Thoughts on filters for Shell dwellers?

[rogersb]

The filtration takes place in a different place, that is all. Your sand bed, your rocks, the sides of the tank. Just because theres no physical sponge in the aquarium, doesnt mean the bacteria is gone too. a 10g tank, with a 1" sand bed has more than enough surface area to support a fully stocked aquarium. All you need is good O2 levels in the water (water circulation and surface agitation) and you're set.

this approach to biological filtration has been used for decades in the saltwater side of the hobby. I'm really not too sure as why it hasnt caught on in the freshwater side.

I was trying to get that point across and meant to say it, but forgot to come back and post that. I have a saltwater reeftank - 20g tank, 40 lbs live rock, 20 lbs live sand. The only filtration is water movement. I think the idea has not caught on in freshwater because we overstock. In general, tanks can be overstocked fresh and with water changes and extra filtration the problems can be lessened, but with salt it's very difficult to overstock and have success, thus the allowance of live sand and rock to do the filtering.

If having a filter makes you sleep better at night, throw one on, but understand you don't need it with a properly stocked tank and proper water movement. Now, on to heaters and whether they're necessary :evil_lol:

 

[yhbae]

The filtration takes place in a different place, that is all. Your sand bed, your rocks, the sides of the tank. Just because theres no physical sponge in the aquarium, doesnt mean the bacteria is gone too. a 10g tank, with a 1" sand bed has more than enough surface area to support a fully stocked aquarium. All you need is good O2 levels in the water (water circulation and surface agitation) and you're set.

this approach to biological filtration has been used for decades in the saltwater side of the hobby. I'm really not too sure as why it hasnt caught on in the freshwater side.

I'm no expert in salt water, but don't they stock at much lower level than they normally do in fresh water? That would certainly help...

 

[yhbae]

I was trying to get that point across and meant to say it, but forgot to come back and post that. I have a saltwater reeftank - 20g tank, 40 lbs live rock, 20 lbs live sand. The only filtration is water movement. I think the idea has not caught on in freshwater because we overstock. In general, tanks can be overstocked fresh and with water changes and extra filtration the problems can be lessened, but with salt it's very difficult to overstock and have success, thus the allowance of live sand and rock to do the filtering.

If having a filter makes you sleep better at night, throw one on, but understand you don't need it with a properly stocked tank and proper water movement. Now, on to heaters and whether they're necessary :evil_lol:

There you go...

I'm sure it is possible to setup a lightly stocked tank in fresh water without any active filtering and with equivalent amount of rocks, substrates and water movement. But this is a personal thing - I don't like tanks that barely contain any fish. After all, I am in this hobby to enjoy observing fishes and if there are ways to keep more of them without introducing risks to their health, I would do it. My 2c.

 

[jpappy789]

One comment I have to make is that not all FW fish enjoy as much current as the majority of SW fish do. So either you have ...

A lot of flow to make sure the bacteria have enough O2, but you risk stressing your fish

or you have a decent amount of flow from your filter that but it is providing a turn over rate that's suitable for your bacteria, while also giving them a place to grow and multiply.

I tend to lean on the last option

 

[nchoe123]

so, in my 50 breeder (36x18), I have an eheim canister (which is running at low flow because i think i need to clean it out but that's irrelevant isnt it?), and a lee's clover sponge. it says "good up to 40 gallons".

i have six adult (3m 3f) multies, and a bunch of fry. maybe ten in the 1/2" range. and many smaller.

one SAE, one clown pleco.

three zebra danios (poor man's cyprichromis!) -- until i catch them and move them elsewhere.

i have a bubble wand. the surface is covered with duckweed. no water quality problems. do you think that i could move the eheim to another tank? i guess i could try it out and see what happens and move it back if water conditions plummet-- hopefully without mass casualties.

really? i guess the bioload in here is already tiny.

 

[rogersb]

One comment I have to make is that not all FW fish enjoy as much current as the majority of SW fish do. So either you have ...

A lot of flow to make sure the bacteria have enough O2, but you risk stressing your fish

or you have a decent amount of flow from your filter that but it is providing a turn over rate that's suitable for your bacteria, while also giving them a place to grow and multiply.

I tend to lean on the last option

I don't disagree a filter is a good place for bacteria to grow. I however would like you to explain your comment. I am going to assume you think 10x an hour turn over is acceptable. This is a 10 gallon tank, so a filter of 100gph would suffice. I would say a 100gph powerhead is more than sufficient. Both provide adequate turn over of the tank water and if 100gph from a filter is not stressing out fish then how would 100gph from a powerhead? For our salt tanks I think most shoot for 20x or more per hour, but no one is suggesting that here.

Also, on the grow and multiply part, don't you agree bacteria grow and multiply on all surfaces of the tank? Have you found research that says a faster current won't allow for bacteria to grow? I have a fluval aimed directly at the front of my glass in a 75 and I still get algae in the spot all that flow hits. You will read almost anywhere that algae doesn't like flow, but it still grows there. Bacteria is a lower form of life and would certainly be growing there long before the algae.

I understand that a filter on a tank might make you sleep better, but haven't you ever read about the leiden method and wondered how it works?

 

[yhbae]

Looks like I am going to go ahead and use the 20g long tank and hold one species from Julidochromis and one of shelly species.

Again, I am looking at filtering options. I have couple of AC Mini that I could use here, or next step up is Eheim 2215 which might be an overkill even by my standard.

 

[rogersb]

if you have the AC's and want to use them, then use them. No one is going to tell you not to. If you're set against the alternatives listed here, there's nothing wrong with a good old HOB.

 

[Pittbull]

Use what you have the AC mini's should be fine as long as you keep up your weekly water changes in all.. unless you just want to buy something new thats me as well i always have an excuse to buy something hehehe your fine buddy..

 

[toddnbecka]

The 2 aquaclear mini's should be more than enough for a 20 long. Canisters are great, but not as convenient when it comes to rinsing the media when doing partial water changes.