-15 days and i really dont have any plans for it...maybe my hubby and i will get a larger tank, there was a 55 gallon kit for 1000 at petsmart that matches ours and is very nice....will that do for the goldies...? and i can use this 20 gal for tropicals...or what would be good for it.....???? should i do a water change tonight? or wait until i put the prime in it?
WAIT! i bought this stuff the other day that i have to leave in the refriderator and it is called AQUA PLUS....it says that it is a tap water conditioner and it removes chlorine and choramine and neutralizes heavy metals and coats to protect and heal....
If you do not already have a dechlorinator, you cannot do a water change with tap water. The chlorine or chloramine (whichever is in your water supply) is very harmful to fish.
For what it's worth, you might want to check Craigslist or ebay for used setups. You will save a ton of money. I've been in your spot before, where you're new to the hobby and it's difficult to judge what a good price is for a tank. $1000 for a 55 gallon kit is absolutely outrageous. I've got a 55 gallon tank and stand I'd gladly sell you for $75 if you're in my area.
