ICH/salt/temp question

adblair

adblair

Fisher
Dec 5, 2003
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Memphis, TN
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Well, I did a stupid thing..... I bought a couple of fish from WalMart.
I have a planted 55g with three 2" clown loaches, a 2" upside down catfish, 7 dwarf gouramis ranging in size from 1" to 2", and a butterfly suckerbelly loach http://www.aquariacentral.com/articles/hillstream.shtml I brought a couple of swordtails/platys home from WalMart because they reminded me of my grandmother (she used to keep them when I was growing up). Within a couple of days the swords kicked the bucket and my clown loaches have ich. I'm not sure about the butterfly loach - if he isn't hiding in the plants, all I see is his underside. I want to treat with salt and temp. I have added 1 tbsp of salt per 5 gallons of water (the box said rounded tbsp, but I am too anal to not accurately measure anything :eek: ) and I raised the temp to 82 from the usual 79. Do I need more salt and a higher temp in order to be effective? I am concerned about raising the temp with my butterfly loach - according to the article I linked above, they prefer cooler temps. :confused: Should I move him to another tank and raise the temp - running the risk that he will go untreated?
 
The actual requirement for salt is pretty low, you should be fine as is. the temperature could be higher, mid-80sF is ideal (technically 86F), but with the tank that warm you need to be conscious of the fish's respiration - extremely rapid breathing or gasping near the surface are symptoms of low O2 in the water (warmer water cannot hold as much dissolved O2) and could be an unwanted extra stress on the fish.
 
I increased the temp to 84 last night and I just turned it up to 86 this morning. I removed the butterfly loach this morning and moved him to a cooler tank - he was suctioned at the top of the tank almost out of the water. He NEVER hangs out up there, so I was afraid he was stressed. I would REALLY hate to lose him, he is my kids' favorite. I also added a bubble stone I had lying around. It is just a small one, but maybe it will at least help. The clown loaches seem fine, 3 of the gouramis are hiding in the plants more than usual, but they LOOK fine. So far, so good, I guess. Thanks for the advice!
 
Going thru the same problem as you I added a gold saum to my 150 too impatient to quarintine and got my first case of ick. Worried about my clown loaches, I did a 60% water change, added 1 tablspn of salt per 5 gal and raised the temp to 86.
So then I read on an other site from a execllent loach keeper that salt and higher temps arnt healthy for loaches. He recommended coppersafe.
How are your loaches doing?
 
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Copper at medicinal levels is unsafe for anything, invert or vertebtrate, and you cannot get rid of it ever as it plates out on the gravel and rockwork. You read a myth. Loaches (and Loricariids, and Corydorus, and many, many other fish) should not be kept in salted water indefinitly, but for the relatively short-term treatment for Ich it does no harm.
 
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Thanks for that input. After reading your post I went to a few other sites. Theres a 50/50 debate on coppersafe. Some swear by it others feel the way you do. I think I will stick with your opinion. Although I just wasted 7.99. I'll just stick with salt and 86 degrees. My fish dont seemed stressed by the high temp. In fact they are more active than ever.
 
Hey Dave, i bet everyone heres got the skeptical aquarist site bookmarked (i do)
Click to expand...

Thanks Spartan for the endorsement. I read far more ICH articles than I care to think about, and that one just happens to say the most in one place with good references as well. OG turned me on to the skeptical aquarist right after I found this site, so credit goes to her really. IMO that site is very high quality, and seperate myth from fact and preference from truth pretty well. Most of the other stuff I link was written By RTR himself, and IMO that's about as good as it gets. I've tried to prove him wrong several times and have yet to accomplish that task. I still and probably always will question everything, and test most things, and I'm sure folks like RTR don't mind that one bit, but it doesn't take long to figure out which sources are the most trustworthy.

The only thing in the ICH article that I think might be arbitrary is how much salt is really needed. I do know from experience that 2 TSP per gallon won't harm any fish that I keep (short term of course) and Pictus is an extremely sensative fish with certain things.
The article does state that only one strand of ich has ever been verified as being able to survive 5ppm of salt, but 5ppm is far less than 2 tsp per gallon, I never figured out exactly how much salt it takes to create 5 ppm, but some rough figures I did once indicate it is way less than 1 tsp per gallon.
Dave
 
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