Fishy Cycling a 29 Gallon Tank

Morkusmaximus

Morkusmaximus

Hobbyist
Jul 21, 2008
33
0
0
Grand Rapids, MI, USA
I currently have a 29 Gallon tank, which I have had for about a year. Unfortunately, do to my college lifestyle and apartment environment, I have never properly cycled it. It’s time for that to change.

My set up is pretty nice; I have a hang on the back filter, plenty of aeration, a quality heater, and a fluorescent light. I also have Hagen liquid testing kits, and a really nice water changing hose (a Python.) I am also in the process of saving for a CO2 pump (A Jungle CO2 Fizz Factory for those who have experience with CO2) Obviously; my tank is planted, and is stocked with very hardy fish in it.
Those details are as follows:
29 Gallon:
3 Platy's; 2 Female, 1 Male 3 Fancy Guppies: 2 Female, 1 Male 2 Ballon Mollies: 1 Female, 1 Male 3 Neon Tetras (soon to be six once I properly cycle the tank) 1 Butterfly Pleco 1 Indian Glass Fish 1 Neon Dwarf Gourami
Plants: Wisteria Jungle Vas. Sword Plant Java Moss

The problem I am having is my inexperience combined with my lack of knowledge has kept me from getting this done, so I am asking for help from the trusted members of AC. I have spent awhile looking for forums or posts with more details about fish-in cycling, but couldn’t find much very fast. I did see the forum by rbishop titled freshwater cycling, and his reference to see part 5 for in fish cycling, but I couldn’t find it. I am still pretty new to the site and have trouble using it at times. Therefore, I thought it would be easier to ask.

The current parameters are as follows:
Ammonia: NH3/NH4 = .1ppm
Nitrates: NO3 = 5ppm
Nitrites: NO2 = .1ppm
PH: 7.0
Tempature: 75 degrees F

Some question I have are:
How much water should I change at a time?
How often should I change my carbon filters? A person at my local pet store said on a monthly to bimonthly basis, but I don’t really trust their information.
Should I clean the filter itself and if so, how often?
The filter cartridges and Bio-wheel serve as bio-media themselves so I don’t need more, right?
People have said to add aquarium salt to my water to help with stress levels. How often should I do that, and what is a good ratio?
How often and how much should I feed my fish? The containers say enough for them to eat with-in two minutes two to three times a day. I have noticed that the less I feed them the more problems I have with them catching diseases (good nutrient equals healthier fish), but they grow so fast and are aggressively fat if I feed them that much.
Lastly, how do I keep from overstocking my tank? I would really like a full community take with many varieties and colors of freshwater animals. I have heard as a general rule 1 gallon to 1 inch of fish including the tail fin, is this true?

Also, I have never been able to get my Ammonia under control, any suggestions there would be very helpful.

I really appreciate the help everyone gives on this site, and know that it will only increase with the future I receive in response to this post. Thanks!
 
The thing about fishy cycling is that it happens whether you like it or not. In other words, when fish are added to any tank, they excrete waste which takes the form of ammonia (in respect of bodily waste - they also excrete hormones which need to be managed by water changes as well. You'll often hear these excretions referred to broadly as Disolved Organic Compounds).

When ammonia is produced, automatically bacteria begin to feed on it and multiply to reflect the amount of food available. These bacteria produce nitrite as a by-product of their feeding and the exact same (mechanically) process happens again, by virtue of more bacteria working on the nitrite, again multiplying to reflect the available food source and they produce nitrate. You then manage the Nitrate by water changes to keep it below 40 ppm (in fact I would shoot for below 20).

So, a cycled tank is one in which there is sufficient bacteria to copy with the excretions of the stocking in the tank. Every time you add fish you have to make sure that there isn't a spike in ammonia/nitrite due to the time taken for more bacteria to grow reflecting the increase in waste - this happens really quickly due to the exponential growth rate of bacteria, but when adding fish to a cycled tank you still need to do so in a controlled way - no more than half of the current 'bioload' in any week. i.e. if you had e.g. 10 neon tetras plus 8 corys in a cycled tank, you would add no more than 5 tetras and 4 corys, or their equivalent in a week, then monitor water to make sure that everything was caught up before adding more.

So, my first question is how long your tank has been set up and how long ago was the last fish added ? Because the cycling process started the minute you added the first fish and generally would take 8 weeks or maybe a little more in the case of a fish cycle to become stable. A stable tank should be showing no ammonia/nitrite, so if this tank had been set up for a number of months and you were getting those readings I would wonder if you were perhaps over-feeding - everything you put in there becomes ammonia including excess food.

Your questions :

How much water to change - you change enough water, when cycling to reduce ammonia and nitrite to 0, verified by testing with a good liquid drop test kit (what kit are you using ? Paper Strips are useless). You test daily, sometimes twice daily, and change whenever your ammonia/nitrite is detectable - this is why fish cycling is so slow, because you are removing the bacteria food source in order that it doesn't harm the fish, before the bacteria get a chance to eat it. Leaving it in of course will allow bacteria to develop but will kill your fish.

How often to change carbon filters - as I understand it, carbon media needs to be changed out with fresh media every four weeks or so. Note, this applies only to carbon media.

Cleaning the filter - whenever you see reduced flow and in any event once a month clean out your filter. This means squeezing out/rinsing the media in a bucket of tank water, not tap (chlorine/chloramine kills bacteria) and checking all moving parts are working for you.

Add salt to help with stress - absolutely not necessary in a freshwater aquarium. Salt does alleviate nitrite poisoning (it permits absorption of oxygen which nitrite prevents) so perhaps in an acute case it would help but you should be managing the nitrite with water changes. Salt is also useful for treating minor soft tissue injuries (it stimulates healing/production of slime-coat). It is not necessary as a constant in a freshwater tank.

Feed the fish no more than two minutes in total daily. You can skip a day a week as well. Fish will generally eat as much as they are given. If you've been feeding twice/three times a day this may explain your ammonia/nitrite reading.

1 Gallon to 1 Inch of fish is a little dangerous as a rule. Think about a 10 inch Cichlid - would you put it in a 10 Inch tank ? Far more important/subtle things to consider are :

a) compatibility - will the fish ate each other/stress each other to death
b) environmental space - do the particular fish have adequate room to swim for their species, do you have too many bottom dwellers etc.
c) social requirements - do you need a ratio of male to females to ensure happiness, are your fish schoolers ?
d) bioload - some fish are messier than others
e) filtration - is it adequate.

That's not to say tank size is not important - it is hugely so. But most people who think they are 'over-stocked' are actually inappropriately stocked having regard to the above considerations. That said, sometimes its kinda obvious that there are just too many fish in a tank. Your best bet is to seek advice from experienced hobbyists as to what would go well - post a thread up here and you will get excellent advice.

Your stocking to me looks ok insofar as bioload is concerned. You do have a lot of livebearers. Your glassfish would prefer some more of its own kind and you may even have room - perhaps if you took out one of the livebearer groups in particular. I'm no expert on these kind of tanks so wait til someone else comments.

Keeping ammonia under control - I think you might be overfeeding, if your tank is set up more than a couple of months and your test result is accurate. What kind of kit have you got (brandname ? and method - paper strips are no good).

For general maintenance, you need to change no less than 25% water weekly, unless you are very heavily planted and very lightly stocked. 25% is minimum - if it takes more to keep nitrates below 40 (or 20 if you are shooting for really happy fish) then that's what you do.

Water changes don't just remove nitrate, they take out/dilute hormones and other organic compounds produced in the tank which can, at high levels, damage the health of the fish.

Hope that helps :)
 
if your tank has been up and running for a year... it is already cycled even though you "never cycled it correctly"

no need to do it again... just keep up-to-date on maintanence and you will be fine
 
Aha...I missed that it was up for a year...well, if its showing ammonia/nitrite something is out of whack.

I suspect over-feeding.
 
Coler said:
Aha...I missed that it was up for a year...well, if its showing ammonia/nitrite something is out of whack.

I suspect over-feeding.
Click to expand...

agreed.. that could definately be the issue

unless you are doing something to send the tank into a mini cycle? dosing the tank with chlorinated water? washing the filter in sink water?
 
Thanks for all the great feed back! Yes Coler you answered all of my questions and I can't thank you enough. I was gauging my feeding off of my fish. Over feeding must be causing my problem.

To answer the question regarding the test kit, they are Hagen Liquid test kits. I had heard/read somewhere that the strips were useless so I made sure to buy those.

7itanium, I have been cleaning my equipment in the sink, obviously this is wrong. I should just clean it in a bucket of "used" aquarium water instead. That is good to know.

The Python that I mentioned above runs straight from the sink and claims that it de-chlorinates the water as it runs through the hose it's self. I believe it said due to how much air is being mixed in. Anyone know if this is true, or if it may be leading to my problem? Also, I add a de-chlorinator straight to the tank whenever I use the Python and ensure identical water temperature as well.

The same hose cycles water through the gravel pulling out waste. I am assuming this is something I want to be doing. Obviously, the more waste I remove, the less food for the bacteria.

I would give new parameters, but my Python actual has a broken part that is in route to be replaced via the mail. Without it I can't perform water changes, but it should be here some time this week.
 
Washing your filter in the sink is your problem... chlorine kills your beneficial bacteria.. and that is why your tank is un-cycling itself. Clean filters out in a bucket of used aquarium water and DO NOT clean them unless absolutely necessary (once a month at most)

as far as the python.. they are great but their claim that they "dechlorinate" the water is not exactly valid... the oxygen running through the python may gas off some of the chlorine in the water but there are many other things in water that we need to remove besides chlorine (chloramine, and heavy metals to name a couple)

what you need to do when using the python is turn your filter off prior to cleaning... once you have re-filled the tank using the python, dose the tank with a high quality water conditoner (prime is a good one... just make sure the one you are using removes chloramine, as well as chlorine)

once you have dosed the tank with conditioner (treat the entire gallonage, not just the amount of water you added) wait about 20 minutes before turning the filter back on

the reason for this is because you dont want you filter sucking up any untreated water and killing off your bacteria.


follow those steps and your tank will be back on track in no time-- I am glad I was able to get to the bottom of the problem for you and I hope you have a wonderful experience with your tank from here on out.
 
here is a bit more reguarding your other questions

Morkusmaximus said:
Some question I have are:
How much water should I change at a time?
20%-40% is an acceptable amount of water to change at a time.. do as much as you find necessary to keep nitrate levels under control

 How often should I change my carbon filters? A person at my local pet store said on a monthly to bimonthly basis, but I don’t really trust their information.
The answer to this question is contraversal in the hobby... many very good aquarists dont use carbon at all- and many people swear by it.. I personally use it only when I need to remove medicine or other toxins from my tank. Basic filter cartridges honestly dont really contain enough carbon to do much anyway. But in reguards to your question-- carbon wears out in about 2-3 weeks. If you choose to keep carbon running constantly that is... which can get very costly and isnt necessary in most tanks

Should I clean the filter itself and if so, how often?
Clean the filter out only when you notice it is starting to clog.. and use only tank water. I clean mine once a month and only if needed

The filter cartridges and Bio-wheel serve as bio-media themselves so I don’t need more, right?
In a tank that size you should be just fine with the bio-wheel as your main source of bio-media. Keep in mind that a LOT of your bacteria is stored in your substrate (gravel, sand etc) as well.

People have said to add aquarium salt to my water to help with stress levels. How often should I do that, and what is a good ratio?
This is another issue that will bring mixed opinions. I personally swear by aquarium salt and use it with every water change... just a small amount though- about half of what is directed on the box, and a little more if my fish are looking sickly or having any problems

How often and how much should I feed my fish? The containers say enough for them to eat with-in two minutes two to three times a day. I have noticed that the less I feed them the more problems I have with them catching diseases (good nutrient equals healthier fish), but they grow so fast and are aggressively fat if I feed them that much.
Feed fish 1-2 times a day... Feed them enough that they get plenty to eat- but not so much that you have leftovers floating in the tank more than 5 minutes after feeding

Lastly, how do I keep from overstocking my tank? I would really like a full community take with many varieties and colors of freshwater animals. I have heard as a general rule 1 gallon to 1 inch of fish including the tail fin, is this true?
The 1 inch per 1 gallon rule is complete BS in my optinion... would you keep a 55 inch fish in a 55g tank? lol

stocking can be tricky- as a new hobbyists it is best to run stocking ideas through experts on the forum prior to purchasing.. many people here can help with that
Also, I have never been able to get my Ammonia under control, any suggestions there would be very helpful.
Think I pretty much covered that in my last post about your filter, and your python

I really appreciate the help everyone gives on this site, and know that it will only increase with the future I receive in response to this post. Thanks!
Click to expand...
 
7itatnium and all the others thank you very much for your help! I am very excited to have a healthy tank, and not the mess I have been dealing with for about two years.... (10 gallon Summer 07 - spring 08, 29 gallon winter 08 - present)
 
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