Muppy Project

[summer_of_41]

Connerfish,
Although it has been documented and well known for male guppies to mate with platys, the two have never produced offspring.

Here are Birthday photos! Enjoy.

They are my babies!

 

[ducatigirl]

thats awesome! didnt know it was possible.
i'd like puppies as well, platys are great.

 

[THE V]

Question:

Have you tried to back cross the male muppies back onto female guppies/mollies to generate a BC1? In most interspecific hybridization this is sometimes the most difficult part.

Sometimes due to cytoplasmic effects they will breed back onto one species but not the other. You also have to expect that the majority if not all of the fish in your tank are sterile.

Do you have any female muppy's at all? Interestingly sex determination in the Poecilia genus is variable. In some species XY codes for male in others for female. In most vertebrates as I understand it female is the default developmentally. In other words if the maleness genes are not present or deactivated the organism becomes female. Your early showers might be XY males and the late bloomers might be XX males or vice versa.

edit. Did a quick search and found this article.

http://rspb.royalsocietypublishing.org/content/276/1665/2195.full

Genetic maps are fun.

 

[ConnerFish]

No puppies Nice birthday pics though, very cute muppies

 

[Jannika]

Fascinating, in a vaguely disturbing way.

 

[summer_of_41]

THE V,

Have you tried to back cross the male muppies back onto female guppies/mollies to generate a BC1? In most interspecific hybridization this is sometimes the most difficult part.

Yes, it is expected that I will have difficulty achieving the goal of crossing the muppy back to either a guppy or molly. I can tell you that observations on my part have been made where there has been courtship between (BOTH) the muppy & female guppy and muppy female molly. This has led me to consider exploring the posibility in a future time. Because the females involved in this courtship were not virgins, I could not use them for this purpose.

Do you have any female muppy's at all? Interestingly sex determination in the Poecilia genus is variable. In some species XY codes for male in others for female. In most vertebrates as I understand it female is the default developmentally. In other words if the maleness genes are not present or deactivated the organism becomes female. Your early showers might be XY males and the late bloomers might be XX males or vice versa.

The majority of the offspring allowed to grow to adulthood were discriminately selected. An additional handful (5 or 6) were chosen at random to join them. Of this group, all have turned out male. No females have been produced from this project.

 

[THE V]

In a sample of 6 given the normal 1:1 segregation ratio for sex expression the odds of not having a female is only 8.34%. Possible but not likely.

After a little research both Poecilia sphenops (molly) and Poecilia reticulata (guppy) have a total of 46 chromosomes (n=23). This greatly increases the probability of recovering a fertile/partially fertile offspring.

Unfortunately the differential control of sex expression indicates that some of the chromosome might not be sufficiently homologous to pair up correctly during meiosis. This causes the majority if not all of the gametes to be sterile. Generally the only way to overcome this is by increasing the ploidy from 2N to 4N (like goldfish).

Most of the studies that I have seen with these hybrids have been with very few individuals. In order to get a successful cross it might tank several hundred or even thousands of hybrid males onto a equal number of females and you still might get nothing. Having a very broad genetic base for both the molly and guppy parentals might increase the odds. Also having a broad genetic base for the female molly/guppy that you attempt to cross the male hybrids onto may also help.

Fun little project you have there.

 

[Mollies]

very interesting! i have noticed my male guppies trying to mate with both female and male mollies, but the female mollies dont seem to be prego...but still very cool! lol

 

[finsNfur]

Fascinating, in a vaguely disturbing way.

LOL, my thoughts exactly! I'd like to follow this thread, and see how they continue to breed over time. The fish are certainly pretty.

 

[GollieMan]

Gollie

I believe I have succeded in breeding a gollie (male guppy x female mollie). I can't be certain it isn't pure mollie because I didn't use vergin females. I am fairly certain it is hybrid though because I've had my mollie for a while(around three months) and it has yet to give birth. I purchased a large male guppy and he often courts the mollies in the tank. There are no male mollies in the tank. The fry is grey and has a clearly mollie dorsal fin. It is very young still so I can't tell much more. I was wondering when you can tell the genders apart?